New Passat Vs Superb Co2 Figures

[Gavn Tobin]

Hello,

Just looking at the CO2 figures for the new Passat and the Superb. Only looked at the diesels and for every configuration the new Passat absolutely craps on the Superb.

For example I drive a 170CR Superb DSG weighs 1594kg and has a CO2 figure of 159g this puts it in the Irish Band D tax and VRT bracket which means annual tax of €447 and a VRT rate on initial purchase of 24%

New Passat 170CR DSG weighs 1591kg and has a CO2 figure of 139g this puts it in the Irish Band B tax and VRT bracket which means annual tax of €156 and a VRT rate on initial purchase of 16%

How are Volkswagen improving the economy of the new Passat with the same engine as the Superb is it start/stop technology or something else.

And when if ever will Skodas get the better fuel consumption?

Regards,

GT

Also the Passat has a bigger fuel tank by 10 litres, have thought from day 1 Superb tank was too small.

[chrisw880]

I believe Stop/Start can bring down emissions on new cars slightly

[dstev2000]

Oh come on, the Passat has got to have SOMETHING over the Superb. Looks like its just the CO2 figures then

Its probably a combination of:

Start/stop

Tyre size and type

Gear ratios

Aerodynamics

Regenerative braking

I'll stick with the big Czech thanks Try and spec a new Passat up to a CR170 Elegance Superb and see how much it comes to.

Stuff like Start/Stop will be added in due course but naturally VW want a slice of the cake first. There are revisions to various Skoda manuals describing Start/Stop systems.

[chrisw880]

I'll stick with the big Czech thanks Try and spec a new Passat up to a CR170 Elegance Superb and see how much it comes to..

+1

A family friend is changing from a VW Passat 2.0 TDi CR170 DSG Estate (unsure on trim level, either Highline or Sport) to a Superb 2.0 TDi CR170 DSG Elegance Estate (she's getting it in March), and I believe she is saving quite a bit of money from changing

[BilboBaggins]

All new Passat models have the kit fitted to Superb Greenline II. ie energy recouperation, lower suspension etc.

Comparing Suberb 1.6CR and Greenline II, which also uses 1.6CR engine advantage is about 15-20 on CO2 figure and about 10-15% improvement in fuel consumption on combined cycle (56mppg to 62mpg)

What is puzzling me is:

1. Why market a 1.6 CR S and SE, with Greenline with same engine but efficiency and CO2 gains for all three trims, price premium for S and SE Greenline II is less than £400- tax and fuel will cover this comfortably in year one of ownershiip

2. If VW can fit the extra kit as standard to Passat, then why not across whole group-reductions in average CO2 across fleet (European legislative requirement) would be huge- looking at brochures on Skoda Auto site there is a an inbetween model available that uses Greenline technology, but isnt the whole package. For some reason this isnt offered in UK

[Steve vRS]

It won't make much of a difference to a retail buyer but a 2.0TDi SE Passat is about £100 per month company car tax whilst the 2.0TDi SE Superb is £150ish per month. Similar levels of kit - maybe the Superb edges it...

Steve

[BilboBaggins]

It won't make much of a difference to a retail buyer but a 2.0TDi SE Passat is about £100 per month company car tax whilst the 2.0TDi SE Superb is £150ish per month. Similar levels of kit - maybe the Superb edges it...

Steve

Hence my comments about 1.6CR and 1.6 CR Greenline Superbs- for higher rate tax payer 1.6CR S hatch is 18% BIK resulting in monthly tax of £104, while Greenline version of same is 13% BIK with tax bill of £82 per month= added to road tax and fuel savings maked Greenline a cheap option for company users

[erniem]

No highline spec as yet?

The main advantage seems to be the engine choice, I guess VW will make Skoda wait for these to get more passat sales through.

Addon's still push the cost too far in excess of the Superb

[Andyrep]

on the subject of the 2.0 cr engine

why do we and vw get the 138bhp but audi and seat get the 143bhp version not a lot granted but there must be a diffrence ?

I strongly belive all these main line car makers are playing games with us, if you look at the moment (at uk Market) then the main differential for 13%BIK is 119g/km but this is only valid until April 6th then it drops to 114g/km so you order a car on the119 scale and you only get 3 months benifit until it leaps up to 18% BIK then about 2 months later makers launch 114 cars and then a year later 109 etc the technology exists but they are playing games because as a company car driver one the main considerations has to be CO2 and not because we all want to be green but because it costs us were it hurts in the pocket !

i suppose we could all get Prius's but then life's to short !

Andy

[simonsheil]

I have a passat CC on order and as stated the diesel are now fitted with "Bluemotion Tech"; start/stop, regenerative brakeing, low fricion drive shafts.

I'm sure the engines will filter across, they have only just come on the Passat CC as I originally ordered based on the original engine.

[PowerMalc]

What is puzzling me is:

1. Why market a 1.6 CR S and SE, with Greenline with same engine but efficiency and CO2 gains for all three trims, price premium for S and SE Greenline II is less than £400- tax and fuel will cover this comfortably in year one of ownershiip

It might be because of looks, the 1.6CR Greenline SE and Elegance come with 16" wheels not the normal 17 or 18's

[jonnb]

I have to say, that I too would rather have the superb over the passat, and back in 2010, when I purchased my combi elegance spec, I priced the same in a passat, and found that I saved just shy of €7,500, when trying to spec the passat to the same level as my car.

[Andyrep]

Hi Just a bit of info for you

to spec a passat estate 140 se up to the same or similar spec to a Superb 140 elegance means adding 8k worth of extras to the base price of 23k it actually works out at over £31k !! no thats A6 5 series money !

Andy

[Steve vRS]

To be fair, shouldn't the starting point be a Passat Sport rather than an SE if comparing an Elegance. I was looking at SE versions of both cars.

The Passat had as standard over the Superb:-

DAB Radio, MDI, Electric Seats, bluetooth telephone , Full size alloy spare, Lower CO2

The Superb had

Bolero type stereo, alcantara seats, boot storage system, fog lights, rear parking sensors

Not much in it!

Steve

Edited 6 January, 2011 by Steve vRS

[simonsheil]

The passat CC is actually fairly good value althought they have added about £800 (some down to the bluemotion) over vat in the Januray price review. The GT comes with nappa leather, adaptive suspension and sat nav as standard, as well as a full size alloy spare. In addition the options are quite reasonable, adaptice cruise, climate seats etc.

I'm not pretending its as good a value as the Superb and I was tempted, however, i wanted some toys that you cant have on Skoda and its not that much more.

[Andyrep]

To be fair, shouldn't the starting point be a Passat Sport rather than an SE if comparing an Elegance. I was looking at SE versions of both cars.

The Passat had as standard over the Superb:-

DAB Radio, MDI, Electric Seats, bluetooth telephone , Full size alloy spare, Lower CO2

The Superb had

Bolero type stereo, alcantara seats, boot storage system, fog lights, rear parking sensors

Not much in it!

Steve

Sorry Steve

but i think your comparing the Superb se to the passat sport

i was comparing the elegance to the se or sport and then adding the bits to bring it up to the same spec as a UK spec elegance either way both the se and sport passat top out over £31k

basically for a basic se or sport pasat money you can have a full spec Superb Elegance estate

Andy

[Steve vRS]

I'm not. I am definitely looking at the Passat SE.

Steve

[Superbjoser]

Hi Briskodians!

When I tried to build an image Passat (comparable to my car) I have to add some £5k on my price tag to get there. It have some interesting features like silent windows an so on but that would add even more on the difference. I have to conclude with Andy here. Naked Passat or full spec Superb? Your choice...

/Superbjoser

[dstev2000]

I tinkered with the VW site and I started off with a Passat Sport Estate CR170 to make it as fair as possible.

For a start, the Passat Sport comes with the Amundsen sat nav system which is vastly inferior to the columbus system found on the Superb Elegance Estate CR170 (which I used for comparison).

Once you add the bits and bobs to the Passat it easily breaches the 31k mark, discounts and brokers etc aren't factored in on this occasion. Despite that, the Superb is still excellent VFM.

The S and SE Passats will no doubt be more competitive as that is classic rep territory.

A few plus points for the Passat: a full size alloy spare and an auto dimming bloody mirror!

When people say the lack of a spare is due to weight saving thus lowering CO2 emissions, rest assured it is crap as the BlueMotion Passat has one on board and boasts superior CO2 levels.

Despite all of this price comparison nonsense, we all know people will jump all over the Passat and shun the - IMO superior - Skoda Superb for one simple reason..............

The badge.................

[mannyo]

The thing that would annoy me would be start/stop technology and that would be the first thing I would get bypassed. In my case it would not work and would flatten the battery completely over the short runs I now drive. Each restart takes about 5-10 miles of running to replenish the battery, imagine that in short distance and congested road driving like we have in the UK and your battery will soon be flat.

My superb also has a warm start problem, which is currently unsolved but I have not really got around to getting it fixed yet. This means my superb takes around 10 seconds to start when warm or at normal operating temp, sometimes it needs to goes on the starter but it does always start. If this were to happen with stop/start and the lights went green, you would still be sitting there when all the other traffic has long since started moving.

Give me the Superb any day, I drove a passat and was not overly impressed with the way things felt on the inside. The passat is also shorter and has less interior space than the superb, especially in the back. The Superb hatch can be a saloon or hatchback, meaning you can get bigger things into the back of the Superb and the list goes on.

[Sw1]

The thing that would annoy me would be start/stop technology and that would be the first thing I would get bypassed. In my case it would not work and would flatten the battery completely over the short runs I now drive. Each restart takes about 5-10 miles of running to replenish the battery, imagine that in short distance and congested road driving like we have in the UK and your battery will soon be flat.

My superb also has a warm start problem, which is currently unsolved but I have not really got around to getting it fixed yet. This means my superb takes around 10 seconds to start when warm or at normal operating temp, sometimes it needs to goes on the starter but it does always start. If this were to happen with stop/start and the lights went green, you would still be sitting there when all the other traffic has long since started moving.

Give me the Superb any day, I drove a passat and was not overly impressed with the way things felt on the inside. The passat is also shorter and has less interior space than the superb, especially in the back. The Superb hatch can be a saloon or hatchback, meaning you can get bigger things into the back of the Superb and the list goes on.

I have been running the start/stop technology on my BMW 1 series coupe for the last 3 years, it's great when you get used to it. I have to admit I will really miss it. The BMW version will only kick in when the temp is above 3 degrees, it also won't flatten the battery. If the car hasn't been running for long or it's not charged it doesn't turn off the engine when you stop.

I think it's great and it's a shame my Superb won't have this when it arrives.

Agreed on the Passat though, what a rip off. I would be going the Audi/BMW or even consider a Jag if it were costing me that money. With the Skoda though I believe I have found a car with no compromise which also has a very good price tag.

[lfc958]

All this comparison between the marques is all well & good, but you have to take into consideration the target market.

Audi want are premium target.

VW want middle manager money

SEAT want sport end of the market

Skoda are targeted at lower end of the market ( value ).

The problem arises as VAG senior managers said at previous meeting ( & posted here ) that customers are deserting VW for Skoda as they are starting to feel that VW is not value for money, so these middle managers & fleet buyers are starting to look at where they spend their money.

The rumoured outcome may look like some of the current standard features will get removed & become options ( leaving current base price the same).

I dont understand why VAG dont look at the failings of VW and address this rather than disadvantage another brand within the group, also by what has been pointed out, even loading options back on looks like it will still bring the price of the Superb to less than the Passat. Sounds like logic fail @ board level here

[Superbalicious]

Sounds like logic fail @ board level here

Hardly surprising though, is it

[BilboBaggins]

Decided to look at S level trim for both to see what it would have cost to spec a Passat like my Superb.

I have specced

Cruise control- Passat comes with some gadget to check your level of awareness

Rear parking sensors- only option on Passat is front and rear sensors at inflated price

Heated seats all round- not available on Passat

Tunnel lights also need to be ordered as option pack on Passat

For fair comparison Greenline II S Superb would list at £19,6K. Passat is over £22k

I had to place order through company leasing scheme before Greenline II was ordered so mine would be about £400 cheaper than Greenline, but with penalties on BIK, CO2 and fuel consumption. However over the expected life of the car with me (3 years and 60k miles) Superb S will still cost less, and has more space and larger boot

[Supurbia]

They've done something to the Passat, last time I looked the fuel figures were 25% better than the B6 on average, how true they are is another thing, but a 2.0 CR with DSG was quoted urban at 44mpg.