I will check again tomorrow with our provider. I get cash to spend on a select ion of vehicles, but have been quoted £495 net cost per month on a Elegance Estate cr170 manual with quite a few options. Checked the net cost for the same model with DSG today and got quoted £633.

Thats a 3 year deal with all insurance and servicing inclusive. A crazy difference which I need to get to the bottom of.

I would double check those values, the DSG does seem high to me. Are they including or excluding VAT? I currently drive a 140 DSG Elegance hatch with almost every extra, and that is £545 ex VAT per month, Before I have had manuals and really, the DSG is very good and is almost the MPG figure of a manual unless you have a really heavy right foot which is easy to do in a DSG. The changes are silky smooth and in heavy traffic your left foot and leg will thank you a thousands times.

 

I  have always found that after a while in very traffic of starting and stopping that clutch judder creeps in is extremely difficult to control smoothly then. A few miles on the open road and the judder has gone so I guess it is the pressure plate getting hot and distorting slightly and for that reason the DSG puts up a very case for its self, DSG all the way. I'll have one again on my next car in a few months.

My current manual Audi A4 requires the clutch to be depressed before it starts - so it must be a VAG thing. In addition, if the drivers seat belt isn't on in the Audi you ain't going anywhere.

Really? That must be a little annoying when your just moving the car in the drive or turning it around to wash it etc..? 

 

Oh...DSG all the way. You can get good MPG if you change down the gears yourself on hills, but most of the time it's nice knowing it's changing gears at the right time - to me its an additional gadget with the paddles and manual option! 

Edited 9 July, 201312 yr by Leon-y-k

Really? That must be a little annoying when your just moving the car in the drive or turning it around to wash it etc..?

Oh...DSG all the way. You can get good MPG if you change down the gears yourself on hills, but most of the time it's nice knowing it's changing gears at the right time - to me its an additional gadget with the paddles and manual option!

Can't be on all Audi models. My 6 month old S4 just screeches at you to put your belt on, simliar to my old vRS. just louder!

go for  DSG.  

Soooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo refreshing to see many DSG fans,

 

 

 

 

This box is the current and the future it sucks the last drops of pollen from a flower, I'm missing it so bad I might have to trade the VX in for VAG (which would be fine but for the fact that VAG doesn't give a fig about it's punters) currently suffering from auto bump which is fine as long as you never dsg before.

The DSG gets worse CO2 figures because it burns more fuel. It burns more fuel because all automatic gearboxes have higher internal drag and parasitics than manual gearboxes. That hydraulic pump to operate the clutches takes engine power to run. DSG is not the future of gearboxes. It's more an intermediate step. Conventional planetary gear autos with enough ratios and aggressive torque converter lockup have many advantages and can equal or beat the fuel economy of DSG while torque multiplying and shifting with a smoothness that isn't possible with clutches.

Very interesting thoughts Kiwi,

 

I've not seen this CPG auto box yet unless you mean a CVT

 

Anything reliable that gets rid of pedal 3 is a bonus in my eyes.

The 7 speed "dry" box is pretty evenly match and even gets about 1mpg more in engine and car configuration compared to manual.

 

The biggest losses with the 6 speed are that the clutches are "wet" and so there is some slip and resistance and also the extra weight of the gearbox compared to a normal manual.

 

Phil

If you go for DSG, I'd advise the hill hold assist as well as the DSG wil roll backwards on an incline unless you are a left foot "braker".

 

Had one Superb without and one with and it is well worth the extra (unless you live in Norfolk or other flat areas).

 

Some Superbs have it as standard - the 170 CR doesn't.  Just looked on the site and it is £115 - includes Tyre Pressure Monitor for the Elegance

Contacted them again. Pretty vague on the reasons but it will cost around an extra £100 a month - less than yesterday but still too much.

Contacted them again. Pretty vague on the reasons but it will cost around an extra £100 a month - less than yesterday but still too much.

 

 

Go have a test drive and then odds it up afterwards mate, be warned though you won't want to use a stick again afterwards

I have a DSG in an Octavia and going back to a manual on my next one...Wouldnt dare run one outside of a warranty..So much so that Skoda are putting extended warranties on them in the Far East. The Mechatronics have a history of expensive histrionics..That said many people reckon that the 6 speed diesel DSG with the `wet box` is far better than the dry 7 speed that I have. OK for the most part but a bit agricultural when manoevering in tight spaces at low speed tbh

I have a DSG in an Octavia and going back to a manual on my next one...Wouldnt dare run one outside of a warranty..So much so that Skoda are putting extended warranties on them in the Far East. The Mechatronics have a history of expensive histrionics..That said many people reckon that the 6 speed diesel DSG with the `wet box` is far better than the dry 7 speed that I have. OK for the most part but a bit agricultural when manoevering in tight spaces at low speed tbh

 

 

You make a good point as the dry one drives differently to the wet one,

 

dry ones a bit more snatchy ime,

 

The dsg itself is about 3k for the box and 2k for the mech unit, £900 buys a s/h one on eBay

At £500 a month my current quote is far enough away from an Audi A6 to make the Superb the sensible choice. At £600 the Audi would be far too close to resist.

I regularly drive 800 Plus miles in a day in Europe. DSG makes me feel safer, can get out of trouble quicker with the kickdown, and much, much, more relaxed at the end of the journey. In strange cities, I concentrate more on route than before. And I've been surprise how little effect it has on mpg. Winner for me. 

Very interesting thoughts Kiwi,

 

I've not seen this CPG auto box yet unless you mean a CVT

 

Anything reliable that gets rid of pedal 3 is a bonus in my eyes.

 

All conventional auto boxes use planetary gears.  CVT is a different kettle of fish again and one that gets pointless when you have enough fixed gears to choose from.

 

Personally I really like changing gears myself and find the programming in most autos doesn't do what I want, when I want.  The best auto I've driven to date and the only one I could live with was a conventional ZF 6sp auto in a mondeo.  I really didn't like DSG at all.  I'm looking forward to trying an 8sp auto.

 

 

The 7 speed "dry" box is pretty evenly match and even gets about 1mpg more in engine and car configuration compared to manual.

 

The biggest losses with the 6 speed are that the clutches are "wet" and so there is some slip and resistance and also the extra weight of the gearbox compared to a normal manual.

 

Phil

 

The 7sp dry dsg wins in the urban cycle because that's exactly what it's been programmed to do.  It's still a less efficient box than manual and results in higher fuel consumption everywhere but that specific fuel economy test.  The 7sp DSG also have a lower max speed due to the parasitic power loss.

I have driven the manual and have recently bought a three year old Elegance with a DSG box. i was initially sceptical about not having a manual, most of my cars have been manual and the best drivers cars for me have been manual. The DSG however is proving an exception to this. The car changes gear very rapidly and unperceptively and when left to its own devices in D has been producing economy between 47 -52 mpg (My drives are all long distance typically 40 -200 miles plus) The car changes up very early but the DSG complements this with the torquey diesel engine.

 

The car also drives very well in sport mode with little effect on economy. There are some very challenging roads in the Brecon Beacons (used a lot for filming by Top Gear, 5th Gear etc) and the car copes very well indeed with steep inclines, descents, long sweeping bends and hairpin bends and never is in the wrong gear for any given situation. So yes DSG for me, I suspect the first of many....

 

Incidentally this is a much nicer drive than the 2011 Mondeo Titanium X 2.2 TDCi 6 speed manual (200 bhp)  I recently traded in.

Edited 11 July, 201312 yr by jadeypup

You make a good point as the dry one drives differently to the wet one,

 

dry ones a bit more snatchy ime,

 

The dsg itself is about 3k for the box and 2k for the mech unit, £900 buys a s/h one on eBay

Is that £3 k for a  replacement DSG gearbox plus fitting ? I  assume you would not have to fit both at the same time in the event of a problem. Cheaper than a Merc a guy I met in Spain whilst caravanning recently had to have a new auto box it cost 7000 euros fitted in Spain, said it would cost more in UK. I collect a 2009 170 elegance today from main dealer with DSG , will report back with my first experience with DSG. not concerned about  driving, slight concern with regard to reliability.  EDIT   just read the comment  don't need DSG  if you live in Norfolk, I live in Norfolk that's fair comment, I have changed to the DSG superb as I tow a caravan and enjoy good weather caravanning in Spain the drive from Bilbao to Mabella has  long steep hills  most of the way after changing gear  many thousands of times  we have decided to give the 170 superb DSG with its power and DSG box a try .

Edited 11 July, 201312 yr by mellyboy

Hi melly,

 

I believe it's about 2k for the mech unit fitted but 3k is the supply price for the actual box,

 

The box itself is imo absolutely first class, they do however have a few traits you need to be aware of, this is the 6 speed wet clutch one I'm on about btw,

 

You are supposed to change the oil and filter every 40k and this costs £180 at a main dealer, however there is a Youtube of a USA Jetta being done and the oil comes out as clean as it goes in so had I kept mine next time I would've been simply drenching a new filter in DSG oil and swapping that out, these are easy to change you just look for a small version of the engine oil filter on the top of the gearbox,

 

 

The other thing is the flyweels seem to last about 90k - 110k and you should listen out for what sounds like a stone in a washing machine noise which will indicate it's on it's last legs and needs replacing asap or it can find it's way out of the box resulting in a dead box,

 

Mine I did 72k in without any real issues, I know the flywheel was getting near it because it wasn't as smooth as it could be, the cost of this at a good indy is about £700, expect £1200 at Skoda, the actual clutch pack seems to live a lot longer as the ecu removes bad driver clutch control and the plates don't get the beating a manual one would,

 

 

You will love that car if it proves a good car, driving it gently you can almost match manual MPG's, urban my Passat ran an average of 30MPG but some days if the conditions were right I could see 34 MPG from it, on a run it generally gave 45 MPG but it was a PD and the CR is supposed to be 10% more economic, hth.

Hi melly,

 

I believe it's about 2k for the mech unit fitted but 3k is the supply price for the actual box,

 

The box itself is imo absolutely first class, they do however have a few traits you need to be aware of, this is the 6 speed wet clutch one I'm on about btw,

 

You are supposed to change the oil and filter every 40k and this costs £180 at a main dealer, however there is a Youtube of a USA Jetta being done and the oil comes out as clean as it goes in so had I kept mine next time I would've been simply drenching a new filter in DSG oil and swapping that out, these are easy to change you just look for a small version of the engine oil filter on the top of the gearbox,

 

 

The other thing is the flyweels seem to last about 90k - 110k and you should listen out for what sounds like a stone in a washing machine noise which will indicate it's on it's last legs and needs replacing asap or it can find it's way out of the box resulting in a dead box,

 

Mine I did 72k in without any real issues, I know the flywheel was getting near it because it wasn't as smooth as it could be, the cost of this at a good indy is about £700, expect £1200 at Skoda, the actual clutch pack seems to live a lot longer as the ecu removes bad driver clutch control and the plates don't get the beating a manual one would,

 

 

You will love that car if it proves a good car, driving it gently you can almost match manual MPG's, urban my Passat ran an average of 30MPG but some days if the conditions were right I could see 34 MPG from it, on a run it generally gave 45 MPG but it was a PD and the CR is supposed to be 10% more economic, hth.

Thanks for the info, Dsg oil changed by supplying dealer cam belt and tensioner and water pump also changed.

Imperceptive gear changes?

 

Sorry but this is a reflection of how little you are in touch with what the car is doing.  The only gearboxes of any type with imperceptible gear changes are CVT.  DSG changes are extremely abrupt compared to a torque converter autos.  The TC autos can slur the change at the only cost of heating oil.  The DSG's can't afford to slip the clutches with each change as this dramatically shortens their life.

Imperceptive gear changes?

Yes, still amazes me.

First time I took a ride in one the only way I knew it was changing gear was watching the flick of the rev counter.

An amazing piece of kit and one I will stick with

Regards all

Juan

Sent from my iPhone using my thumbs

The DSG is a smooth piece of kit, but I would happily pay 24 pounds a month extra to have an Manual ( R36 is DSG standard ) although now that the box has been remapped,(  together with the engine ) it changes up at the torque curve( and launch control is at 4300)   instead of either in 6th if you are tootling or 7000 rpm if you are gunning it, the fun of eating spare ribs or corn on the cob is doing it yourself , you can have them prepared  and stripped ready to eat , faster but not more satisfying . Many performance cars are going DSG ( with no manual option ) as if you change down from 5th to 1st you can do a lot of damage . Mine is a great car but could be greater. The six speed DSG is nicer than the 7 though 

Imperceptive gear changes?

 

Sorry but this is a reflection of how little you are in touch with what the car is doing.  The only gearboxes of any type with imperceptible gear changes are CVT.  DSG changes are extremely abrupt compared to a torque converter autos.  The TC autos can slur the change at the only cost of heating oil.  The DSG's can't afford to slip the clutches with each change as this dramatically shortens their life.

 

 

You know when it changes in 1-2-3, it's 4-5-6 that are silky, still a lot smoother than a normal auto,

 

regarding the Ford, was that an automatic or a powershift version?