I'm really looking forward to trying it out. All the reviews say the golf is fun and more involving than the S3 (dunno how VW have dialled in a difference).

That's what I love about the M135i - it's hugely fun at sane speeds. The engine sounds like a beast even on light throttle and that rear drive wiggle out of corners and rounabouts is a lot of fun without going anywhere near silly speeds (sport plus mode allows more rear slip whereas the other modes the electronics keep the back end nailed down).

Fingers crossed the R gets my man-juices flowing too! I'm sure it will, albeit in a different way :-)

Fun picking your teeth off the floor as you crawl out of the broken windscreen and back through the gap you just made in the hedge!

Judge ye not my driving style(and some little skill) or a comparison with yours,lol

Edited 11 December, 201411 yr by vrskeith

Fun picking your teeth off the floor as you crawl out of the broken windscreen and back through the gap you just made in the hedge!

Doesn't sound like much fun! I reckon I'd be much less likely to bin a Golf R in the wet than a FWD Leon...

From my test drives in the S3 and the R id say (even though they are the same drivetrain) they actually feel a little different. Id say VAG have engineered the differences in small aspects of the suspension setup such as having bushes with different firmness values - its nothing more major than that. The S3 is more relaxed, less focused than the R and to me the R is just sharper and more of what I like - both will get someone down an unknown country road very quickly indeed - quicker than the firmer fwd and rwd competition imo. The S3 interior is a nicer place to be imo but there is absolutely nothing wrong with the 'R's - its very high quality and has some decent kit as standard. Looks, I preferred the 'R' and if boot space is a concern, there's going to be an estate version in the next few months. On the flipside, the S3 had the B&O audio option which I was really impressed with - if sound quality is important to you - just better than the optional Dynaudio on the Golf. (Haven't been at all impressed with the cheaper current A4 B&O so this was a nice surprise)

 

Over the coming weeks i'm hoping to sort out a test drive of the Cupra 280, ideally with dealer up the road sorting me out another 'R' test drive on the same day if possible. With the Cupra R 280 5dr now starting at £21.5k via brokers id say its a literal bargain even though it has the 'handicap' of being fwd only - that's now a proper difference to the cost of the 'R'.

You won't be impressed with the unbranded SEAT sound system upgrade. This is important to me, I've spent enough on my home system to claim to have a reasonable set of ears, but the leon suffers from an upper bass boom which I suspect is a trim resonance issue. Means the bass lines are somewhat one note, and a bit flabby. Goes loud though if that's of any value...

Just reading your Beti the Yeti thread, I'm guessing that this is your experience of FWD to AWD:

 

"Initially, the real draw towards a 4x4 Yeti was due to the appaling ability of my Stage 2+ Octavia II VRS to put the power down in the slightest bit of wet. Before that I'd had a Mk I Octavia 4x4 Turbo which I loved, especially for its grip and abilities in harsh weather. I figured that a Yeti 4x4 would bring together the solidity and refinement of the MK II and the tractive ability of my MK I 4x4. How right I was"

 

I'm interested in what you think when you try the Leon. I had similar problems with my sharked FL Octavia, even with an uprated RARB it was still a scrabbly mess on tight bends, even in the dry. I'm still in the "OMG did it just do that" phase with the Leon, it's that much better. I'm convinced it would cope easily with another 70-80lb/ft without adversely affecting the handling. It's probably true of all good LSD front diffs, but in the Octy, if you applied any throttle in a tight corner, it would simply increase the amount of understeer, so lift off to try to balance it out. At sane speeds, I've found that entering a corner with a trailing throttle, there is a bit of understeer as the nose drifts wide, applying some throttle just tightens its line; almost RWD fashion. No doubt at faster speeds and more aggressive inputs it would revert back to understeer, but you've got to be going quick to find that out, quicker than I want to try on a public road anyway. The rear end feels extremely well planted as well, which is either a good thing or not, again depending on your driving style.

You won't be impressed with the unbranded SEAT sound system upgrade. This is important to me, I've spent enough on my home system to claim to have a reasonable set of ears, but the leon suffers from an upper bass boom which I suspect is a trim resonance issue. Means the bass lines are somewhat one note, and a bit flabby. Goes loud though if that's of any value...

Yeah, I had a good listen to it in a 150Tsi 1.4 ST I drove. Id spec it for the sake of it being nicer than the standard 8 speaker jobbie and probably leave it at that as my days of doing audio installs in cars are now probably over... hence why I like a good factory system option. :( The Seat sound system is bottom of the VAG pile imo, Canton in the Octy better, Dynaudio in the Golf better still and then the Audi B&O system by far the best - clarity, sound stage, separation and depth all being excellent for the money they want imo. Still not a patch on friends B&O system in his bi turbo A6 however, but superb for the class nonetheless! Bass resonance issues and door quality of trim construction (mainly in the doors) seems to be the main Leon bugbear from what I can tell so far.

 

Just reading your Beti the Yeti thread, I'm guessing that this is your experience of FWD to AWD:

 

"Initially, the real draw towards a 4x4 Yeti was due to the appaling ability of my Stage 2+ Octavia II VRS to put the power down in the slightest bit of wet. Before that I'd had a Mk I Octavia 4x4 Turbo which I loved, especially for its grip and abilities in harsh weather. I figured that a Yeti 4x4 would bring together the solidity and refinement of the MK II and the tractive ability of my MK I 4x4. How right I was"

 

I'm interested in what you think when you try the Leon. I had similar problems with my sharked FL Octavia, even with an uprated RARB it was still a scrabbly mess on tight bends, even in the dry. I'm still in the "OMG did it just do that" phase with the Leon, it's that much better. I'm convinced it would cope easily with another 70-80lb/ft without adversely affecting the handling. It's probably true of all good LSD front diffs, but in the Octy, if you applied any throttle in a tight corner, it would simply increase the amount of understeer, so lift off to try to balance it out. At sane speeds, I've found that entering a corner with a trailing throttle, there is a bit of understeer as the nose drifts wide, applying some throttle just tightens its line; almost RWD fashion. No doubt at faster speeds and more aggressive inputs it would revert back to understeer, but you've got to be going quick to find that out, quicker than I want to try on a public road anyway. The rear end feels extremely well planted as well, which is either a good thing or not, again depending on your driving style.

The VRS was dreadful for it but other 330bhp fwd cars I've owned with a Quaife LSD have had no real issues although it does of course put the strain towards the more expensive parts, further up the drivetrain. I still think awd is the way forward for making swift progress in this country but am really looking forward to taking the Cupra out.

How about a Cupra 4WD conversion...oh wait.

Megane has and is the drivers choice, but it's just too plain inside and has the indifferent build quality that only the French can muster. I wouldn't relish the 600 mile round trip I do every month in it up and down the motorways.

It would be interesting to see Autocar or Autoexpress or Evo undertake a Leon 280 v BMW 135i test, track and road.

 

Or stever750 v Furbytom. There is only one way to sort this out ."FIGHT"!!

Edited 10 January, 201511 yr by vrskeith

Hello,

Good video. I'd pick a BMW tbh honest if I was after a performance car - my 3.0 straight six bmw was my favourite ever engine - great fun!

Fun is underestimated - it matters more to me than 0-60 times, bhp figures etc etc :0)

It would be interesting to see Autocar or Autoexpress or Evo undertake a Leon 280 v BMW 135i test, track and road.

 

Or stever750 v Furbytom. There is only one way to sort this out ."FIGHT"!!

Haha I'm not sure there is any animosity Keith, just banter and discussion ;-)

I'd like to see a motoring mag or website get ALL the hot hatches together for a mega test shoutout. S3, Golf R, Leon 280, Octavia vRS, M135i, A45 etc etc

Haha I'm not sure there is any animosity Keith, just banter and discussion ;-)

I'd like to see a motoring mag or website get ALL the hot hatches together for a mega test shoutout. S3, Golf R, Leon 280, Octavia vRS, M135i, A45 etc etc

Tom /Stever,

 

Was only jesting guys,but my point was that it would be interesting to see the Hot FWD HATCH against the RWD VERSION(Standard cars Stever) .Similar to the video Steve Sutcliffe did with the R v 280,keeping it simple. Basis of this Thread. 

 

Agree with you Tom, having road tested all the motors you mentioned above and others, when I was deciding on the R for me.

Did get a bit grey cell taxing, when I was deciding though but I appreciate your point.

However,  much fun was had as part of my selection process.

 

Trying to put a handle on your as others use of the word "FUN" in this context . Mainly biased towards the mix of open roads for me but appreciate others also desire the buzz of the track day "FUN" experience.

 

Enjoy your preferred motors guys in the broadest sense of Fun.

 

Good weather day down South today, so will get out for a quick, safe spin later myself.

 

PS.

Interesting to note, when individually reviewed by Autocar both received 4STAR rating but in their top five best hatches,they rate Leon is 4th and M135i 5th.

Appreciate that many others are missing from their list.

 

.

Edited 11 January, 201511 yr by vrskeith

Original Autoexpress review video :https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5t2jT6SiiA&feature=player_embedded

Mix for you Tom ,they didn't have an individual video :https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=UFQRy6KCEBs

Nearest comparison on a dry track test.

Bloody close but interesting track VFM BASE CAR.

Check out fasts one lap times!

Would be interesting to see the effect of the Performance Pack on the Leon Cupra for £2.5 k investment.

Edited 11 January, 201511 yr by vrskeith

The Cupra pack makes it go fastest around the 'ring, until Honda smash it probably. For me the Brembo brakes and sticky tyres are pointless for the road, in any case  I work for the UK distributor for Brembo so an upgrade would be easy, though I'm only going to fit the sport pads on the standard discs, more than adequate for the road.

 

I'd love to try a 135i out, I'm a big fan of the straight six and RWD, I did seriously consider a 335d estate but it's diesel, and I just so much prefer a petrol engine. VAG have got the 2.0 tsi to rev manically at the top end in the way a diesel simply doesn't, highly addictive, and it's on the Golf, seat, Audi for all the enjoy. 

 

BTW no animosity here, I didn't even realise Tom and I were of that different an opinion! Have you tried the R yet Tom? 

 

I think there should be a sub category at the next Brisky national meet - non skoda hot hatches above 300 bhp category with our won separate parking area (and yes my cupra will be well over that threshold within the next 3 weeks)

 

I'd love to try a 135i out, I'm a big fan of the straight six and RWD, I did seriously consider a 335d estate but it's diesel, and I just so much prefer a petrol engine. VAG have got the 2.0 tsi to rev manically at the top end in the way a diesel simply doesn't, highly addictive, and it's on the Golf, seat, Audi for all the enjoy. 

 

BTW no animosity here, I didn't even realise Tom and I were of that different an opinion! Have you tried the R yet Tom? 

 

Haha yeah I don't remember us having any kind of disagreement, I'm sure Keith made that bit up in jest lol!

Not driven the R yet. I'm itching to have a go in one but the demands of juggling work and a 10mnth old baby mean time is at a premium at the moment! There is also a lack of dealers in my part of the world so would involve a mini road-trip to get to one. I'll try and sort a drive soon tho, preferably in the wettest greasiest conditions available..... :-)

http://www.pistonheads.com/news/default.asp?storyId=31507&utm_source=2015-1-20&utm_medium=email&utm_content=html&utm_campaign=newsletter

PistonHeads fleet Seat Leon 280

Edited 20 January, 201511 yr by vrskeith

I've not seen any apart from the ones in the Newport dealer, not even one here in Pembs SEAT dealer!

 

not the fairest of comparisons if you're being truly objective; a REVO'd Fiesta, what happened to Mountune? And why did they not compare a REVO'd Cupra, just to even things out a bit? Not much you can do about the chassis dynamics granted, but the others they could. 

Initial review of Autoexpress Long term   Leon Cupra.

 

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/seat/leon/90146/long-term-test-review-seat-leon-cupra

Initial review of Autoexpress Long term   Leon Cupra.

 

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/seat/leon/90146/long-term-test-review-seat-leon-cupra

Cupra 280.

 

I've only seen the 265 mentioned a few times, and a few forum posters elsewhere suggest it's not worth the extra for the 280 given there's only a couple of tenths to 60. Given both versions are rated at the same max torque, it must mean that the 280 revs higher and/or the torque curve stays flatter for longer up the rev range. 

Some might just prefer not to go for the top of the Range / price range, maybe buying a keeper they can afford,

maybe they do not want all the features, or the Bigger Alloys, just the car and the manual gearbox.

http://carwow.co.uk/blog/SEAT-Leon-Cupra-Review-933

Edited 25 January, 201511 yr by goneoffSKi

One for you George. you know you want too.

 

Cheapest on Seat UK used website- good spec. http://www.supercar.co.uk/UsedCarImage.aspx?Id=604823940&Width=113&Height=75&View=1&DefaultImage=seat&OfficeId=1&UC=2

 

http://www.supercar.co.uk/UsedCarImage.aspx?Id=604823940&Width=420&Height=280&View=1&DefaultImage=seat&OfficeId=1&UC=2

£22495

 

Sure you could get that for under £22k.

 

Keep in standard!

Edited 25 January, 201511 yr by vrskeith

Tough one there, for more practicality.

The Ford Mondeo Titanium Estate 240 ps Automatics are lots of car for possibly 'Much Cheapness'.

So i must wait and see what the Leon Cupra ST is like.

Thanks,but did you watch it?

Any comments

Yes

And if you'd put the link up in the first post no-one would have had to ask where the link was