After almost 5 years I've just retired my old AMD Athlon XP PC and built a nice new one.

AMD AM2 Dual core 8450e 2.5Ghz,

Gigabyte MA69GM-S2H AM2 motherboard,

2Gb Corsair TwinX DDR2 6400 RAM,

250Gb Seagate ES2 SATA II root disk,

500Gb Seagate ES2 SATA II data disk,

Gainward 8500GT 512Mb graphics card

Akasa ultra-quiet 500w ATX2.2 PSU

Running Windows Vista Ultimate 64-bit, Office 2007 Enterprise and all my other software, and compared to my old PC it runs like a rocket!

For a touch over £400 quid I'm chuffed to bits with it!

Sounds good

Got any pics of the final rig? Which case is housing all of that?

Steve

It's this one here: X-Case cube case, although I bought it from Maplins about 4 months ago as they we're doing it for only £40 (the X-Case site has a few good pics of it).

You should be so lucky. I have just finished building my XPC.

AMD 64 X2 6000

2GB of 800MHz DDR2

1TB Samsung SATA 2 HDD

Nice new Microsoft 4000 ergonomic keyboard.

Problems so far:

The driver disk for the SATA 2 setup is not available to install at setup, so running in IDE mode, even though I have updated to W2K SP4 which alledgedly supports the SATA setup. Shuttle do not have the driver available on their website and do not provide it in the box. Fanbloodytastic:mad:

Noise! The smartfan system seems to want to hold the CPU down to around 50 deg C, but it makes quite a bit of noise to do this. I opted for this system layout for the quietness, it is no quieter than the PC it replaces, noisier if I don't force it to run the CPU at 60 deg C.

Looks like to get the thing running effectively, I may end up going to Vista:thumbdwn:

May even return the XPC and look for a quieter solution.

Edited 15 July, 200817 yr by Chris GB

Ohh, sounds like a pain that. Don't Samsung do a generic driver you could use?

Ohh, sounds like a pain that. Don't Samsung do a generic driver you could use?

It is Shuttle that I need the driver for, I think it is a Promise Technology job. The main concern is the noise to be honest. Just sitting here typing, the noise is louder than my old PC which has loads of fans dotted around the case.

Seriously considering sending the Shuttle back and getting a different case. Asus mini system looks very appealing.

Chris

Chris

Nobody writes drives for W2K anymore, let alone new SATA technology. W2K also does not support AMD cool'N'quiet so your fans will run at full speed.

Install either WXP or Vista and the O/S will control the fan speeds. The system should be almost silent until you do something that heats the CPU up.

Chris

Nobody writes drives for W2K anymore, let alone new SATA technology. W2K also does not support AMD cool'N'quiet so your fans will run at full speed.

Install either WXP or Vista and the O/S will control the fan speeds. The system should be almost silent until you do something that heats the CPU up.

Shame on them, the W2K system is still the most effective piece of MS software out there from a stability / resource usage and professional end use POV. It does not stuff everything up with automated wizards, just gets on with what the user asks it to do. I have used XP a lot and feel it is more geared to looking pretty and helping amateurs get themselves into trouble than getting the job done. No experience of Vista yet, a few guys I still keep in touch with in the trade reckon it flaky, but liveable. Also, incredibly resource heavy, which will make the fans run faster.

W2K does support a variety of system fan controls, never have any problems with it normally. On the Shuttle system the fans are hardware controlled. At boot, it all runs perfectly OK, but within a few minutes it starts to ramp the fans up until it is making a hell of a noise. I can force the fans to run slower, but the CPU temperature then goes up. To get to an acceptable level of noise, the CPU runs so hot it shuts itself down in around 5 minutes, and that while doing nothing demanding with the PC.

Drivers for W2K are mentioned on the Shuttle website, but it seems not actually available for download. W2K SP4 has support for SATA I & II, but I need to integrate SP4 into the original OS install to get it to run SATA from installation.

Looks at the moment like the best bet is to return the Shuttle and get another case. Order Vista with it and face a few weeks of ironing out all the Sh!t and grief that MS seems to think we all enjoy. I have a number of very high quality and expensive peripherals for which drivers are going to be potentially difficult too. Joy oh joy.

Chris

You should be so lucky. I have just finished building my XPC.

AMD 64 X2 6000

2GB of 800MHz DDR2

1TB Samsung SATA 2 HDD

Nice new Microsoft 4000 ergonomic keyboard.

Problems so far:

The driver disk for the SATA 2 setup is not available to install at setup, so running in IDE mode, even though I have updated to W2K SP4 which alledgedly supports the SATA setup. Shuttle do not have the driver available on their website and do not provide it in the box. Fanbloodytastic:mad:

Noise! The smartfan system seems to want to hold the CPU down to around 50 deg C, but it makes quite a bit of noise to do this. I opted for this system layout for the quietness, it is no quieter than the PC it replaces, noisier if I don't force it to run the CPU at 60 deg C.

Looks like to get the thing running effectively, I may end up going to Vista:thumbdwn:

May even return the XPC and look for a quieter solution.

Have you tried the windows XP driver in 2k3?

Also if you have the dimensions and airflow of the fan then look at a high CFM, low noise fan from quiet PC and try running that in place of the fan that came with the system. Also use mounting rubbers in place of the screws or rubber washers between the fan and case.

I don't like small PC's as I think they are noisy due to having smaller fans.

For a compact case I can recommend the Antec 300 as I've just built my friend a budget PC in one.

As far as I knew cool and quiet was a hardware thing like the intel speed step. If you need software to support it then I'd be very disappointed. Sure you won't be able to control it directly, but it should be able to turn the fans and power down when it's not under heavy load.

Have you tried the windows XP driver in 2k3?

Also if you have the dimensions and airflow of the fan then look at a high CFM, low noise fan from quiet PC and try running that in place of the fan that came with the system. Also use mounting rubbers in place of the screws or rubber washers between the fan and case.

I don't like small PC's as I think they are noisy due to having smaller fans.

For a compact case I can recommend the Antec 300 as I've just built my friend a budget PC in one.

As far as I knew cool and quiet was a hardware thing like the intel speed step. If you need software to support it then I'd be very disappointed. Sure you won't be able to control it directly, but it should be able to turn the fans and power down when it's not under heavy load.

They do not supply a XP driver either. On the website, the system has some chipset drivers and the SATA driver may be incorporated in them, but these cannot be loaded until an operating system is up and running, by which time it is too late. W2K SP4 runs the storage drivers too, but because the disk is set up in IDE mode, it is impossible to install the drivers and access the HDD afterward. Te drivers have to go in as the first stage of the install.

Fan speed management is hardware controlled and is operating correctly but noisily. It is happy to run the fan at 3000 rpm and this will be noisy regardless.

I think I will try Vista as an OS, just for the sake of having things running "up to date" as it were.

Main issue is the noise. I have an XPC downstairs in SWMBO office and it runs almost silently. It is just that the 6000+ processor is making too much heat for the XPC to deal with quietly. As I ordered the setup to obtain a low noise solution, I am less than pleased. Waiting to hear what Aria are going to do about it at present. Looks like I may be lumbered:mad:

Chris

the system has some chipset drivers and the SATA driver may be incorporated in them, but these cannot be loaded until an operating system is up and running, by which time it is too late.

Are you sure you can't supply the drivers on a floppy disk as part of the installation?

They do not supply a XP driver either. On the website, the system has some chipset drivers and the SATA driver may be incorporated in them, but these cannot be loaded until an operating system is up and running, by which time it is too late. W2K SP4 runs the storage drivers too, but because the disk is set up in IDE mode, it is impossible to install the drivers and access the HDD afterward. Te drivers have to go in as the first stage of the install.

Fan speed management is hardware controlled and is operating correctly but noisily. It is happy to run the fan at 3000 rpm and this will be noisy regardless.

I think I will try Vista as an OS, just for the sake of having things running "up to date" as it were.

Main issue is the noise. I have an XPC downstairs in SWMBO office and it runs almost silently. It is just that the 6000+ processor is making too much heat for the XPC to deal with quietly. As I ordered the setup to obtain a low noise solution, I am less than pleased. Waiting to hear what Aria are going to do about it at present. Looks like I may be lumbered:mad:

Chris

What is the chipset or make/model of SATA controller as I may have a driver for the SATA device around

On the Fan front:

Quiet PC UK - Quiet Computer Fans for a Virtually Silent PC

This one is very quiet with a high CFM if you are on 80mm:

NF-R8 80mm Quiet Case Fan

Using one of those will make a big difference. All you need to do is work out which fan is making all the noise. If it's the CPU one then you should be able to just fit a better cooler which that site will sell too.

Are you sure you can't supply the drivers on a floppy disk as part of the installation?

Absolutely sure. The Chipset drivers include a storage controller, but that is installed post O/S installation and is not the basic txt.oem and data set that would be used for pre O/S install. It is a proper mess for the Windows 2000 or XP user.

My advice, want SATA 2 and a quiet fast PC? Stay away form Shuttle.

Chris

I've supplied a SATA driver to an XP install on a fair few Shuttle builds Chris, so I'm at a bit of a loss on this one. And I'm pretty sure the XP install at this point is identical to W2K as you're still at 'blue screen' stage, before it goes all pretty and GUI

Having just build a new Shuttle up for myself, I have to agree that Vista installs far more easily with SATA drives which is about time as I hated that stage of the process, having to find and plug in an FDD just for this - oh, and you really should have plumped for a Intel based build if you wanted speed and coolness. Running a Quad here and impressed overall... (sorry, that really doesn't help you much!)

Cheers,

Steve

I've supplied a SATA driver to an XP install on a fair few Shuttle builds Chris, so I'm at a bit of a loss on this one. And I'm pretty sure the XP install at this point is identical to W2K as you're still at 'blue screen' stage, before it goes all pretty and GUI

Having just build a new Shuttle up for myself, I have to agree that Vista installs far more easily with SATA drives which is about time as I hated that stage of the process, having to find and plug in an FDD just for this - oh, and you really should have plumped for a Intel based build if you wanted speed and coolness. Running a Quad here and impressed overall... (sorry, that really doesn't help you much!)

Cheers,

Steve

Hi Steve

Shuttle actually used to put the floppy in the box to make it easy. The last shuttle I built had Raid drivers on Floppy for example. Shuttles own website refers to the process of installing SATA drivers on the Shuttle machine, but no disk and no downloadable drivers:(

I assume Vista loads straight on as SATA and also handles the hard drive at full capacity without a patch?

Re Intel build, I sort of stuck with AMD even though Intel may be the better bet at the moment. If everyone buys the same, we lose the choice. I have been building systems for long enough to remember when Intel were the only PC CPU supplier and building a PC back then was very expensive as a result.

Chris

Edited 15 July, 200817 yr by Chris GB

What is the chipset or make/model of SATA controller as I may have a driver for the SATA device around

On the Fan front:

Quiet PC UK - Quiet Computer Fans for a Virtually Silent PC

This one is very quiet with a high CFM if you are on 80mm:

NF-R8 80mm Quiet Case Fan

Using one of those will make a big difference. All you need to do is work out which fan is making all the noise. If it's the CPU one then you should be able to just fit a better cooler which that site will sell too.

The inside of a Shuttle is a little different to your average PC. They basically have one very small fan on the power supply and one very big fan that draws air through the case and over the CPU heatsink before ejecting it directly out of the rear of the case. None of the warm air from the CPU cooler is emitted into the case. Strategically placed holes around the case maximise air flow across the peripherals and the whole lot should (and usually does) run very quiet. The systems main cooling fan is a lo noise high capacity specialist item already. Also it is rated up to 4000rpm+, something a lot of the other quiet fans cannot handle.

Simple fact is that the Shuttle is not really suitable for this processor. Running the 6000+, it is the noisiest PC I have ever heard. Waiting to hear from Aria at the moment. If they will take it back, I will replace with something a little different. If they will not, most likely an AMD AM2 Shuttle for sale soon. I know that given a less heat intensive processor, the system would be everything I hoped it would be.

I am quite liking the look of the cube PC in the OP. Sorry for the hijack BTW:O

Chris

Yup, sorry - I'd forgotten this wasn't Chris's original thread

One short hijack continuation - which Shuttle model is it Chris? PM if you like

Cheers,

Steve

The inside of a Shuttle is a little different to your average PC. They basically have one very small fan on the power supply and one very big fan that draws air through the case and over the CPU heatsink before ejecting it directly out of the rear of the case. None of the warm air from the CPU cooler is emitted into the case. Strategically placed holes around the case maximise air flow across the peripherals and the whole lot should (and usually does) run very quiet. The systems main cooling fan is a lo noise high capacity specialist item already. Also it is rated up to 4000rpm+, something a lot of the other quiet fans cannot handle.

Simple fact is that the Shuttle is not really suitable for this processor. Running the 6000+, it is the noisiest PC I have ever heard. Waiting to hear from Aria at the moment. If they will take it back, I will replace with something a little different. If they will not, most likely an AMD AM2 Shuttle for sale soon. I know that given a less heat intensive processor, the system would be everything I hoped it would be.

I am quite liking the look of the cube PC in the OP. Sorry for the hijack BTW:O

Chris

Hi Chris,

I understand they are different, I'm just wondering if you can replace the two standard fans with quiet versions of them. That site does them in fairly standard sizes so it might be cheaper than selling and replacing if Aria won't play nicely

Hope you get it all sorted anyway

Edited 16 July, 200817 yr by cheezemonkhai

I've certainly seen 3rd party fans on the back of Shuttles, but not changes to any of the internals. Would seem to be that the 'SmartFan' setting isn't kicking in for some reason, perhaps because of W2K but couldn't be 100% on that.

I know you're probably looking at other options by now Chris, but it's maybe worth removing the CPU, re-installing and re-applying thermal paste after cleaning the old stuff off? Just to check that the contact between processor and heatsink is 100%...

Steve

Hi Chris,

I understand they are different, I'm just wondering if you can replace the two standard fans with quiet versions of them. That site does them in fairly standard sizes so it might be cheaper than selling and replacing if Aria won't play nicely

Hope you get it all sorted anyway

The PSU fan is tiny and virtually silent. The main fan is already a specialist low noise item. I may be able to swap it for another type, but any improvement is going to be minimal. Also the Shuttle drives the fan up to 4000rpm. Many of those listed will only go 1600 or 2500 max.

Chris

I've certainly seen 3rd party fans on the back of Shuttles, but not changes to any of the internals. Would seem to be that the 'SmartFan' setting isn't kicking in for some reason, perhaps because of W2K but couldn't be 100% on that.

I know you're probably looking at other options by now Chris, but it's maybe worth removing the CPU, re-installing and re-applying thermal paste after cleaning the old stuff off? Just to check that the contact between processor and heatsink is 100%...

Steve

Hi Steve

Smart fan is working perfectly OK. When the system starts, the fan runs quietly after its initial full speed start on boot. As the heat in the system builds up over a period of maybe 10 minutes, the fan speed increases, then increases again until it is running fast, near full speed. Looking at the hardware monitoring, the system threshold is set to 46 deg C which is pretty low. I have run Athlons for years at up to 60 deg C with no reliability issues.

The partial solution it to manually control the fan to get the processor running at 57 deg or so. This means the fan is on medium duty, but this means the PC is still a little noisier than my current setup. Maybe I can find a way to change the hardware threshold temp.

Regards the heatsink mounting, the heatsink gets extremely hot and is transferring heat out well. If it were incorrectly mounted, the heatsink would be running cool even though the processor is hot. Also there is a fair bit of lag as the heatsink and cpu combination warm through. If the sink were not thermally coupled correctly, the CPU temp would shoot up very fast after boot.

I have scoured the web for info and see that one of the reviews of the Shuttle SN68SG2 quotes the same problem experienced. I may try dismounting the cooler and using my own heatsink paste, which may help a little. Having said that, I have mounted over 500 cpus over the years and never had an issue with one before.

Chris

Is it the CPU or chassis temp that is an issue.

It does sounds rather like it just can't get rid of the heat quickly enough :(

It does sounds rather like it just can't get rid of the heat quickly enough :(

Sounds more like a thread hijack to me mate!

Is it the CPU or chassis temp that is an issue.

It does sounds rather like it just can't get rid of the heat quickly enough :(

CPU is the issue, chassis temp is fine. I will look at fitting a different fan if I end up keeping the system. Just need to find a nice low noise high flow 4000rpm PWM modulated fan.

Chris

Sounds more like a thread hijack to me mate!

Sorry Simon!

Just jealous 'cos yours works so well:D

Chris