Hankering after building a kitcar

[auroan]

I'm seriously looking at building a kit car. So far I've looked at the Tiger Avon, the Zero (used to be the robin hood), and on the pricey side a Westfield.

I've got experience of assisting my ex-Brother-in-law in building/tracking daying his Avon and quite liked the kit. Does anyone have any experience in this area ?

I'm especially interested in the kit supplier parts support and kit quality. Also any tips and tricks going forward.

If I decide to go ahead I'll probably do it on bit by bit basis, so the option of buying sub kits would be handy. I'm after a track toy rather than a weekend road car.

[The Ors]

My advice would be to keep it simple. Go for a 'Seven' style car; something with simple or no doors.

The really time consuming part of any kit is the finishing touches; especially the interior. Stuff like Cobra & Lambo replicas cost a fortune if done properly & personally if building a 'Seven' style kit I would avoid anything that is a close copy of a Caterham as it seems a bit naff to me (not the Caterham, but the copying of someone else's design).

If buying the kit a module at a time make sure you've chosen a company that's going to survive and not go down the pan before you can buy all your parts.

Finally; make sure you visit the factory before parting with any hard-earned. You'll learn a lot about the professionalism of the company by seeing where they work. Most kit companies will organise collection of kits directly from the factory, usually on a fortnightly or monthly basis. Go along when other customers are collecting their kits if you can. That way you can see what you actually get.

HTH

Edited 29 June, 2010 by The Ors

[MoggyTech]

The Westfield kit is brilliant, and offers a massive choice of engines. The 900cc bike engined version is mental, and drives like it's on rails. 0-60 2.9 seconds

[auroan]

Budget wise the the westfield would be pushing it.... but there is the added benefit that quite a few people on the continent seem to have put VAG 1.8T units in them instead of the usual ford engines.

[Kenny R]

Mate at work has previously built an Mk indy with a Hyabusa engine, which was mental,and a good track car.He has just finnished building a Robin Hood,which is more "mature" and more car like,even though it has Webcon throttle bodies on it.Will ask him fo some input when back at work tommorow.

[Gizmo]

if building a 'Seven' style kit I would avoid anything that is a close copy of a Caterham as it seems a bit naff to me (not the Caterham, but the copying of someone else's design).

Is that not exactly what Caterham did? (copied the Lotus 7)

One of the big differences with the Westfield kit compared to some of the cheaper ones is that Westfield will use their own fabricated items, like wishbones and hubs etc (instead of using them from the donor car - which look much heavier and tacky IMO).

To build one comfortably and properly you will need a large (minimum 1 1/2 car width) garage, that is ideally heated and LOTS of time and patience, they are not hard to build (i have helped out on a Westfield 11 and 7) but a lot of thought about how and where to mount items can make the world of difference, there are LOTS of kit cars on the road that have just been built from scrap vehicle parts fitted straight on and no attention to detail, it really is worth getting the donor parts blasted, primed and sprayed properly - this will also increase the value and saleability when the time comes to sell it. (they ALL get sold eventually - even if it's 10/20 years later)

FWIW the Westfield 11 was sold after over 10 years of being raced (it was registered for the road but rarely used on it) for i believe a lot more money than it cost to build, this was down to it's rarity, attention to detail when it was built, long list of race class wins and obviously it's good condition.

Good luck

[auroan]

Cheers for the info so far.

Luckly I have access to my father's engineering works, so things like shot blasting, powder coating, degreasing baths etc of donar parts might be accessable on the cheap. Although I may struggle to get a complete chassis powder coated.

My only problem is that my current house only has a single width garage. Luckly I rent so I may have to move house to accomodate this project. I'd rather not rent a workshop on top as then cost really start to rack up.

[Raglits]

Is that not exactly what Caterham did? (copied the Lotus 7)

I believe Caterham actually bought the rights to the Lotus 7 so it is the original (albiet highly developed) rather than a copy...

[scotlad]

Hi Auroan

I'm a past vRs man and as mentioned by KennyRussell have built 2 kit cars. There are a lot more kits available than those that have been mentioned, cost being the obvious factor.

First of all are you wanting to build a track or road car? If its for mostly track use as you mentioned, i would highly recommend building a bike engined car (bec) as they are far and away the more exciting drive- 12000 rpm red line, 6 speed sequencial gearbox, barely believable acceleration....

If you want it more for road, a car engine is probably more suitable as less 'raw' than a bec. All the following manufacturers are well known, have been around a while and do '7' style kits that will take a bike or car engine.

MK Indy

MNR Vortex

Dax Rush

Westfield

GBS/Robin Hood zero

Tiger

Haynes Roadster (can be built totally from scratch or from a kit)

There are still more manufacturers but i cant think of them just now.

I've built an MK Indy and a Robin Hood 2b. The Indy was actually a fairly easy build. I fitted a Honda Fireblade engine (893cc) to it and it went like a rocket. With weight of 450KG and 130 horsepower, it would do 13.3s 1/4 miles at Crail drag strip. Most modern becs are fitted with Hayabusa, Kawa zx12 or Yamaha R1 engines all over 180hp. You can guess how fast they go!!!

I would personnaly would wholesomely recommend MK kits as they are reasonably priced and the components well made. They also hold their value well if built to a good standard- i built my MK in 2004 for 6K, sold to a mate 3 years later for £6900, who then sold it a year later for £7200!!!

If you want more information, pop on to www.locostbuilders.co.uk where they are an extremely friendly and helpful bunch and will point you in the right direction. As usual with forums, a quick search on there will answer most of the questions you might have as all of the guys (and gals) have been there before!

Hope this helps

Graham

Edited 1 July, 2010 by scotlad

[auroan]

Excellent, many thanks Graham, just the info I was after. :thumbup:

[scotlad]

Excellent, many thanks Graham, just the info I was after. :thumbup:

You're most welcome.

My best advice is check on locostbuilders for someone near you with a bec. Most of us love showing off and if you can blag a shot in one, i guarantee you wont want to build anything else. A bike engined car will redefine your understanding of speed- they are blindingly quick- 4 to 5 secs 0-60 or faster on most lighter ones- traction of the line is the big problem because they are so light. Any more questions just ask and i'll try and answer as best i can.

Cheers

Graham

Edit to say i've just noticed you're in Yorkshire- pop down to MK at Maltby on a Saturday morning and you'll get a great cuppa, a look at the factory and a shot in their bec Indy demonstrator. When i was looking to buy my MK kit, they just gave me the keys to their demo car and let me charge off up the road in it with my mate!! They're a great bunch of lads passionate about what they do.

Edited 1 July, 2010 by scotlad

[auroan]

Hmmmmm... sounds like a plan. Hope the weather holds up for saturday then.

[dfullb]

Here is my Brothers Westie which we fitted a Fireblade engine into & My Seven which we put a Ford Zetec into with twin 40's

Both were pretty awesome machines in their own rights ...

Dean

Edited 1 July, 2010 by dfullb

[gallego1968]

Back in the early 90's i built a Dutton Pheaton 3 which was brilliant, it had Mk1 Ford Capri GT running gear. Easy to build but i found the wireing difficult.

[auroan]

Well the project has kinda started. One halfrauds mega tool chest and cabinet now install in garage.

[dfullb]

Well the project has kinda started. One halfrauds mega tool chest and cabinet now install in garage.

That is it now then, No Stopping you

Trouble is as the build progress's you become more & more a garage hermit It is amazing how many hours you can put in & until silly times of the morning, then turning up for work looking like Sh!te only wanting to get home to progress ....

My Collegues at work thought that me & the Mrs had split

Dean

[AlphaPapa]

What about something like a locost? Its basically a seven (7) style car but as the name suggests is rather low cost.

Look at Luego and Procomp for parts and chassis stuff. IIRC all based around escort and cortina parts but will take all sorts of engines. I have been in a locost race car with a 1300 ford x flow developing around 90 bhp and it was, well it certainly felt extremely rapid.

[auroan]

What about something like a locost? Its basically a seven (7) style car but as the name suggests is rather low cost.

Are they (company) going anymore? That’s one on the guys I was trying to find as a manufacturer, but they seem to have disappeared. I'm off to greatbritishmotorcars and mksport factories to have a look round in the near future.

It's defo going to be a seven style car that I go for.

[skomaz]

Have a friend with a 13B rotary engined westie - not many of them about if you want something different - with 180bhp and a straight through exhaust it's quick and LOUD!

[AlphaPapa]

Are they (company) going anymore? That’s one on the guys I was trying to find as a manufacturer, but they seem to have disappeared. I'm off to greatbritishmotorcars and mksport factories to have a look round in the near future.

It's defo going to be a seven style car that I go for.

All of the racing locosts i have ever come across either have a homemade chassis, luego or procomp. I dont think there ever was a company called locost?

I know luego went bust a few years back but were purchased by someone else.

[scotlad]

'Locost' refers to a seven-esque style car designed by Ron Champion with drawings in his book 'how to build a sportscar for £250 and race it!' http://www.amazon.co.uk/Build-Your-Sports-Little-Pounds/dp/1859606369/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1278414484&sr=8-3

It was designed to be built from scratch by amateur builders and was obviously a not-very-thinly disguised Lotus 7 copy. Various different companies have made locost chassis including MK, Luego, and others still do (Procomp LA Gold). There is still a very active race scene going for locosts using 1300 xflow engines.

As the locost used various parts from old cars including mark 2 escorts, parts are getting scarce, so Chris Gibbs launched a new book in the same mold as the original http://www.amazon.co.uk/Build-Your-Own-Sports-Car/dp/1844253910/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1278414988&sr=1-1 but using sierra donor parts, creating a car which is almost the same as an MK Indy. The Haynes Roadster as its known, has drawings in the book to build it from scratch, or there are various companies will supply you with chassis, wishbone and grp body kits for a sum of money. The roadster also has its own forum dedicated to the car with regular input fron Chris Gibbs himself (http://www.haynes.co.uk/forums/index.php)

I've seen the original Haynes Roadster that starred in the book in the flesh and it was a great example of what can be achieved on a budget.

Good luck in your choice Auroan- just dont rush into anything!

Ps regarding the Greatbritishsportscars zero, a lot of info and opinions can be got from the robin hood forum at http://www.rhocar.org/index.php?act=idx

Once again they are a very knowledgable bunch with a passion for their cars and are always willing to pass on their knowledge to newbies.

Cheers

Graham

Edited 6 July, 2010 by scotlad

[auroan]

bum.... just missed out on a sierra donor car by £10 on the egay :(

So as you can guess I'm going the sierra donor route. However I haven't decided on the kit makers yet.... but it gives me plenty of time to get the donor car and strip it and recon all the parts I'd need.

[mikey vrs]

I dont know if this is of any use to you but on a website that i use "car mechanics magazine" somebody is selling a Robin hood 2B Kit car for £3000. it has all the parts inc all sierra donor parts,it just needs building!

[auroan]

Unfortunately my budget is running on a month by month basis so a one hit outlay of £3k is out of the question at the mo.

[daverapid]

My kit car...lots of fun to build, and even more fun to drive.