hey all, net been around here for ages, so HI!!!!

my little felicity (felly 1.3 1998 mpi) has the stranges electrical problem.

eg:

new battery

full charge on house trickle charger 2 days

installed

drive for 3-4 week s normally

then dead battery

replace battery

drive normally 3-4 weeks

dead battery etc etc etc.........

what the HELL is going on here? shes been through 4 batteries on 5 months. new alternator with a constant 14.1v output (tested many many times). current draw from battery when parked and everything off =0.2a which is nothing from a 57aH battery! its even weirder because the other day we had a 400 mile drive home from holiday, and near our house decided to pop into mcdonalds. when done there turned key and "click......**** not again"

is there something which may be intermittently drawing a HELL of alot of current in an hour or so? ive pulled our the spade plug for the heated rear window so i know its not that.

any ideas people please? id prefer not to kill her off but she may have to go to the scrapheap in the sky soon!

Maplin > Automotive Current Tester try one of those in all the fuse sockets (I think the mini is the correct size for the felicia, but if you can take in a spare fuse to compare that's probably best). Should help detect any excessive current draw. The fuse number will identify the circuit and haynes will tell you what the fuse supplies hence what to check for wiring faults etc.

Ot if you have a multimeter save a little money Maplin > Car Fuse Adaptor Lead Set

I wonder if something's shorting out when wet perhaps?

Do you have any extras fitted? ie fancy stereo, alarm, ect.

Maplin > Automotive Current Tester try one of those in all the fuse sockets (I think the mini is the correct size for the felicia, but if you can take in a spare fuse to compare that's probably best)

That's an interesting tool, though i can't find any more info on it other than it's also for sale on ebay. I think it will be the maxi blade version that is needed for the feli, blade fuses for modern cars are really tiny so i think they will use the mini blade tester.

£1.49 saving on ebay Item number: 350002877360

Hi

I may be completely wrong but i had a similar problem with an old rover i had and the problem was the voltage regulator on the alternator. I was running tests and it was on the face of it putting out 14 volts but the charge was not getting back to the battery and going to earth.

This is a relatively inexpensive fix at around £25 for a regulator on the felly. I wouldnt bother getting one off a scrapped felly as often they are on the heap from the regulator doing the opposite and overcharging!!

Not that competent in electrics myself but if there is a way of checking that the current is doing what it should i would start there

Is it the battery, or maybe the starter motor just not turning,(fast enough)

maybe dodgy starter motor, solenoid, dodgy ignition/ solenoid switch.

Try tracing with a digital voltmeter with someone turning the key next time.

Try shorting starter solenoid output with a key / screwdriver next time.

Try giving the solenoid a good wack with a big wrench with someone turning the key, maybe 'sticky'.

Dodgy ignition switches are common.

Hang on a minute - current draw with everything off is 0.2A - really, nought-point-two amps? That's way the hell more than it should be - at least ten times more. OK, with a battery capacity of about 30Ah (realistically - it's notionally a 40Ah battery I think but the ratings are and always have been pretty optimistic) that should be good for 5-6 days, but for one thing if most of your journeys are short the battery may not be getting properly charged up each time, and more to the point, whatever fault is causing that much draw may sometimes be drawing more. Start disconnecting wires until it goes away and find out what's causing it!

i would go for a new alternator, i suspect that what is happening is when the engine is stopped some times the alternator stops in a certain possition where their is a short, this causes the alternator to become a motor, but besause it is stopped from turning by the belt it just sucks all the current from the battery

i had to fault find the same problem in another car - turned out to be a ridiculous in-line fuse from the alternator to battery wire. i'd be tempted to think its still an alt or wiring fault even though it is showing up good...

sorry i have forgotten ive had a digital multimeter with pc interface left connected in line with battery for 24 hours with car parked, then hooked it up to my pc to view the current draw over that time. average was 0.2a and only 1 15 second spike at 0.4a over the entire period. was also reading constant 12.3v.

yes, the current from the alternator is getting back to the battery. voltage when engine not running=12.3 when running =14.1, exactly what the fellys regulator is supposed to put out.

all the wiring looks ok

oh, and 0.2 amps is not alot - think radio standby, clock and ECU standby. ive pulled the fuses for everything else and they are all pulling what they are meant to. when a single LED=50mA then you would only need 4 LEDs for 200mA.

With a previous car (Audi 100 1985) I had a most annoying problem that resembles yours. Once and again (with weeks between) the car was completely dead in the morning and battery drained. Not even possible to jump start. In between it ran perfect, no signs of gradually decarching battery.

Took it twice to a car electrician who couldn't find anything.

The only explanation I could think of was that a relay for some reason switched to "on" - maybe the radiator fan or some other voltage-consuming thing. When battery was completely drained, the relay of course returned to "off" position and no fault could be found.

We solved this for the rest of the car's lifespan by attaching a battery cut off switch and used that when parking for more than a few hours. This meant that the clock never was right and the central locking didn't work, but it was bearable.

A carburator engine, though - with fuel injection there might be more problems if the ECU is constantly switched off?

Corroded Engine 'Earth' negative connections ?,

Ebay alternator

Ebay starter

Ebay regulator

4 weeks - that sounds like the high end of life if the battery's not getting charged. I'd suggest checking the fusable links (not fuses) in the charging circuit (presumes a Felicia has one or more in this circuit).

Don't know whether this will help - we had a similar problem with our felly, where the battery would go flat for no apparent reason. I discovered that the radio was switching on as and when it felt like it, usually after the car had been parked. I even tried disconnecting the damn thing, and then found that it would still work even though I'd removed the fuse!:confused::eek: A couple of months later, after I'd replaced the battery, the radio started working even though I'd not recoded it!! I now permanently leave the removeable control panel off the front of the radio, so it can't switch itself on.

You sure your car wasnt possessed like Christine Simvs

How about a dicky boot lamp switch? or water in the fusebox causing a short?

Ok, lets get back to the beginning here. You say that you went on a 400 mile trip, then popped into mcdonalds and it wouldnt start again.

The fact that you have just been driving about with a new battery and briefly stop should not flatten a battery. I would try getting the car running and progressively loading everything up. Try running a test now. It should still read 13-14 volts. If not then here is your problem.

If all is well here then check your earth points.

No, 0.2 amps is far more than it should be. LEDs don't draw 50mA - most of them will fail completely if you try to run them at that current. For example, the LED in a typical flashing 'alarm set' indicator will draw about 5mA and will on flash on a 10:1 or greater duty cycle, hence drawing an average of 0.5mA. Radio standby should be microamps, ECU standby hardly more. The target figure for most cars is 20mA maximum so that the battery will still be fit to start it after a month in an airport carpark.

The fault current could be going into the alternator, of course, if the regulator has packed up. Easy enough to check - just measure that current again and leave the meter in circuit while you disconnect the alternator.

200mA is NOT a lot. think of older volvo's. they always leave one side light on when parked. it was a 5w bulb. since W=A x V, then A = W/12 so 5/12=0.41 therefore a constant draw of 0.41+other car stuff from the battery. thats assuming the battery was dead on 12. if it was higher , as is likely then that consumption goes up further. my dad had one of these cars and it had a type 65 battery like my felly. that bulb would burn for well over 2 weeks on a full battery charge.

knowing how lead acid batteries work and their chemical makeup the less current you pull from them the higher the capacity of the battery becomes. they simply work out the capacity in the factories by measuring how long the battery lasts with a current pull of 40 amps then doing the necessary calculations.

and anyway, our new golf draws 0.3 amps constant and its battery was fine after a 3 week holiday, and its only a *tiny* bit bigger than felicities.

and i know of plenty of leds that draw 50mA.

anyway, back to the point.

im giving her one last go on a new type 27 70aH diesel battery. oddly, current draw when parked seems to have gone down a few mA to 180 now. it reads a constant 12.4v even when starting the car. when the engine is running reads a very constant 14.1v. hopefully this should work out better.

i'm giving her one last go on a new type 27 70aH diesel battery

You're almost certainly wasting your money. If you've replaced the battery already and the fault has recurred the chances of another new battery making it go away is down there with snowballs in hell etc. etc. The battery is the symptom, not the cause!

You're almost certainly wasting your money. If you've replaced the battery already and the fault has recurred the chances of another new battery making it go away is down there with snowballs in hell etc. etc. The battery is the symptom, not the cause!

actually i have good reason to suspect the batteries, just found out the shop i bought them from is under investigation for selling second hand parts as new :eek:

and after running it now for a week with a new alternator and handmade cabling (thats my job so trust me - im good) with a 24hr recording multimeter recording current drawn from and received at the battery the charging system is fine.

just found out the shop i bought them from is under investigation for selling second hand parts as new :eek:

:eek: hope you get it sorted either way

I had a problem with a new battery going flat - happened after a new radio was fitted - a brand new face off CD/Radio. Had the car checked and the pull on the battery with ignition off was 277ma. Changed the radio tp an old Skoda Key Card radio from a car being stripped by my local dealer and the power consumption from the battery dropped to 9ma. Not had any problems since

I had a problem with a new battery going flat - happened after a new radio was fitted - a brand new face off CD/Radio. Had the car checked and the pull on the battery with ignition off was 277ma. Changed the radio tp an old Skoda Key Card radio from a car being stripped by my local dealer and the power consumption from the battery dropped to 9ma. Not had any problems since

Radio probably did that because it thought the ignition was on all the time. In fact the switched ignition live wire in the ISO stereo loom in the Favorit and Felicia is constantly live I believe. A bodge to this it to find the switched live wire running into the fusebox (look in Haynes wiring diagrams, it will show a wire coming from the ignition switch to the fusebox and tell you which connector/wire it goes to. Take a wire off this, could be lazy and use a scotchlok, and the easy way is to take advantage of the stereo connector's ability to swap the red and yellow wires over. Sometimes these use a bullet connector, so crimp the correct connector on your wire ensuring you can plug it into the stereo end of the wire. Your stereo now has an ignition switched live.

I did this as on my stereo instructions it said it was important for the car battery life for that wire to be switched by the ignition.