You don't need any fuel or oil additives these days the oil companys spend millions of pounds on developing oil and fuel!! don't you think if these things were required Mr Shell etc would be selling there own wholesale!!! And it will void your warranty :thumbdwn:

What you mean by adding extra detergents and then calling it super-uber-excli-ulti-power derv and selling it for a significantly higher price?

They do sell it in bulk and having used the millers products on various cars and seen the positive effect and the power sport 4 on other cars I can't see why this one won't work as well as in other cars. A double dose every so often then run on normal fuel the rest of the time is good for keeping the engine clean anyway.

Wonder if I bottle regular diesel in little expensive bottles how many people will still consider it to help.

Placebo is a terrible mind trick. If you don't believe me just give a tic-tac to the next person you hear complaining of a headache.

Without being rude a derv will only benefit from so much cetane raising, so using a double dose of millars and a supposedly cetane enhanced fuel will probably have a negative effect on the car if any.

The performance gains you attributed to the V-Power fuel and K&N on your RR at JKM above standard were no more than that seen on other TDI's. There have been plenty of PD140 around putting out in the region of 160-170bhp on supermarket or standard derv and totally stock including the air filter.

IMHO part of it is extra detergents to keep the engine cleaner and part of it is a premium marketing product with a premium price. (Have a read of the undercover economist, it's a very enlightening read).

Also IMHO if in each L of fuel you now have more detergents you have less fuel, so that means less to burn. I guess that it's a compromise as a certain level will get your engine working better as it's cleaner, but too much means less to burn.

so would I be right in thinking your balanced judgement would be to either;

1. Run ordinary Diesel with Millers DieselSport 4, or

2. Use Shell V-Power (or BP Ultimate)

3. but not V-Power with Millers (there is a certain logic to your argument as I know that running overly high Octane is pointless if the engine, particularly the ignition timing, is not set for it; but I thought based on the Compression/Ignition principal of a Diesel - more Cetane = bigger bang!).

Isn't it just better to give the car an italian tune up every now and again? Engines are designed to be self cleaning when hard arent they? I know mine only goes 20 miles a day, so once its properly run in every few weeks it will get a bit of a thrashing.

Which did a survey recently which compared 'super' and standard fuels

What we found - Petrol and diesel super fuels

so would I be right in thinking your balanced judgement would be to either;

1. Run ordinary Diesel with Millers DieselSport 4, or

2. Use Shell V-Power (or BP Ultimate)

3. but not V-Power with Millers (there is a certain logic to your argument as I know that running overly high Octane is pointless if the engine, particularly the ignition timing, is not set for it; but I thought based on the Compression/Ignition principal of a Diesel - more Cetane = bigger bang!).

Indeed my logic would be do 1 or 2 but not 3.

In dervs a higher cetane means the ignition delay and a higher cetane means a lower delay. However once you've got to a certain point it's making no difference at all, so there really is no point going too far above the fuel the engine was designed from.

I won't do option 2 myself as having tried it I found reduced fuel consumption from some fuels and while others were genuinely a but smoother they were a lot more expensive than option 1.

Option 3 seems to be a case of just throwing money away.

Posh fuel + a double dose of millers is a lot and I'd personally just run normal fuel with a double dose of the millers for a while and see what difference it makes. I doubt you'd notice any change over paying for the v-power and then adding the double dose.

Which did a survey recently which compared 'super' and standard fuels

What we found - Petrol and diesel super fuels

While I'm not a super fuels person, even I can see the gaping hole on that test. Running the dervs through a single car, and not even a supposed performance diesel (86bhp 1.5 dci megan) doesn't really give anything conclusive.

:thumbup:Also see the WHICH report on this subject: was it August or september, bearing out exactly what you said under controlled conditions!!!!!

Without being rude a derv will only benefit from so much cetane raising, so using a double dose of millars and a supposedly cetane enhanced fuel will probably have a negative effect on the car if any.

The performance gains you attributed to the V-Power fuel and K&N on your RR at JKM above standard were no more than that seen on other TDI's. There have been plenty of PD140 around putting out in the region of 160-170bhp on supermarket or standard derv and totally stock including the air filter.

IMHO part of it is extra detergents to keep the engine cleaner and part of it is a premium marketing product with a premium price. (Have a read of the undercover economist, it's a very enlightening read).

Also IMHO if in each L of fuel you now have more detergents you have less fuel, so that means less to burn. I guess that it's a compromise as a certain level will get your engine working better as it's cleaner, but too much means less to burn.

I noticed bugger all difference adding Millers. The only noticeable difference was a noxious smell from where it spilt in the boot.

Octane rating is how much of a bang or explosion the fuel make, centane rating is how long the fuel will burn. This is why all are Diesel car get better mpg or ltrs per 100 k and also why they have much more tourque than petrols as the fuel is burning most of the stroke of the piston. Diesel also contains more energy than petrol per volume!!!!

Hi all,

on Saturday I reused a small bottle of Redline fuel cleaner for Petrol cars and filled with:

- about 200cc of White spirit (also known as Stoddard solvent), not Turpentine, but petroleum derivated;

- about 200cc of Kerosene

- a small amount of 2stroke motor oil,

Then I walked to my beloved Octy and poured it in my tank, just filled with bad bad esso (exxon) diesel.

Well, in following kms the car reacted extremely well, to say the least. Before trying, after reading, I asked my brother who is a chemical engineer and he assured no damages would have been done to my engine.

For the brave... Only, if you try, please let me know.

Only for the brave.... Might have been fine in an IDI engine, but I wouldn't want to let that near PD injectors or a CR high pressure pump myself.

Like the time I put £5 of petrol in mine by mistake and topped up with diesel. Can't remember any noticeable difference.

Only for the brave.... Might have been fine in an IDI engine, but I wouldn't want to let that near PD injectors or a CR high pressure pump myself.

Must agree. Kerosene and 2-stroke oil going through a PD injector, particularly the super precision piezo injectors in the vRS seems like a recipe for disaster. :eek: :thumbdwn:

Almost the same as the time I put 5 litres of 15:1 petroil 2stroke mix (left over from kart racing) in a Ford Fiesta. Started pinking at 4,000rpm within a few miles; think I rubbished the lambda sensor. Fortunately is was a hire cars.

It happens that if I read what's e.g inside a STP injection cleaner it states kerosene and petroleum derivates... Anyway what can I say, I tried and floored as usual (I went to more than 4800 rpm, BTW). Besides right yesterday I got my occy back from regular service. Absolutely no problems (finger crossed ) and they found "her" perfect

Even if brave, in these things the % concentration with respect to the tank content is critical.

Would anybody be willing to share what's inside commercial products (STP, Millers, Arexons...)?

The whole point of v-power diesel is that it gives you more miles per tank than ordinary diesel....

No it doesn't.

Which did a survey recently which compared 'super' and standard fuels

What we found - Petrol and diesel super fuels

The result of this was ...?

Can anyone suggest a good diesel additive/cleaner? I have not used one in a while and I used to use redex but there must be something out there that is better now?

What about adding 2T oil to your tank at 1:200 ratio. Quite a popular option on other sites and is designed to reduce component wear through replacing lubricants missing in modern low sulphur diesel fuel.

Freel2.com - View topic - 2-stroke oil and diesel

Jules

The result of this was ...? (Which survey)

I don't and won't subscribe so I don't know! :rofl:

However, 5th gear (Channel 5 TV) did a rolling road test with a Citroen C4 IIRC in which V-Power and BP Ultimate gave about 5% more BHP something like 155bhp vs. 147bhp on regular diesl.

QED.

What about adding 2T oil to your tank at 1:200 ratio. Quite a popular option on other sites and is designed to reduce component wear through replacing lubricants missing in modern low sulphur diesel fuel.

Freel2.com - View topic - 2-stroke oil and diesel

Jules

I've just read the first page, of 14, in this Frel2.com thread and wow; that's some idea. I can understand the merit in it and quite tempted to try it.

I think though I will stick to using Millers DieselSport 4; but then on the other hand I may read some more of the thread and and try some 2T oil instead.

What about adding 2T oil to your tank at 1:200 ratio. Quite a popular option on other sites and is designed to reduce component wear through replacing lubricants missing in modern low sulphur diesel fuel.

Freel2.com - View topic - 2-stroke oil and diesel

Jules

Bingo!

This confirms (in english) what I experienced in msg #36.

I just experienced less noise and more smoothness. And I didn't even poured 50cc of 2stroke oil

For who cares:

- White spirit (also known as Stoddard solvent), acts as a detergent;

- Kerosene raises cetane number but it's thinner than gasoil, so...

- 2stroke oil

Ciao,

I don't and won't subscribe so I don't know! :rofl:

However, 5th gear (Channel 5 TV) did a rolling road test with a Citroen C4 IIRC in which V-Power and BP Ultimate gave about 5% more BHP something like 155bhp vs. 147bhp on regular diesl.

QED.

Different batches of derv, engine warmer, variations in the RR, air temperatures, exhaust gases in the RR garage etc all could change the results by more than 5%.

Different batches of derv, engine warmer, variations in the RR, air temperatures, exhaust gases in the RR garage etc all could change the results by more than 5%.

Your scepticism is noted; so lets keep an open mind and allow our readers to make an informed choice. Here is the 5th gear film clip;- The Show - Fifth Gear

PS> Sorry, got the figures wrong. They're 155bhp and 161bhp.

I have no doubt 2T oil will go through the PD injectors ok, but it will wreck your cat over the long term.

Your scepticism is noted; so lets keep an open mind and allow our readers to make an informed choice. Here is the 5th gear film clip;- The Show - Fifth Gear

PS> Sorry, got the figures wrong. They're 155bhp and 161bhp.

It's not just mine mate, but seriously you attribute a lot to V-Power which can't be proven to attributed to it. A few circumstantial it makes me better on the RR and a lot of it made my MPG go down and nobody noticed any difference otherwise.

Just saying they can't tout that as proof as it's entirely circumstantial and with no solid and irrefutable evidence.

I mean come on the first italian tune up could have helped more than anything else, it's not like they did lots of runs or did all of them then did them again and again to prove it wasn't that.

I'd put some money on the fact that if they had then run the car on the supermarket fuels again it would have got 161bhp too.

I mean V-Power is from gas and BP is a completely different package and not from the gas process, so the fact they both got exactly 161 shows a bit of a hole to me.

Edited 6 March, 200917 yr by cheezemonkhai