http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/news/8407964/Parking-permit-surcharge-to-force-diesel-cars-off-the-roads.html#

Parking permit surcharge to force diesel cars off the roads

Owners of diesel cars face higher charges for annual parking permits in major cities amid growing concern over their effect on air quality

:popcorn:

Edited 26 March, 201115 yr by 'daiking'

Just another con to rip off the british public. I bet they will try and raise the yearly road tax now for diesels!

The pollutants released by diesel have been known about for years. Even modern diesels release more PM10s' than petrol engines, as well as other pollutants.

Back when there was debate over whether cat's should be introduced on petrols, I remember how the science was overlooked in favour of appeasing public opinion over lead etc.

Oh, ok, I'm a child killer am I..... :wonder:

FOOK OFF

Lets all buy a petrol and have no money to feed our kids then!

So my DPF equipped 2.0TDI would have the same surcharge as a clapped out 90's Escort diesel, great!

That is stupid. We already pay different amounts due to emissions, it's the thing called Road Tax. Diesels pay more to fill up with fuel too.

Shifty's old Furby really could kill children............and adults! It threw large soot briquettes out the exhaust and they were usually travelling at a very high speed too

Petrols produce 20% more CO2 so maybe they are the real killers.

Article is a joke.

What a joke.

And what about my Pug that's running on veg oil then?

CO2 Neutral and doesn't really smoke much... less than some petrol cars I've seen!

Phil

We only pay more for diesel cos it's winter, oil is used for heating more. Once summer returns they'll level out again.

Petrols produce 20% more CO2 so maybe they are the real killers.

Article is a joke.

Think you're kinda missing the the point.

The particular pollutant the articule is on about are PM10's - particule matter < 10nm is size. This is the sort chucked out by diesels.

PM10s' are heavily linked to lung cancer and other lung diseases.

10 years ago there where concerned about link between diesel vehicles and respiritory disease, but was considered not of major concern yet because the majority of diesel vehicles where to be found on major roads. The vast increase in diesels does mean more release of PM10s in urban centres. Its simple fact.

Does this justifies councils putting parking prices up for diesles ? Course not.

The way I read it...

Petrols currently pay more for the same parking permits as they produce more CO2 and these parking permits are usually linked to CO2.

So all this will do is balance the Petrol-Diesel imbalance where it's cheaper to park a diesel car of the same size due to it's lower CO2 emmissions.

Don't see the problem, but it's worded quite well to sound worse than it is.

It doesn't compare the permit price for a 2 litre petrol Mondeo to the 2 litre diesel Modeo they did mention for example.

I think you'll find they'll end up about the same.

Edit:

Yes, just checked.

Petrol Mondeo pays £10 to £20 more to park than a deisel Mondeo.

The article says deisels will get a £15 surcharge in Kensington and Chelsea.

Again, can't see the problem.

Another interesting point...

Expect more of this by the way.

I was at a meeting with Camden Council a few weeks ago and the particulate matter levels on some of the main roads are double the safe maximum limit imposed by the EU.

So if they are not lowered soon that's fines from the EU, coming out of your tax money that should be going to local authorities.

So all this will do is balance the Petrol-Diesel imbalance ...

put like that, seems justifiable tbh

What would be fair, would be to lower the price of petrol permits

Think you're kinda missing the the point.

The particular pollutant the articule is on about are PM10's - particule matter < 10nm is size. This is the sort chucked out by diesels.

PM10s' are heavily linked to lung cancer and other lung diseases.

Not really, as DPF's trap all pm10's and PM2.5's so the pollution of these harmful particles is minimal for DPF equipped diesels.

If you are parked, then surely your car isn't emmiting any paritcles, NOx, CO or CO2

If you are parked, then surely your car isn't emmiting any paritcles, NOx, CO or CO2

Or if you're being towed.

Perhaps they'd like us to take the train or grab a taxi!!

Oh hold on they use diesel as well .

DPF

DPF

It's the thing that traps and burns off all that black crap that older diesels chuck out the back of the exhaust.

What % of diesels have these fitted ?

The levels PM10s' being recorded at the roadside are rising, so it can't be that great.

ps

Isn't DPF delete as favorite mod ? (presumably like a de-cat)

Quite simply ALL fossil fuels and gases have the world-wide kill factor. !!

It's taking lots of time to realise this, when ALL the oil fields are dry,

will be the human inhabitants survival time new beginning, living in the dark ages again.

Today humans control the world, the dinosaurs had there's, so what little bug will survive us and take over from us. SIGH !!!

Humans don't control the world. My wife does! (She told me so).

What % of diesels have these fitted ?

The levels PM10s' being recorded at the roadside are rising, so it can't be that great.

ps

Isn't DPF delete as favorite mod ? (presumably like a de-cat)

Thats irrelevant - they are levying the charge on all diesels. This is not fair as it says DPF on my logbook so if they are worried about the Pm10 particles then perhaps then should make the fee a little fairer like exempting DPF equipped cars. Can one mention Black Cab's, Buses and trains that all run on diesel and iirc a couple of years ago a study was done and the average bus full of passengers produced more C02 (and more PM-10 judging by the amount of crap they chuck out around by me) than if every person on that bus was in an average size car.

Thats irrelevant - they are levying the charge on all diesels. This is not fair as it says DPF on my logbook so if they are worried about the Pm10 particles then perhaps then should make the fee a little fairer like exempting DPF equipped cars. Can one mention Black Cab's, Buses and trains that all run on diesel and iirc a couple of years ago a study was done and the average bus full of passengers produced more C02 (and more PM-10 judging by the amount of crap they chuck out around by me) than if every person on that bus was in an average size car.

Whether or not your car has a DPF doesn't really matter as long as it meets the Euro V or VI standards (0.005 or 0.0025 g/km respectively) - significantly less than the limits 10 years ago. What does make this surcharge rediculous is that the current limits for particulate matter (Euro V) is the same for diesel and petrol cars. When the standards move on to Euro VI in 2014 the standards will be even stricter for diesel but will stay the same for petrol. So people driving diesel cars will be charged extra for more fuel efficient cars that chuck out less CO₂ and less particulate matter! :wonder:

Using london as an example, the most poluting vehicles i see are the old buses and taxis. I bet none of these new fees are being put back into getting less poluting modern buses.

London's buses are the newest in the country. They are replaced on average every 5-7 years. The oldest buses have particulate traps and other crap retro fitted to help reduce the emissions. The newest run ad blue and other systems. London is a low emission zone so anything that polluting is paying mega money for it.

Matt