Fabia VRs Monte?

[Sparkly]

Not a future fabia - an existing fabia with monte trim added

Virtually no extra cost to skoda to produce

......so it's potentially a "yes"......?

[Gcj]

I am sure the marketing department must have already considered it - perhaps only being held back by not wanting to confuse what the existing Monte stands for (see earlier comment)

But if the monte is not to be offered immediately with the mk3, maybe it is something they should run with...........

[Gcj]

Did the mk1 special edition VRs have any suspension changes to the standard mk1 VRs ?

[BossFox]

Did the mk1 special edition VRs have any suspension changes to the standard mk1 VRs ?

 

No.

It was painted a different colour and had one or two options.

Then when they arrived in the UK they fitted the black leather with the blue piping.

[newbie69]

"Future" doesn't only apply on - brand new - models but to special editions that may be introduced (in the future!) as well, so again, the answer would be no in my opinion. I think Skoda's decision is clear on this one.

[Gcj]

Have skoda said there won't be special edition run-out mk2 VRs?

Wasn't aware of that if they have

[shrops_paul]

Boss fox seems to be the only person so far that has actually read the thread and understood it!

If the thread bores, then don't waste your own time with a response like 'yawn' - this forum is way better than that.

The 'yawn' was not aimed at you but rather the 1st reply about VAG getting the mk2 vrs all wrong. I think that has been covered thoroughly in the 'end is near' thread. Perhapse I should have been more constructive but frustration overcame me

I agree that and end of run special edition is a good idea. A bit like the end if line octavia black.

A new unique colour would be nice.

[Sparkly]

A new unique colour would be nice.

Might be out on a limb here but metallic orange for the limited edition VRS??? with Monte trim inc full black pack maybe some LE wheels too?

[Gcj]

Lamborghini orange with black everything ( roof, wheels, grill and headlights, leather,) and gloss black monte trim plus suspension mods................getting carried away

[Brimma]

The only wothwhile runout would have the S2000 rally bodykit on it, fully decalled up, no halfway house making it a glorified Monte

[Gcj]

Full rally body kit with decals too extreme for most

Mind you so is Lamborghini orange!!!

[Gcj]

In reality I think a run-out special would have to offer a discount to the full list price - a bit like the Monte tech did - so don't think Skoda will want to spend too much money on it - hence the gut feeling it could be just a bit of monte body kit with maybe a unique colour.

I guess it depends on how many twin charger engines they want to shift - if any!!!

[Ootohere]

I keep reading about 1.4 TSI Twincharger Engines on the shelf and using them up.

 

Their engine plant must build engines and the engines for a 1.4 TSI is a base engine before it then gets the parts fitted,

Same Engine with different power outputs, but same block, and internals, different,

Injectors, plugs, Intakes, Exhaust, Turbo or Turbo & Supercharger & the ECU, cooling system, to suit the Engine designation, & Gearbox.

 

I doubt there are lots of buchshee engines kicking about.

If there are they can surely get them to the Garages quicker that are having to fit replacement engines.

They are taking long enough.

 

THe same with the replacement, DSG's that some Twincharger Owners are waiting for to be delivered for fitting.

 

Many seem to forget the Scale of Skoda and VAG and there Productions World Wide,

New Builds, Parts, Warranty Replacement Parts, Run Out Models,

New models building up production and sales, profits.

Increasing Production to meet orders and back orders & the Black Hole Ordering System.

 

http://www.en.wikipedia.net/wiki/List_of_Volkswagen_Group_engines

Just click on Current Diesel, or Current Petrol Engines.

 

george

[tempra007]

The only wothwhile runout would have the S2000 rally bodykit on it, fully decalled up, no halfway house making it a glorified Monte

Ohh, yes please, that would save me doing it myself.

[wja96]

Wow, you guys are ridiculously sensitive. The point of the post was not to point out the diesel vs. petrol angle again, simply to state that the reason the Monte Carlo has been a sales success is that it combines engine and gearbox combinations people actually want with a subtle body kit at an attractive price. People don't necessarily want out-and-out performance, they seem to want the appearance of performance on a car that's sensible money to buy and run. As for the reliability issues, anyone who is trying to pretend there weren't LOTS of posts about engine and gearbox issues is just delusional.

Adding the body kit and a sticker on the wing to a vRS won't suddenly make the engine/gearbox combination any more attractive to people who weren't buying it in the first place.

Nor will painting it a non-Skoda colour or slashing the price (the price has been consistently slashed by at least 15-20% ever since it was launched).

So have a go as much as you like, but no, making a special edition 1.4 vRS won't transform a sales flop into a sales success.

[Ootohere]

Not sure that anyone cares if vRS sales are a success or not unless they have shares in VAG.

They bought a car and drive it or got rid of it. Or they want to buy one.

Most got a bargain when buying theirs.

 

The Monte Carlo was built as a 'Rally Inspired' model to sell 3,000 according to the CEO and they have produced 20,000.

 

So across a choice of 5 engines at some point including a 1.2 12 v 69ps they have sold well.

All manual gearboxes though, and a choice of a DSG might have increased the sales even more.

Now a Estate Version is being offered and that will surely increase sales even more.

 

I think the only people asking for a vRS with improved looks or some cosmetic enhancements is for their sake of 

something a bit different being available from the past 3 years version..

Not really for any concern for Skoda-VAG and their sales figures or profits and losses.

 

Skoda maybe got something right that appeals, with "Postman Pat's Van" looks.

(maybe they went too far with the Roomster though.)

http://skoda.co.uk/news/Pages/another-record-tumbles.aspx?pageindex=3

Fabia mk 2's seem to continue to sell OK in the UK compared to the other Skoda models.

Must be the value for money and wide choice of engines, gearboxes, trims and maybe also down the promotion of the 'Special Editions' & those Limited to 1000 etc.

and  and finance offers. even the discounted prices..

 

george

[wja96]

I was accused of not having read the original post. It was very clearly asking would it sell better than the standard car in this runout phase and the underlying reason the standard car doesn't sell isn't that it doesn't have a Monte Carlo badge on the side or blacked out headlamps.

People should care about the success of the vRS because it has a halo effect on all Fabia's and the popularity directly affects resale and trade-in values.

Again, current owners will not want to be told that the likely trade-in values at 3 years old will probably be poor, especially if the model you are trying to trade it in against is cheaper than the one you bought originally. The dealers just won't have any margin for giving a good trade-in. If you paid £12500 for a vRS 3 years ago (and plenty of people got them at that sort of price new) then you're probably not going to be unhappy to be offered £7000 as a trade-in against a new one. If you paid £15000 then £7000 trade-in looks absolutely horrible. Especially when the same dealer may well have a low mileage 07-reg Mk I on the forecourt at similar money.

[Gcj]

In no way was I trying to suggest that a run-out special with Monte body kit would transform Skoda sales of the Fabia VRs

If anything, all it would do would be to sustain current sales levels for a bit longer and to postpone the decline ahead of the mark 3 introduction.

After all , that is what run-out specials are for!!!!!

My observation/suggestion was that using a bit of Monte body kit, and a unique colour,at virtually no extra cost might just help Skoda to do that

[Ootohere]

EDIT,

Gcj,

do you actually know if Skoda want to take any more new vRS orders, & if they want to keep building them, or are happy to stop selling, as a few more CTHE engines go wrong.

They might well be losing money on them and need to sell no more, but do not want to admit they can be Lemons while they have nothing in the VW, Audi Range to replace the Twinchargers,

and they just relaunched the 2013 Seat Ibiza Cupra after a Face Lift.

 

 

wja96

i tend to think you pick figures out of the air, like OTR prices paid, 3, 2 or 1 year ago.

Trade ins now being Offered,& accepted,  Cars Used and 3 year olds prices being sold for.

Cars out of Warranty or going out of Warranty.

You appear not to know that the demand for used cars is different around the country.

 

The trade in value and resale value is through the floor now, which is good for second hand buyers,

not so for sellers.

(but that is even a simplification. on vRS values from me.)

Asking prices on used might be high, but they are too high at Skoda Dealerships and thats their tough luck.

Skoda should have been honest with issues,

and extend Warranties on all the vRS, where they know they built some Lemons, and caused the drop in residules.

 

The quicker they stop taking orders for new cars the better. Limited availability of used is a good thing.

 

Supply and demand,  once more catch on to what they missed when they are only available in a limited number of a few thousand..

The good ones are very good,

'keepers' for some, or will just stop losing so much value for those that are bothered.

 

No idea why those that do not even have a mk2 vRS are so worried for us,

 

Not sure about future values of Monte Carlos,

there is such a glut and already,  ones sitting used and not selling, Demonstrators not selling..

Thats much to do with Skoda and Deals, Low Finance etc.

3years time and all those lease vehicles will be sitting on forecourts out of Warranty and looking rather dated.

 

 

george

[wja96]

I joined the forum in 2006, so I've been reading the threads for quite a while and, if you go back to when Skoda first started the VAT free offers there were plenty of people posting about how thy not only had the VAT off, but another 8-10% from brokers like Drive the Deal. £12500 was a commonly quoted price to aim for a couple of years back.

I buy and lease cars for my business, so I keep a reasonably close eye on what holds it's value. You can tell cars that hold their value because the lease costs are low. The lease on an Audi A4 is less than on the equivalent spec Superb because the Audi holds it's value better used. The same goes for A1s over Fabia's. The Fabia is MUCH cheaper to buy, but the A1 is less to lease because it loses less in initial depreciation then depreciates more slowly. That's a fact. Cars that are unpopular new are 99.9% unpopular used too, so why should the vRS be any different?

People are not buying the 1.4/DSG combination. Not as an A1, not as an Ibiza, not as a Polo and not as a Fabia, despite all the highly aggressive discounting. It's just not what people want. The 1.2TSi 105bhp is a brilliant engine, especially with the manual gearbox. Drive that and you smile. It's an involving experience that gently, but definitely, shoves you back in the seat. It FEELS fast, even if it's not. The small diesel does the same. So the Monte looks sporty and feels sporty. And it's cheap for the equipment level.

I don't EVER knock Skoda. They are very good and they helped me out enormously when I bought a dodgy dashpod a few years back. The cars are good too, but VAG as a whole just read the market wrong when they went down the route of just selling the 1.4 twin charged engine with the DSG gearbox.

[Ootohere]

That sound fair IMO, and less like the wind up comments you usually make about the mk2 vRS.

Often they seem like digs at the buyer/leasers/owners.

 

"People are not buying the 1.4/DSG combination." 

You see that is just factually wrong,

You mean that 'According to VW & you, they are not around the world and in the UK buying enough."

The people that bought them, have bought them!

So they were what they wanted.

 

Now, the VW CEO is reported or quoted to have said, 'We expected to sell 3,000 Monte Carlo,

we have produced 20,000"  (para phrase)

Well looking a the figures for Sold or Registered in the UK, that looks to be under 5,000 for the 2 years of them producing.

So we need to wait for official figures of actual sales UK & rest of World..

 

Each to their own.

 

george

[logiclee]

DSG is the future.

 

 

 

Questionable.

 

Some manufacturers are actually moving away from dual clutch.

 

Here's what Chris Harris thinks......

 

And now this year it has appeared in a BMW 1 Series. In the M135i the ZF is so quick and intuitive I had to re-record a section of film because I had assumed it was a dual-clutch system. It will upshift in 200 milliseconds and then drop into BMW's Eco-Pro mode for some fuel saving. It's the first gearbox that appears to have the same breadth of aspirations, in terms of performance and economy, as the average car enthusiast's brain.

That Porsche can make it behave so smoothly in a Panamera, and BMW so aggressively in the M135i proves how remarkably flexible the unit is. Furthermore, it always seems to extract incredible efficiency wherever it is used.

A few years ago, in the midst of the double-clutch boom - when everything fast was moving in that direction - I asked someone from a German car manufacturer if he thought all cars would soon be using such transmissions. He grinned. "Just wait till you see the next generation of automatic." He was right.

http://www.pistonheads.com/news/default.asp?storyId=26917

 

I own two DSG cars, a 6 speed wet clutch and a 7 speed dry clutch and another car with the ZF box. I agree with Chris.

 

Cheers

Lee

Edited 26 August, 2013 by logiclee

[Ootohere]

Is he saying moving away from Automatics or just making comments on DSG v ZF .?

 

Like Dyson v Hoover v other brands of Vacuum cleaner, &  against a Dust Pan and Brush or Carpet Sweeper..

(When there is no Electric available, both the last listed but first use can still be usable.)

 

I like CVT,

have done since my Daf & Volvo, & loved my iQ, Also my Punto Speedgear. (a box ahead of its time.)

 

The 8 speeds & 9 Speeds are just becoming like CVT's and the power and torque can be delivered efficiently.

If DSG is not the future than neither is Manual Gearboxes & a Clutch operated by your left foot.

 

So be it from Borg Warner or any other Manufacturer the Automatics are here to stay.

Once they get to 11 gears, do you want to be changing your self.

 

Tractors & HGVs, Busses etc have gearboxes years ahead of Passenger Cars.

 

george

[logiclee]

Is he saying moving away from Automatics or just making comments on DSG v ZF .?

Dyson v Hoover.

 

I like CVT,

have done since my Daf & Volvo, & loved my iQ, Also my Punto Speedgear. (a box ahead of its time.)

 

The 8 speeds & 9 Speeds are just becoming like CVT's and the power and torque can be delivered efficiently.

If DSG is not the future than neither is Manual Gearboxes & a Clutch operated by your left foot.

 

So be it from Borg Warer or any other Manufacturer the Automatics are here to stay.

Once they get to 11 gears, do you want to be changing your self.

 

Tractors & HGVs, Busses etc have gearboxes years ahead of Passenger Cars.

 

george

 

 

 

He's comparing the Dual Clutch to the new generation of conventional auto's with torque converter. ZF have also just launched a small 9 speed auto for use in FWD cars with transverse engines. Seems to be getting just as good reviews.

 

I like DSG and I think the new ZF auto's are even better but I hate CVT with a passion. The only time they feel right and enjoyable is when they are doing a simulated manual with step changes and giving direct drive. Whenever the engine revs are high and the speed is catching up it just feels wrong.

It's one reason I went with my Passat over an A4, the CVT isn't smooth off the line and is not an enjoyable drive and the forums are full of mechanical issues with them.

Also had a Dodge something or other as a loan car with a CVT, the worst auto box I've ever used.

 

Cheers

Lee

[logiclee]

VAG got the whole vRS thing massively wrong with the Mk II. The manual CR140 Ibiza FR and the manual CR140 Polo both outsell the automatic petrol equivalents and it won't be long before you can buy a Mk II vRS for less than a Mk I. People like diesels. People like manuals. Add in the fact that the early vRS's were tarred with DSG and oil consumption issues and you'd have to say they got wrong.

Now, a manual vRS with a CR170 in it would sell like hot cakes. Even if it does look like postman pat's van.

Just kidding!

 

The 2.0TDi engine wouldn't fit the Mk2's engine bay when the vRS was launched.