The end is near

[sharkrider]

I'd rather see a Citigo VRS based on the UP! GT.

Now that would be a real hoot, plus it would be cheap!

I agree with that, as ashs citygo is a hoot to drive with 60bhp! BUT , unlike boss, I would still prefere DSG ... However the point about cost is still important, I don't Have much money, a citygo vRS for 11-12k would be awsome ... I would consider using a third pedal for it.,.

[sharkrider]

I'd rather see a Citigo VRS based on the UP! GT.

Now that would be a real hoot, plus it would be cheap!

I agree with that, as ashs citygo is a hoot to drive with 60bhp! BUT , unlike boss, I would still prefere DSG ... However the point about cost is still important, I don't Have much money, a citygo vRS for 11-12k would be awsome ... I would consider using a third pedal for it.,.

[sharkrider]

I'd rather see a Citigo VRS based on the UP! GT.

Now that would be a real hoot, plus it would be cheap!

I agree with that, as ashs citygo is a hoot to drive with 60bhp! BUT , unlike boss, I would still prefere DSG ... However the point about cost is still important, I don't Have much money, a citygo vRS for 11-12k would be awsome ... I would consider using a third pedal for it.,.

[sharkrider]

Sorry about multiple post :( stupid phone

[shrops_paul]

It’s also worth remembering that the sales figures, problems and VAT free offers have all occurred in the middle of a recession. Lots of manufacturers have been struggling or folded completely. The original VRS was sold during a better economic climate and for longer.

 

It was a bold decision to go with a DSG and petrol for the MK2 but I can see their logic – it was the VAG weapon of choice in a hot hatch so they probably had to follow suit. I think if rather than canning the current VRS they introduced a VRS-D as a second choice then that would  be a smart move.

 

Personally with an average of 38.8 MPG (as of last night) I can’t see the point in a diesel VRS given the higher purchase cost and the higher price at the pumps but then I only tent to run a car like this for 3 years/30,000 miles. I also like my sporty cars to sound nice

[BossFox]

Personally with an average of 38.8 MPG (as of last night) I can’t see the point in a diesel VRS given the higher purchase cost and the higher price at the pumps but then I only tent to run a car like this for 3 years/30,000 miles. I also like my sporty cars to sound nice

 

But a diesel manual should have been cheaper.

A turbo petrol is cheaper than a diesel, but the VRS is a twin charger (more money) and a DSG (which also commands a price premium) which is why the Monte Carlo 1.6 CR diesel is noticably cheaper than the VRS.

[shrops_paul]

But a diesel manual should have been cheaper.

A turbo petrol is cheaper than a diesel, but the VRS is a twin charger (more money) and a DSG (which also commands a price premium) which is why the Monte Carlo 1.6 CR diesel is noticably cheaper than the VRS.

Sorry, should have been clearer. I meant a VRS diesel would have been no cheaper than than a petrol one, and probably a little more expensive. Thats based on it having a proper performance diesel engine rather than an economy 1.6 . The Octavia VRSD or golf GTD engine for example (2.0?).

 

I

[BossFox]

Sorry, should have been clearer. I meant a VRS diesel would have been no cheaper than than a petrol one, and probably a little more expensive. Thats based on it having a proper performance diesel engine rather than an economy 1.6 . The Octavia VRSD or golf GTD engine for example (2.0?).

 

I

 

I think it would though, because as well as not being twin charged it would probably not have been DSG.

Look at the price of the 1.6CR Monte.  Add a bit for an engine tweak and I still don't think it would be knocking on £18k like the VRS.

 

But that's just my opinion.

DSG alone normally adds £1000(ish) to Skodas, never mind the extra complications and costs of having a supercharger on top of the turbo.

[Ootohere]

What would have been cheaper is hardly relevant that was then, this is now.

 

The amazing Dr Vahland took charge in 2010, he predicted & plans that Skoda will double world wide sales by 2020.

 

So 3 years have passed and he let the Fabia vRS run its course, and the other 3 Twin Chargers with DSG,

he even implemented Upgrades even though they never promoted the cars.

The other 3 Twinchargers with DSG have not had great sales figures, 

the VW & Audi are just terrible, & must be an embarrassment to him and VAG.

You would think a huge financial loss to them.

 

Dr Vahland is the one that knows the faults with some Twincharger engines so maybe he needs to address that issue.

He has had to address the DSG issues in China & other countries but they were forced into that.

Court actions get their attention.

 

Maybe after 3 years as CEO he has got some smart ideas now, we will need to wait and see.

 

george

[BossFox]

Maybe after 3 years as CEO he has got some smart ideas now, we will need to wait and see.

 

george

 

I'm very sure he has.

But his focus is on brand, sales and profits rather than one model.  As we all know.

[Ootohere]

Good,

but your focus is on a car that some of us have and kept, and can still buy.

 

So you never liked it, others never bought it,

if there are Euro 6 emission sporty diesel small to medium cars with manual gearboxes introduced in 2014/15 then that will be the global decision of VAG.

 

I am sure that the VAG will be seeing what happens as the Fabia mk2 winds down.

 

I think the Monte Carlo Estate will catch lots of attention in the next 6 months.

It is certainly priced to.

 

If the S2000 is to Rally as a R5 1.6 Turbo that will also have Media Attention.

If it Rallies as a Fabia MK 3 Body, it will bring lots and lots of attention to the new car.

 

george

[RapidRonnie]

Are there actually any hot superminis which sell in big numbers as a percentage of the whole range. I am struggling to think of any I really see on a regular basis!

[Sparkly]

Mini Cooper S?

 

Buggers are everywhere round by me

[Ootohere]

I was just looking at the number of UK Registered top of the range Skoda Yeti.

 

With all the hype you might think they are great sellers.

 

Some are from 2010-13 & some only out 2011/12 - 2013.

 

But the top 170 bhp, 140 bhp, & with 4x4 or manual or DSG.

Some models only under 1000 registered/sold in 3 years, some just a few hundred, & the best selling top price one about 1200 Registered.

 

Obviously the price sold maybe means profits for Skoda, but certainly not big Volume UK Sales.

Must be rest of Europe that matters with them.

 

'Mini Cooper S'  the original from 2001/2 -06, Supercharged are up near 40,000 registered in the UK,

(That is the BWM Mini Cooper s, Not actual Proper Cooper S)

& the Cooper S with Turbo from 2006  well over 30,000.

 

Numbers that Auto Express published recently.

of the Mini Current range sales

Mini Hatchback 11,217 sold

Mini Countryman 7,169 sold

Mini Convertable 2,489 sold

Mini Clubman 1,414 sold

Mini Roadster 1,318 sold *axed*

MINI Paceman 1,098 sold

Mini Coupe 969 sold *axed*

 

 

george

[shrops_paul]

Dear Mr Porsche.

 

I must take issue with the appalling fuel consumption of the Carrera S I recently purchased. 18 mpg is simply not acceptable in everyday use, particularly with little Timmy’s school being a 40 mile round trip each day. Recently I’ve had to take to using one of the wides Range Rovers for the run as they are marginally more economical.

 

If I may be so bold, I suggest that for the next model you consider a diesel engine. The VAG 1.6 CR which I am sure you would have access to offers significantly better fuel consumption whilst almost certainly being a cheaper unit to produce that your current flat 6. This would allow you to sell the next Carrera at a much lower price point and that combined with a diesel engine would surely appeal to more customers. I dare say you could even use the old 1.9 PD TDI from the VAG group for even less money – Those jolly old VRS MK1 boys on ‘Briskoda’ are always banging on about much better they still are lol!

 

And dont get me started on your dratted tiptronic gearboxes. Grrr.

 

Well toodle pip!

 

Henry.

[shrops_paul]

2013 Octavia 2.0 TSI basic price - £22,990

2013 Octavia 2.0 TDI basic price - £23,260

 

not as bigger increase for the D as I imagined actualy. another £1,500 for DSG. So a manual D is about £1,100 chaper than the DSG petrol. So I agree a manual D fabia should ahve been cheaper than the curren auto petrol.

 

Hmmm new Octavia vRS droool....

[BossFox]

I was just looking at the number of UK Registered top of the range Skoda Yeti.

 

With all the hype you might think they are great sellers.

 

Some are from 2010-13 & some only out 2011/12 - 2013.

 

But the top 170 bhp, 140 bhp, & with 4x4 or manual or DSG.

Some models only under 1000 registered/sold in 3 years, some just a few hundred, & the best selling top price one about 1200 Registered.

 

Obviously the price sold maybe means profits for Skoda, but certainly not big Volume UK Sales.

Must be rest of Europe that matters with them.

 

Interesting comparison.

 

I think you'll find the profit margins on the Yeti is noticably larger than not only the Fabia VRS, but all Fabia models.

That's what makes them worthwhile.

 

While the VRS was on VAT free, selling around £15k the top end Yetis were selling around £22k after discount.

(Budget spec 1.2tsi 5 speed manual Yeti around £15k, Fabia £10k?)

 

It doesn't cost much more to make a Yeti 4x4.

My 170 diesel doesn't have a DSG box or a twin charged engine, other than the extra size, haldex and better cabin there is not a lot more too them.

 

So in terms of volume... small fry.

In terms of profit per unit, brand image, awareness and pushing the Skoda brand upmarket... big fry.

[logiclee]

The twin charge engine was an excellent idea at the time but turbo technology also took a major leap just a couple of years later.

 

When you have 1.6T's from other manufacturers that can produce 200bhp, maximum torque at 1350rpm and 90% torque from 1000rpm it makes the twin charger technology pretty pointless. Then VAG have had all the reliability issues with the unit, It's not been the best advertisement for VAG. There have been worse, the 2.0PD diesel was an unreliable dog of an engine in the early years.

 

VAG keep rumouring a 1.6T, I think they need one, it's the engine of choice among the competitors and for WRC and F1 from next year. Wouldn't be surprised for the next Polo GTi to have a 1.6T

 

Cheers

Lee

[Ootohere]

The 1.0 litre Fords are are going single, or twin turbo when performance is required,

the BMW are going 500cc per cylinder, and multiples of.

& as you know they like Twin Turbos of different pressures .

So 1000cc, 1500, 2000, 3000 cc ....and on.

 

VAG are building now for the models with the new platform & using the TSI/TFSI 1.8 with just Turbo to produce  178 bhp,

the same as the 1.4 TSI Twincharger.

 

Many changes coming in the near future, and thats great IMO, just please build in reliability and longevity..

 

Strangely the 1390 cc Twincharger got Engine of the year under 1400 cc for 3 years in a row from the Awards of some set up or another that does not care about Reliability or lack of, just Advancing Technology.

 

george

[logiclee]

The 1.0 litre Fords are are going single, or twin turbo when performance is required,

the BMW are going 500cc per cylinder, and multiples of.

& as you know they like Twin Turbos of different pressures .

So 1000cc, 1500, 2000, 3000 cc ....and on.

 

 

george

 

BMW are actually dropping the twin turbo setup from the majority of the petrol units. Even the big 3.0 is now single turbo, from one twinscroll turbo they can get 450NM of torque from just 1250rpm and 320PS with a 7000rpm redline.

Although all the current units still have "Twin Power Turbo" engine designations they are nearly all single twin scroll turbo.

Cheers

Lee

[Ootohere]

http://blog.caranddriver.com/first-look-we-drive-bmws-new-three-cylinder-dive-into-the-new-engine-family

 

Always advancing and yet needing to appear like trying to be green.

Forced Induction is where it will be for a long time to come, while making Cubic Capacity sound like it is less.

& harvesting and electricity.

http://greencarcongress.com/2012/01/bmw-20120126.html

http://greencarcongress.com/2013/08/bmw-20130812.html

 

VW Petrols.

http://www.en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Volkswagen_Group_petrol_engines

[grr666]

Dear Mr Porsche.

...

Well toodle pip!

Henry.

You're never trying to suggest that the Carrera S and Mark 2 Fabia vRS are stablemates are you?

Lamborghini, Porsche, Ferrari.... Skoda?

People who buy proper performance cars are uninterested in prices, mpg, cost of spares and

servicing, they care not about Euro 6 or any other Euro either.

They want the look, the status, the styling and the performance and in those types of price bracket

they can have it all.

Cars like the Fabia vRS, Golf GTI Audi RS3, Megane 265 etc etc are for people (like me) who wish they

could afford a proper performance motor so have one of these instead.

People who own Ferraris and the like (My uncle does btw) have cars like the Audi TTRS for

going to Tescos in. (He does) To people like my him they are nothing but economical hacks to punt

about in while the exotica sits at home in the air conditioned garage next to the Mint condition

50's Jaguar. (Yep, you guessed it, he has one of those too)

Cars like yours and mine are just pretenders, I can accept that though. It makes me strive for something

better. In my case the next car will be a 911. But I'm not quite there yet.

But to suggest that a Skoda is even in the same league as a Porsche (or a range rover for that matter)

is just plain funny. Pull your Fabia vRS up next to more or less any current Porsche and DSG or no

DSG, enjoy as you have your ass handed to you.

[Ootohere]

Lots of people could not care less about having performance motors, and just need something with pace & a limit,

Cars or bikes without limit of speed can just be a temptation too far.

 

Some do not mind other thinking, look at that plonker in a boy racer car,

but would hate to be thought of as look at that, Fast Car small male member in a Porsche.

 

Cars are a life style choice and really nobody elses business.

 

Some People have 'My Other car is a Porsche' on their Polo as a joke,

I know others that are mortified to think someone sees them in a Hyundai when they are a Audi driver normally.

 

Snobbery is a terrible thing really.

Some people with real money feel no need to show others that they have it, No need for ownership of flash cars.

Some just have Business Accounts & Flash Lease cars

& nothing much in their Bank Account if they missed a Months Salary coming in.

 

PS,

Funnily there are drivers of Porsche or Audi or other prestige sports cars that do sometimes decide that they want 

to hand someone their arse.

Does not always happen though.

 

S3 Audis, with 265 bhp, sometimes get there arse handed to them by the less than 190 bhp cheepo cars.

Have you had that experience yet?

Not so fast through the 30-80 bit often, or even on to a few more mph,  embarrassing really sometimes for the driver with the big numbers and Figures on the Brochure.

Grip and Traction is all well and good, not often the deciding factor when you have not got the acceleration.

The lesser car driver can just shug their shoulders and know thats how those faster cars are.

Must be a minter for that person that spent big and thought they would be King of the Road.

 

george

 

PPS,

grrr666,

have you driven a RS 3 yet,?

best not if not done already, it does show where the S3 is a bit of a Lard Arse.

[BossFox]

You're never trying to suggest that the Carrera S and Mark 2 Fabia vRS are stablemates are you?

Lamborghini, Porsche, Ferrari.... Skoda?

People who buy proper performance cars are uninterested in prices, mpg, cost of spares and

servicing, they care not about Euro 6 or any other Euro either.

 

I wouldn't include Porsche in there either.

They have (like Audi) managed to create a brand of cars that people aspire to own, but with only the top ones actually being really good and worthy of exotica status and the desire for the brand image that people crave.

Your typical run of the mill Porker is just a quick car with a fancy badge on the front and not a partcularly great spec.

Yes, the handling is well sorted.  That doesn't make them even approaching exotica iMO as they are also quite common.

 

GT3-RS, Turbo etc...  yes.

 

Carrera, boxter etc... nice enough.  But not exotica.  Just base versions to fill the coffers at Porsche with profits.

You just can't compare them to Lambo, Ferrari etc...

 

That may sound funny coming from the owner of a quick Nissan.

But that's not Exotica either, it's just Nissan sticking two fingers up to people like Porsche and showing what expensive badge orientated cars they are.  Just like Skoda in a way with the VRS.

[logiclee]

http://blog.caranddriver.com/first-look-we-drive-bmws-new-three-cylinder-dive-into-the-new-engine-family

 

Always advancing and yet needing to appear like trying to be green.

Forced Induction is where it will be for a long time to come, while making Cubic Capacity sound like it is less.

& harvesting and electricity.

http://greencarcongress.com/2012/01/bmw-20120126.html

http://greencarcongress.com/2013/08/bmw-20130812.html

 

VW Petrols.

http://www.en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Volkswagen_Group_petrol_engines

 

Diesels are a lot harder to get the top end power and a wide spread of torque, that's why BMW have the twin and triple setups on the 3.0 Diesel.

 

The newer petrols have dropped the twin setup in favour of a single turbo with better response and better figures. Saying that the M3/M4 will have a twin turbo setup.

 

The new three cylinder 1500 twin scroll turbo is producing some interesting numbers, 0-62 in 7.2 seconds with the 8 speed auto and 60mpg.

 

Cheers

Lee