I was wondering if anybody could give me some educated comments on my predicament.

My wife's BMW 520d manual developed an annoying clutch problem. 

73k miles and always well serviced,

Car at idle in neutral stationery being noisy. Depress the clutch pedal and almost immediately a louder noise starts in sync with engine revs. past 2/3rds pedal travel it stops completely.

Shifting up say from 2nd to 3rd I can feel vibrations at the end of the clutch pedal travel, doesn't happen on downshifts and I cannot feel in higher gear than 3rd to 4th.

Clutch operates perfectly well apart form that, no slip or drag (tested) gear changes smooth and absolutely no jerkiness on setting off.

I am no mechanic mind you but I suspect a throw out bearing failure.

 

What are your thoughts?

Was ferreting around da toobe and found this. It sound exactly like mine

 

 

Thoughts?

Could be bearing like you said.

 

The N47 engine and gearbox do have a history or Clutch/Flywheel problems affecting early cars. That was diagnosable by juddering when pulling away..

 

Either way its probably worth getting it checked out!

My thoughts were "thrust bearing" (I think this is sometimes call ed the "throw out bearing") of if applicable a DMF issue. Either way, a reasonable to deal with garage should be prepared to confirm/deny diagnosis for free, and if we're right it's a box out job.

thrust bearing is perhaps the correct name

What I am not sure is whether just the bearing can be changed (no need to touch anything else really ) or the whole thing comes as a clutch kit (including all the seals bolts etc) and then, having the box out, makes sense to change the whole contraption? Garages tend to shy away from doing the thrust bearing only and want to do the whole clutch job. 

I am waiting for a quote form an independent specialist right now, both for thrust bearing only and the whole new clutch, which would include the thrust bearing as well. 

I am banging on about it as I am after some practical knowledge here since by no means I know all there is to know about practicalities of changing clutches in this car so all your thoughts are appreciated, thank you .

Just to make it clear, I want sell the car ASAP as I need an estate (this is saloon and lacking necessary space now) and clutch as such works fine. 

Problem is, when you start digging you may end up changing the dual mass fly wheel and the parts knocking at £500 plus at least 4 hrs (if not more) labour @circa £90-80/hr

You can get the parts separately (or used to be able to anyway); If I was doing it myself on the mainland with same day or next day parts I'd take it down and check wear on the friction plate (and DMF) before ordering.

 

As to labour rates, I don't know about where you live, but there's an independant specialist near my Mum (B for BMW, Clydebank, Scotland) who employ BMW trained staff, but their labour rate isn't funding a new car showroom so it's only £50 an hour. Worth looking for someone similar and convenient?

Spoke with the garage. They've just done same job yesterday and had to change the dual mass flywheel as well as that was the reason why the bearing failed. They would be happy to do the thrust bearing only but with a large amount of grumbling . They hourly rates are £70/hr. Worst case scenario with dual mass flywheel and clutch kit needing work I am looking at £1100 outlay ... He had no clue as to the price of thrust bearing alone as they almost always come as a part of the clutch kit @ £157, not bad in itself. I am not going to get more than £6k for this car, £6.5k if I am lucky as it has low miles for its age and has just been fully serviced Oct last year inc front pads and rotors and brake fluid. I need to see what part exchange price I could get. If it is going to be around £5k I am not going to bother really . 

I will try a different garage, see what they say...

They called me again, Thrust bearing and fork assy only £500 all in - only few of them in the whole country and only directly from BMW...

I can see not fitting just the bearing when the clutch kit is less than the price of dropping the box (a bit like changing VAG water pumps with cambelts). Some of the other prices are well hefty, but if you presented the car to me as a buyer with the noisy bearing I'd start looking for the price chipping £1500 and it's worth too much to scrap.

Oh no, scraping is not an option! 

If it was in perfect condition it can easily fetch £7.5k private judging by the asking prices on various websites.

I could let it go for £5.5-£6.0k no problem as is. Bottom line is I will not be getting my money back in any way shape or form and all I will get in return is tons of wasted time...

Maybe I just sell as is with all laid bare for a buyer to make a decision? 

Or just do a part-ex at the main dealer? Problem with the last option is that I will be overpaying top the tune of £2k on a purchase price while at the same time losing on the trade-in so double whammy...

 

If I only had a car ramp for one weekend...

To me i would say it will be the flywheel

Mine is exactly the same

The root cause is the clutch delay valve which wears out the clutch and flywheel prematurely

And i have done 20k so far on my rattly flywheel and its still going so its not a job that needs doing straight away. You can leave it for a bit untill you save the cash

That's good to hear . Thing is I want to sell the car ASAP as I need to buy circa 2year old 520d Touring

That's good to hear . Thing is I want to sell the car ASAP as I need to buy circa 2year old 520d Touring

I went to trade my rattly 320d into bmw. They didnt even test drive it or hear the engine running just looked at the bodywork and gave me a trade in price.

I decided not to go for the finance in the end so kept mine

I was suprised! You will find car salesmen arent mechanics! Try find a woman salesperson

Ha ha ha, that is a good one! Will do Sir!

And, if they do spot it, ask to talk to the dealer principal, and start talking about things like his opportunity cost of fixing it against the overhead rate.

sounds like relesae bearing is sticking or flywheel has collapsed.

I spoke with two different mechanics. They are both of the same mind whereby the thrust bearing replacement could perhaps quieten the whole thing down and even remove the noise completely but the root cause is the faulty dual mass fly wheel. To do a proper job one needs to replace everything i.e. flywheel and clutch kit, which include thrust bearing, fork and clutch itself. On Eurocarpats those will set me back £384. I got a very good "for friends only" spannering time price of £300 so looking at £700 I will never see again. Still £400 better than the best independent quote I got so far . Body work needs £500 (friends only price) body shop work...

 

On a bright side I've been to a main dealer today as they advertised a car which I wanted to buy. When I turned up lunch time ******s told me they sold it almost a week ago and that they are too busy to update the website due to new reg plates coming in and everybody going bonkers on that account... I was fekking livid!

Where is the positive side? Chap had a look at the car for part-ex valuation purposes and did not notice a thing lol.

If he gives me a price I want for it happy days! He had a car I wanted to buy but £2k over my max budget. He said he will see what can be done about it. I obviously dangled finance deal carrot in front of his eyes which lit up instantly. They must be getting really hefty provisions on financing :(.

 

I will chase him tomorrow morn to see if he was able "to do something about it " lol.

 

 

sounds like relesae bearing is sticking or flywheel has collapsed.

The consensus seems to be a faulty dual mass fly wheel (they develop play in it which should not be there when frequent short trips are undertaken and this how SWMBO drives it) which has in turn caused the thrust (release) bearing to crap out on me and throw up a racket each time the clutch pedal is in mid travel. Otherwise all works perfectly fine and 95% people would not even notice there is anything wrong with the car!

Told ya!

Im in the same boat

Do i get rid or invest £700 i will never see again

He he he, I asked the salesman "Do you want me to pop the hood" to which he replied "No, no point, I would not know what I am looking at" :D.

I will have his number on a speed dial!

NO need for that, the price he gave me for my car was simply an insult, £500 lower than WBAC! They simply take it straight to an auction so as long as it is in working order and has no glaring accident damage they will take it.

£4380 - they can shove it frankly !

 

To sort everything out which needs sorting on the car I have to spend £1200 and I will be able to sell it easily for £7000 and if lucky £7500.

Soma basic maths 7500-1200-4500 (adjusted WBAC price) => leaves me with £1800 better off is I do all the work compared to trade-in or WBAC. 

 

Another option is to simply put it on the market for say £6000 without doing anything at all and hope a right buyer will come along. 

 

Thoughts?

NO need for that, the price he gave me for my car was simply an insult, £500 lower than WBAC! They simply take it straight to an auction so as long as it is in working order and has no glaring accident damage they will take it.

£4380 - they can shove it frankly !

To sort everything out which needs sorting on the car I have to spend £1200 and I will be able to sell it easily for £7000 and if lucky £7500.

Soma basic maths 7500-1200-4500 (adjusted WBAC price) => leaves me with £1800 better off is I do all the work compared to trade-in or WBAC.

Another option is to simply put it on the market for say £6000 without doing anything at all and hope a right buyer will come along.

Thoughts?

You have to spend £1200 whichever way you do it. Be it in repairs or in lowered sale price.

So you might aswell fix the issues and then you have a wider sale market

And potentially earn up to £2000 more.

As I was told by the salesman that as long as there is no damage they auction the cars so don't bother checking them that much

If it has more than 75k miles and doesnt have full bmw history bmw are not interested in selling it on, goes to auction