Hey all,

 

Im having a problem with my brakes on my 2015 VRS TSI DSG estate.

 

Timeline:

 

In March I changed the front brake pads and discs for ATE discs and TRW pads. Brakes felt great, brake pedal was firm and pedal travel minimal.

 

In April I had a local Skoda dealership change my brake fluid as I didnt know how old it was. Brakes immediately felt soft and spongy and pedal travel was definitely longer. I mentioned it and they checked it again but said the pedal felt normal.

 

June I changed the rear disc and pads to ATE discs and TRW pads. Bled the brakes using a pressure bleeder but still felt rubbish. 

 

In July took it back to Skoda who offered a free brake check, said it was fine. I spoke to the mechanic and mentioned the difference in pedal feel, he had no answers and just said it felt normal.

 

Unfortunately I dont have as much faith in driving the car harder now. The brakes function but they dont instil confidence. I've not had to top up any fluid and theres no leaks so I am thinking this is purely a bleed thing. 

 

I have read through some sources that if VCDS isnt used to bleed the ABS pump air will get trapped in the system, is this likely what has happened? 

 

Unfortunately there isnt a 'local' independent garage, although there's some VAG specialists an hour away I can use but I dont fancy spending out to be no better off without understanding the issue. 

 

Any advice is appreciated,

 

Doug

Best go to a garage with a Motor Mechanic.  Not some dealerships Tech or Fitter.

  Strangely everything seems to feel right with them. It is how they roll. 

Skoda Stealership "thought process" is "Can we charge money for 'fixing' something?"

If Yes then "It needs fixed"

Else "It's perfectly normal sir."

You can bleed the system without vcds, as long as you suck no air in.

It's quite dumb if they managed to get air in there, but I wouldn't be surprised if they did.....

 

It sounds like they have, if it was fine before, so will need to run through the vcds procedure.

 

Their response of 'its normal' is what I'd expect, I've never known a main garage to give a you know what.

On 24/08/2024 at 11:38, RoddersUK said:

You can bleed the system without vcds, as long as you suck no air in.

It's quite dumb if they managed to get air in there, but I wouldn't be surprised if they did.....

 

It sounds like they have, if it was fine before, so will need to run through the vcds procedure.

 

Their response of 'its normal' is what I'd expect, I've never known a main garage to give a you know what.

 

Thanks Rodders, I have tried bleeding it and its not changed. I tried using someone else pressing the brake pedal and opening and closing the bleed nipples. This hasnt improved it. Im starting to think I just gaslighted myself into thinking it was different but its booked into an independent garage an hour away.

On 24/08/2024 at 11:38, RoddersUK said:

You can bleed the system without vcds, as long as you suck no air in.

It's quite dumb if they managed to get air in there.

 

You don't need to do the ABS Bleed Procedure to do a normal brake bleed. However if you have got air in the ABS unit then that's the only way to clear it and regain your hard pedal.

I've found many garages don't even know what you're talking about when you ask them to do an ABS Bleed diagnostic procedure. I've even been conned by one who went yeah, yeah, yeah and didn't do it as charged and the car came back still wrong, until I did it myself.

 

So if the garage did get air in the ABS, probably by letting the reservoir run dry while normal bleeding then doing a diagnostic ABS Bleed is the only way to resolve it. A normal brake bleed won't help at all.

 

On my Yeti I did that procedure by getting all bleed nipples accessable, plug on a pressure bleeder and do the process. In retrospect I only needed both fronts accessable but an earlier Skoda Roomster needed all 4, so I was prepared for whatever the PC requested.

You need a few litres of fluid but it's a straight forward process and immediately returns a hard pedal.

I normally found the symptoms before are if the engine is off then you can pump a hard high pedal, but start the engine and the pedal then sinks down a lot. A little sink is normal due to the brake servo, but with air in the ABS it sinks a lot more.

 

 

7 minutes ago, aubrey said:

 

You don't need to do the ABS Bleed Procedure to do a normal brake bleed. However if you have got air in the ABS unit then that's the only way to clear it and regain your hard pedal.

I've found many garages don't even know what you're talking about when you ask them to do an ABS Bleed diagnostic procedure. I've even been conned by one who went yeah, yeah, yeah and didn't do it as charged and the car came back still wrong, until I did it myself.

 

So if the garage did get air in the ABS, probably by letting the reservoir run dry while normal bleeding then doing a diagnostic ABS Bleed is the only way to resolve it. A normal brake bleed won't help at all.

 

On my Yeti I did that procedure by getting all bleed nipples accessable, plug on a pressure bleeder and do the process. In retrospect I only needed both fronts accessable but an earlier Skoda Roomster needed all 4, so I was prepared for whatever the PC requested.

You need a few litres of fluid but it's a straight forward process and immediately returns a hard pedal.

I normally found the symptoms before are if the engine is off then you can pump a hard high pedal, but start the engine and the pedal then sinks down a lot. A little sink is normal due to the brake servo, but with air in the ABS it sinks a lot more.

 

 

Thanks Aubrey, thats reassuring to know! 

 

Ill chat to the independent garage and hope they can get it sorted. Was the VCDS procedure easy to follow? If I had access to it Id do it myself.

Just now, Dooge said:

Was the VCDS procedure easy to follow? If I had access to it Id do it myself.

Very simple. It leads you through the process. Shows messages like Pump pedal 10 times, hold pedal down, open both front bleed valves, close both front valves etc.

VCDS on the PC leads you through the process. I just did as it requested until it said Complete. The process seems to be a repeating loop of about 10 cycles until a final Complete message. I kept glancing at the pressure bleeder to ensure pressure maintained and plenty of remaining fluid. I think I used a good 2L during the process, but put 4L in before so I knew I'd have plenty.

1 minute ago, aubrey said:

Very simple. It leads you through the process. Shows messages like Pump pedal 10 times, hold pedal down, open both front bleed valves, close both front valves etc.

VCDS on the PC leads you through the process. I just did as it requested until it said Complete. The process seems to be a repeating loop of about 10 cycles until a final Complete message. I kept glancing at the pressure bleeder to ensure pressure maintained and plenty of remaining fluid. I think I used a good 2L during the process, but put 4L in before so I knew I'd have plenty.

 

Brilliant, Ill ask around and see if there is someone who has it. 

Makes me think I have that issue as well. I handed my car over to an independent garage earlier this year to have my brakes bled because the pedal was too soft. When I got the car back it was barely any difference. As I have not owned this car since it was new I do not know how it's supposed to feel, but I have still wanted less travel than it's at now before something happens.

 

3 minutes ago, Scout-MKIII said:

Makes me think I have that issue as well. I handed my car over to an independent garage earlier this year to have my brakes bled because the pedal was too soft. When I got the car back it was barely any difference. As I have not owned this car since it was new I do not know how it's supposed to feel, but I have still wanted less travel than it's at now before something happens.

 

 

It sounds like the same. Even with worn brake pads and knackered discs my brakes felt more solid and positive than they do now. Its worth getting it looked at, a half decent independent specialist garage should be able to sort it.

All,

 

Independent garage has bled and gone through the brakes, far better than it was. Thanks again.

3 hours ago, Dooge said:

All,

 

Independent garage has bled

Did they do the ABS Bleed using a diagnostic tool ?   Was an ABS Bleed requested

2 minutes ago, aubrey said:

Did they do the ABS Bleed using a diagnostic tool ?   Was an ABS Bleed requested

I did mention it to them and queried the VCDS procedure. They said they can, but they tend to find a good bleed sorts it. I picked it up in a rush and didn't chat too much unfortunately.