Hi,

I am hoping I am posting in the correct place and someone can help me.

I bought my Fabia Estate DTI 1.4 in October 2009. In August 2010 (10 months later) I had a problem getting into gear. I took car to Skoda who said there wasn't any problem and I thought it had been a one off. Two days later it happened again, worse, I got Skoda assist who took me into dealership. The short story is that they said it was a clutch and I wasn't covered (9000) miles.

I had a lot of doubts as the problem had disappeared and therefore was intermittent

I have driven for 20 years( my last car for over 100,000 miles) never had a clutch problem, I don't ride the clutch

There was no warning or clutch slipping and garage couldn't even find a problem in the days inbetween

When we asked to see the clutch the service manager admitted that it didn't look worn but it did have some slight blueness which showed it had been overheating ( I reckon that happened after the fault occured)

The service manager said that, as there was no other obvious fault, Skoda would not pay.

It cost me £600. I argued at the time that there was obviously a fault and what if it happened again. I was told it was so unusual it would not happen again. Off the record the service manager said that there had to have been a problem but there was no way to prove it so I had to pay.

It has just happened again. 14 months later and 15,000 miles and the problem has reoccurred. Exactly the same onset as before.

I just had an independent garage look at it as I don't trust my dealership. They thought it could be the gearbox linkage but my husband (a motorbike mechanic)said it can't be as when the transmission is off the gearbox is as smooth as can be, the fault is only evident when the engine is turning.

Does anyone have any advice. I can't believe this is happening again. I will take the car to the dealership tomorrow but full expect as little help as last time.

I will have to go to trading standards this time but honestly don't know what to do.

Thank you

And how does the clutch feel, noticed any changes in its travel?

I assume skoda checked the flywheel?

Go back to the dealer and ask them to this time correctly diagnose the original fault, refund you your £600 and fix it for free as a gesture of goodwill for fobbing you off 14 months ago.

Clutch faults are always a nightmare as it is so easy to blame the driver and put it down to fair wear and tear or neglect.

Be firm but fair and importantly keep calm but make it perfectly clear you aren't happy, don't appreciate being lied to and want it fixing properly!

And how does the clutch feel, noticed any changes in its travel?

I assume skoda checked the flywheel?

Hi,

Thanks for your reply.

There has been absolutely no change in the clutch feeling either time, it's only in getting into gear even that was extremely intermittent (bearing in mind I had the dealership check out my car the first time and they could not feel anything wrong with the drive)

The flywheel was fine they said.

It really doesn't add up, does it?

Hi,

First of all welcome to the forum.

I completly agree with you that 2 clutch failures in 15,000 is totally unaccecptable, their must be a fault some where either in the clutch assembly/flyheel, or the hydraulics that operate the clutch.

Be firm, but not argumentative with the dealer from the start, contact Skoda uk and complain if you dont get satisfaction from the dealer,keep trading standards informed if need be.

Tony

Go back to the dealer and ask them to this time correctly diagnose the original fault, refund you your £600 and fix it for free as a gesture of goodwill for fobbing you off 14 months ago.

Clutch faults are always a nightmare as it is so easy to blame the driver and put it down to fair wear and tear or neglect.

Be firm but fair and importantly keep calm but make it perfectly clear you aren't happy, don't appreciate being lied to and want it fixing properly!

Thank you,

Yes, I knew that it wasn't right but you're right- I found it an absolute nightmare to argue. It was just awful and there never was a proper explanation.

I don't appreciate being lied to and i shall try to be calm!

Hi,

First of all welcome to the forum.

I completly agree with you that 2 clutch failures in 15,000 is totally unaccecptable, their must be a fault some where either in the clutch assembly/flyheel, or the hydraulics that operate the clutch.

Be firm, but not argumentative with the dealer from the start, contact Skoda uk and complain if you dont get satisfaction from the dealer,keep trading standards informed if need be.

Tony

Hi

Thank you for your reply.

Just to clarify, the first clutch was at 9000 miles and under a year old. The second is 15,000 miles later (so a total mileage of 24,000) and the car is now just over two years old. Still completely unacceptable though.

I'd be inclined to suspect the problem lies within the gearbox its self as it sounds like the syncromesh is getting its self out of sync and blocking the gear.

Had an PD130 passat that used to do that untill the gearbox was warm. Cold gear box and 2nd to 1st just never worked unless the car was stopped, however that didn't have any increased clutch ware.

Firstly to say, this is clearly highly unusual and althogh of little comfort, is just one of those things. I know how it feels to have a material loss sitting on the drive.

There are really two options open to you:

1. Go the Skoda Customer Services and/or trading standards routes. Expect to have to shell out for mechanics time during the diagnostic phase. This may or may not be recoverable and probably £500-£1000. Expect also the car to be off-the-road for at least 3 months.

2. Take the loss (£600 for the suggested repair) 'on the chin' and trade it in immediately.

It's a bad situation but unfortuanetly the balance of power is very much in the favour of the manufacturer (this is no disrespect to Skoda, simply how it is for any manufacturer) and really it is just sheer bad luck.

You will save yourself a great deal of heartache and stress (and longer term, money) by just getting shot of it. However difficult that is to accept at this point.

Edited 2 December, 201114 yr by pearce_jj

Firstly to say, this is clearly highly unusual and althogh of little comfort, is just one of those things. I know how it feels to have a material loss sitting on the drive.

There are really two options open to you:

1. Go the Skoda Customer Services and/or trading standards routes. Expect to have to shell out for mechanics time during the diagnostic phase. This may or may not be recoverable and probably £500-£1000. Expect also the car to be off-the-road for at least 3 months.

2. Take the loss (£600 for the suggested repair) 'on the chin' and trade it in immediately.

It's a bad situation but unfortuanetly the balance of power is very much in the favour of the manufacturer (this is no disrespect to Skoda, simply how it is for any manufacturer) and really it is just sheer bad luck.

You will save yourself a great deal of heartache and stress (and longer term, money) by just getting shot of it. However difficult that is to accept at this point.

I took it on the chin last time. We really believed the service manager, who admitted it was wrong and shouldn't have happened, that it was just an unlucky glitch. To take it on the chin again is worse than the first time. Just seems ridiculous when I spent £14,000 on the car just over 2 years ago.

I took it on the chin last time. We really believed the service manager, who admitted it was wrong and shouldn't have happened, that it was just an unlucky glitch. To take it on the chin again is worse than the first time. Just seems ridiculous when I spent £14,000 on the car just over 2 years ago.

Yes that's true, but what is the other option? You'll be without a car for months, and very likely end up having to pay most or all of the cost of the repair. And probably having the same fault again in 6-18 months time.

If you trade it in now you may even be able to negotiate with the dealer a tradein value showing little or no loss on it's 'book' price, given the history. And of course there is still a flat 20% off RRP at the moment.

Edited 2 December, 201114 yr by pearce_jj

Yes that's true, but what is the other option? You'll be without a car for months, and very likely end up having to pay most or all of the cost of the repair. And probably having the same fault again in 6-18 months time.

If you trade it in now you may even be able to negotiate with the dealer a tradein value showing little or no loss on it's 'book' price, given the history. And of course there is still a flat 20% off RRP at the moment.

I know, I think you are probably right that there won't be a happy outcome but I am absolutely damn sure I won't have another Skoda!

I will also not go out without being a nuisance.

I understand that certainly. Although there would be absolutely no chance of avoiding the repair cost unless ordering another Skoda (and probably taking a stock car). As for being a nuisance, I understand that too but really, life is just too short.

Also given Skoda's rating for breakdowns, from a simple mathematical point of view, the chance of having a major issue with another one would be very low indeed.

Edit - Just to add, also consider that the car is costing you money in depreciation just sitting there. If it drags on for say 3 months, even if Skoda did pick up the bill it probably would have cost you £600 anyway.

Edited 2 December, 201114 yr by pearce_jj

Hi Karrie, I think the clue here is that the dealer in the first instance said the clutch was slightly blue. If correct this does indeed indicate the clutch has been overheating. As you may be aware, this would happen if the clutch is slipping due to either a cover assembly fault, or the disc itself sticking on it's splines. As this is the second time it has happened this is in my view sure to be a gearbox input shaft problem making the clutch disc stick on it's splines. I've seen it several times before and is a manufacturing defect...usually a slightly oversize shaft caused by incorrect machining at the time of manufacture. When hot the tolerance is wrong and this encourages the problem. This disc sticking is most likely to happen, although not exclusively, when the engine is hot and the shaft expands due to heat. Over time the shaft becomes slightly dirty with carbon from the clutch disc which also adds to the problem and the disc starts to stick on it's splines instead of sliding fully into contact with the flywheel. This causes some slippage that you may not even notice, the clutch pedal will often feel perfectly ok to giving no indication of a fault. Due to the fact the clutch disc becomes too hot the clutch lining is swollen and gearchanges can become difficult as the clutch can drag. When the clutch cools everything goes back to normal, hence the intermittent fault. The 1422cc TDI has lots of torque, more than the 105ps TSI engine and the clutch has to be good to take that torque. I think you may find Skoda will be more sympathetic on this occassion if you handle it right. The fact this is the second time this has happened is indicative of a manufacturing fault. It's doubtful your dealer examined the gearbox input shaft in the detail needed to ascertain it's manufactured specification, but they would have looked for any obvious fault and cleaned the shaft which is why the new clutch worked ok for the last few thousand miles.

I would first speak with Skoda UK over the phone and tell them of your plight and mention your concerns that this is a manufacturing fault, born out by the fact the clutch is going faulty again for the second time in a short space of time. I would do this before going to the dealer. Skoda will flag this up with your dealership and they should be prepared to make a detailed examination. They will warn you of a possible cost implication as usual. But warranty should apply in my view in this instance as I cannot see any other reason for it. Hydraulics must be ok as you are not experiencing problems all the time and often brakes are affected if there's a problem in that area as they share the same fluid ie: if the brake fluid is changed sometimes the gear change can be affected if all the air is not taken out of the brake system etc.

Of course it could still be an incorrectly machine flywheel, this happened on many Fords a few years back, but this resulted in mainly slipping clutches at low miles. Skoda are not noted for this sort of problem and I've only seen oversize input shafts on Fords, Honda's and Nissans with similar symptoms to yours.

Please do post back with how you are getting on with this problem. :yes:

Edited 3 December, 201114 yr by Estate Man

I suggest you ring Skoda Assist it is run by the RAC and see if you can get legal advise - I did with my car.

If you have finance the finance company are responsible to ensure you have a serviceable car, if you used a credit card as deposit and the deposit is over £100 then the credit card are also responsible, again seek legal advise.

The problem with your fault is proving the fault is with the car and not just to the dealer but in accordance with the law. It took Adam260 6 months to reject his new Monty Carlo, after 12 month of problems with mine a replacement should be with me end of Jan, 15 months from new to replacement.

Either way the best solution might not feel like the best way forward.

I don't think it will be too hard to argue that there is a fundamental problem here. The fact it has happened again in such a short time is virtually all most manufacturers require to be concerned that a fault exists and they will usually be prepared to investigate further without any problem. Certainly in the dealerships I've worked for we would take it as almost as a given that there is a manufacturing fault present and would proceed accordingly with an investigation. After all it's only dropping the box for a proper look to start with, easy!

I don't think it will be too hard to argue that there is a fundamental problem here. The fact it has happened again in such a short time is virtually all most manufacturers require to be concerned that a fault exists and they will usually be prepared to investigate further without any problem. Certainly in the dealerships I've worked for we would take it as almost as a given that there is a manufacturing fault present and would proceed accordingly with an investigation. After all it's only dropping the box for a proper look to start with, easy!

Thank you so much for taking the time to reply, it was very helpful.

My car has just gone back to Skoda on the back of a breakdown truck.

Your thoughts about it being a gearbox input shaft problem make total sense. The car is still going into gear perfectly when cold but not at all happy when heated up.

I know I haven't done this to the clutch and it is being caused by something else but really hope Skoda take me seriously as it is so hard to argue with a dealership. They know the car is coming in but I have told them that I have to talk to Skoda Customer care on Monday before I get back to them.

Thanks again for your help, I'll keep you posted.

It sounds to me that there is something wrong causing the wear on the clutch. Hopefully you can get it resolved and your initial charge refunded.

Under the Sales of Goods Act it is up to the sellers to prove that the fault was not there at the time of sale. This is clearly a case for the small claims court as it's obvious that a clutch should last longer than 9 months . It's a shame that a small claims court case was not persued immediately after the 1st clutch problem. I seem to remember a similar small court action being taken on an early clutch failure which was successful ( Which Magazine ?).

NOT FIT FOR PURPOSE!!!!!

NOT FIT FOR PURPOSE!!!!!

+1

soga is on your side. Id be getting my original 600 back too.

Hi,

I am hoping I am posting in the correct place and someone can help me.

I bought my Fabia Estate DTI 1.4 in October 2009. In August 2010 (10 months later) I had a problem getting into gear. I took car to Skoda who said there wasn't any problem and I thought it had been a one off. Two days later it happened again, worse, I got Skoda assist who took me into dealership. The short story is that they said it was a clutch and I wasn't covered (9000) miles.

I had a lot of doubts as the problem had disappeared and therefore was intermittent

I have driven for 20 years( my last car for over 100,000 miles) never had a clutch problem, I don't ride the clutch

There was no warning or clutch slipping and garage couldn't even find a problem in the days inbetween

When we asked to see the clutch the service manager admitted that it didn't look worn but it did have some slight blueness which showed it had been overheating ( I reckon that happened after the fault occured)

The service manager said that, as there was no other obvious fault, Skoda would not pay.

It cost me £600. I argued at the time that there was obviously a fault and what if it happened again. I was told it was so unusual it would not happen again. Off the record the service manager said that there had to have been a problem but there was no way to prove it so I had to pay.

It has just happened again. 14 months later and 15,000 miles and the problem has reoccurred. Exactly the same onset as before.

I just had an independent garage look at it as I don't trust my dealership. They thought it could be the gearbox linkage but my husband (a motorbike mechanic)said it can't be as when the transmission is off the gearbox is as smooth as can be, the fault is only evident when the engine is turning.

Does anyone have any advice.

Thank you

Hope I am completely wrong here, be prepared for a fight, just saying not fit for purpose is not always good enough.

There are two laws that apply, the supply of goods act and sale of goods act and if a fault is found in the first 6 months of purchase then the supply of goods act can be used after that it's the sale of goods act.

With the sale of goods act, in the first twelve months it's up to the maker to prove there is not a fault and it is fit for purpose after 12 months and up to about six years it's up to the consumer to prove the goods are not fit for purpose and it is not wear and tear or misuse.

Your first problem came in the first twelve months and the dealer said it was your problem and as I would have done you paid. The second failure was after the first repair and 12 months, the car is nearly three years old and it is now down to you to prove there is a fault and the car is not fit for purpose not the maker.

It is now down to you to prove there is a fault. The hard evidence you have is the same fault has happened twice in about the same time frame and mileage against the dealers said the first fault was down to you and the fault has happened again in a similar time frame.

Hope I am completely wrong here, be prepared for a fight, just saying not fit for purpose is not always good enough.

There are two laws that apply, the supply of goods act and sale of goods act and if a fault is found in the first 6 months of purchase then the supply of goods act can be used after that it's the sale of goods act.

With the sale of goods act, in the first twelve months it's up to the maker to prove there is not a fault and it is fit for purpose after 12 months and up to about six years it's up to the consumer to prove the goods are not fit for purpose and it is not wear and tear or misuse.

Your first problem came in the first twelve months and the dealer said it was your problem and as I would have done you paid. The second failure was after the first repair and 12 months, the car is nearly three years old and it is now down to you to prove there is a fault and the car is not fit for purpose not the maker.

It is now down to you to prove there is a fault. The hard evidence you have is the same fault has happened twice in about the same time frame and mileage against the dealers said the first fault was down to you and the fault has happened again in a similar time frame.

The car has 3 years warranty so it is up to the SELLER to prove that it is faulty and not the 'consumer'.

The seller will just blame the OPs driving style again and blame it on wear and tear, the clutch is considered a consumable item as it only has a finite life and driving style plays a big part. The onus will then shift to the OP to prove that driving style is not to blame.

The seller will just blame the OPs driving style again and blame it on wear and tear, the clutch is considered a consumable item as it only has a finite life and driving style plays a big part. The onus will then shift to the OP to prove that driving style is not to blame.

I think even the worst boy racer or OAP would be hard pushed to burn a clutch out in 9k. The garage said that the clutch was blue but not worn. This must mean that there is a fault somewhere else and the clutch probably would have been ok to put back in the car....