'Should the United Kingdom remain a member of the European Union or leave the European Union?

[trundlenut]

Its demonising white males its run by 'operation black vote' its not in the least bit stereotyping is it? I can't think of another race or group that you could get away with this type of poster other than a white male. The message isn't clear if they have to try to explain it but no justification can excuse this blatant racism. The sad thing is it will mobilise black and minority voters to remain in the EU its a nasty but effective campaign being waged.

I think I was replying to your original unedited post as you changed it.

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[Scribbler]

I think I was replying to your original unedited post as you changed it.

Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk

 

I think you mean Moley took my post and edited the content. I only edited it for spelling mistakes I think.

[@Lee]

The best bit is article 49, if we changed our minds and rejoined says we have to accept all eu laws, adopt the euro, lose our veto, join the schengen area and kiss goodbye to any rebate & subsidies we currently enjoy.

Which is the biggest reason we should remain. IF five years down the line we don't like it, we're ******ed.

[Scribbler]

Which is the biggest reason we should remain. IF five years down the line we don't like it, we're ******ed.

 

Or its another form of blackmail and another reason we should leave. The economic prognosis/ projections /forecast is very poor for the whole EU for the long term future. Why would we want back into that? Do you really want to be partners with a group that aren't willing to negotiate and dictate. Personally I think they would be begging us to re-join, infact I don't think it would get as far as us leaving before they start taking this seriously.

Edited 26 May, 2016 by Scribbler

[lol-lol]

Odds moving quickly now...

 

Get you money down soon.  Hedge to remain so when those who want Brexit, Boris the Bozo and associated Loony Tunes they can buy themselves a drink to drown their sorrows.      Live odd so visit and check the latest.  

 

With opinion polls showing dazzling range – from Leave being 4 points ahead to Remain 13 points ahead – it’s worth looking at the betting markets. The below is a live chart, which will update every time you revisit this page. It shows (at the time of writing) an 18 per cent chance of Leave.

 

http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/05/brexit-odds-live-updates-on-percentage-chance-of-uk-leaving-the-eu/

 

Leave18%
Remain 82%

 

This would underline a basic point about referenda: the status quo has a huge in-built advantage.   No matter what the polls say, a lot of voters stick with the devil they know. Or, at least, a lot of people are betting that this will be the case. 

Edited 26 May, 2016 by lol-lol

[Scribbler]

 

Odds moving quickly now...

 

Get you money down soon.  Hedge to remain so when those who want Brexit, Boris the Bozo and associated Loony Tunes they can buy themselves a drink to drown their sorrows.      Live odd so visit and check the latest.  

 

With opinion polls showing dazzling range – from Leave being 4 points ahead to Remain 13 points ahead – it’s worth looking at the betting markets. The below is a live chart, which will update every time you revisit this page. It shows (at the time of writing) an 18 per cent chance of Leave.

 

http://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2016/05/brexit-odds-live-updates-on-percentage-chance-of-uk-leaving-the-eu/

 

Leave18%

Remain 82%

 

This would underline a basic point about referenda: the status quo has a huge in-built advantage.   No matter what the polls say, a lot of voters stick with the devil they know. Or, at least, a lot of people are betting that this will be the case. 

 

 

Sadly the reverse is true. I would like to Bet to remain so that if we do remain at least I make some money out of it however the odds are crap meaning you have to put a lot of coin down to make anything. Much better if your a remain supporter to back the leave side this will net you some winnings and offset your disappointment if the bookies are proved wrong.

[lol-lol]

Sadly the reverse is true. I would like to Bet to remain so that if we do remain at least I make some money out of it however the odds are crap meaning you have to put a lot of coin down to make anything. Much better if your a remain supporter to back the leave side this will net you some winnings and offset your disappointment if the bookies are proved wrong.

 

If, on the remote chance, the British people do vote to Leave the EU, then my job, doing customs entries currently for all the non EU countries, will be much more in demand for doing all the customs entries for the dealings with the 40% of our total trade that is with the EU, business will be booming.

 

I think the last election can show that polls can be wrong where 36% of the UK electorate voted conservative where as less than 20% actually benefit from a Conservative government being in power.  

 

Ironic but true that even if I do not get the result I want it will benefit me but I am and would be saddened to see 90% plus of people suffer from such a result as coming out of the EU.     

Edited 26 May, 2016 by lol-lol

[Scribbler]

If, on the remote chance, the British people do vote to Leave the EU, then my job, doing customs entries currently for all the non EU countries, will be much more in demand for doing all the customs entries for the dealings with the 40% of our total trade that is with the EU, business will be booming.

 

I think the last election can show that polls can be wrong where 36% of the UK electorate voted conservative where as less than 20% actually benefit from a Conservative government being in power.  

 

Ironic but true that even if I do not get the result I want it will benefit me but I am and would be saddened to see 90% plus of people suffer from such a result as coming out of the EU.     

 

1. Remote Chance? I think the result will be much closer than you think, similarly with the Austrian election just gone there will be a handful of votes in it.

2. Last election was a vote against the two Ed's as much as it was a vote for the Tories. People are quite shallow and its as much about the personalities as it is the question of EU membership.

3. 90% of people suffer from coming out of the EU you really perceive this? Nothing will happen with the exception of the ability to shape our own future.

[jlwah]

63% of bets placed at William Hill are on Brexit, but 72% of the money waged is on Remain.

 

Although in general one might assume that the bookies would edge the polls in accuracy, last year they gave Cameron a 10% chance of leading a Conservative majority and Leicester a 1 in 5000 chance of winning the Premier League, so they are not infallible! 

 

June 23rd - Vote Leave, it's the only option that brings with it optimism. Vote Remain to continue wallowing in the EU bile. 

[lol-lol]

1. Remote Chance? I think the result will be much closer than you think, similarly with the Austrian election just gone there will be a handful of votes in it.

2. Last election was a vote against the two Ed's as much as it was a vote for the Tories. People are quite shallow and its as much about the personalities as it is the question of EU membership.

3. 90% of people suffer from coming out of the EU you really perceive this? Nothing will happen with the exception of the ability to shape our own future.

 

I hope you follow your conviction with a bet and tells us afterwards how much you won.

 

We can take what the Bank of England, IMF, PwC and dozens of other organisation or take the words of whom?   Nigel Farage, Bullingdon Boris and now else??

 

It is all hope against expert opinion that we can strike up dozens of trade deal in a mater of months.  I work with the Customs, International Trade, BIS and these thing take many years if not decades.  Years of turmoil is what the vast majority of experts are predicting. If one is retiring in the next decade or working with companies heavily reliant on European trade or inward investment ie car can component companies, beware.   

[lol-lol]

63% of bets placed at William Hill are on Brexit, but 72% of the money waged is on Remain.

Although in general one might assume that the bookies would edge the polls in accuracy, last year they gave Cameron a 10% chance of leading a Conservative majority and Leicester a 1 in 5000 chance of winning the Premier League, so they are not infallible! 

June 23rd - Vote Leave, it's the only option that brings with it optimism. Vote Remain to continue wallowing in the EU bile. 

 

That is why is it called odds.

 

June 23rd - Vote Leemings, it's the only option that brings freefall. Vote Remain to continue to enjoy freedom to trade and travel. 

Edited 26 May, 2016 by lol-lol

[moley]

We can take what the Bank of England, IMF, PwC and dozens of other organisation

All of who predicted the banking crash of 2008...ohh, they didn't did they.

Did they predicted the recent crash in the price of oil? Err, no that's another one they missed. Not quite as clever as they think they are.

[lol-lol]

All of who predicted the banking crash of 2008...ohh, they didn't did they.

Did they predicted the recent crash in the price of oil? Err, no that's another one they missed. Not quite as clever as they think they are.

 

Bank crash (Lehmanns) was a confidence thing which is hard to create paradigms for.

Oil is Geo-political.

 

Trade deals are legal documents that take on average 4 to 9 years to put in place.

 

Being a PwC alumni, judged by their salaries and salaries of people who are ex-BoE, IMF, Big 4, big banks, yep one would say they are paid as the smartest people on the planet.   

[gadgetman]

3. 90% of people suffer from coming out of the EU you really perceive this? Nothing will happen with the exception of the ability to shape our own future.

The main issue will be with any drop in the pound (short term, long term or whatever) is stuff like your groceries and other essentials which come from outside the UK.

But it's not just individuals but also businesses who would be hit.

Would this last a day, week, month, years? No one on either side can say with any certainly.

Many families and businesses out there are on the knife edge. We all know that, your friends, employer etc probably have already mentioned the need to tighten belts further.

So I'd say 90% will be pretty close to reality myself.

People really need to think very carefully about what their vote could mean for their own circumstances rather than soundbites and half truths.

How close to the edge are you, your friends, family and importantly your EMPLOYER?

[jlwah]

I hope you follow your conviction with a bet and tells us afterwards how much you won.

 

We can take what the Bank of England, IMF, PwC and dozens of other organisation or take the words of whom?   Nigel Farage, Bullingdon Boris and now else??

 

It is all hope against expert opinion that we can strike up dozens of trade deal in a mater of months.  I work with the Customs, International Trade, BIS and these thing take many years if not decades.  Years of turmoil is what the vast majority of experts are predicting. If one is retiring in the next decade or working with companies heavily reliant on European trade or inward investment ie car can component companies, beware.   

Plenty of organisations not funded by the EU support Brexit. It seems that if you receive funding from UK Treasury or EU, you have to promote Remain for fear of losing funding.

 

Today's net migration figures http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36382199 (which the BBC would prefer not to have to report) amply demonstrates why Remain live in Cuckoo Land.

 

June 23rd - Vote Leave, it's the only option that brings with it optimism. Vote Remain to continue wallowing in the EU bile.

[Scribbler]

That is why is it called odds.

 

June 23rd - Vote Leemings, it's the only option that brings freefall. Vote Remain to continue to enjoy freedom to trade and travel. 

 

Freedom to travel!, last two times i have been to Europe the French have been on strike and it was bedlam, Oh guess what they are on strike again.

Do they direct it at their other borders no just facing their friends across the channel. We traveled the world before the EU and we can do so after. Look

at Tunisia currently begging us for our holiday money. Do you honestly think the south of France, Spain and Portugal will function without UK travel? 

[gadgetman]

Plenty of organisations not funded by the EU support Brexit. It seems that if you receive funding from UK Treasury or EU, you have to promote Remain for fear of losing funding.

Today's net migration figures http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36382199 (which the BBC would prefer not to have to report) amply demonstrates why Remain live in Cuckoo Land.

June 23rd - Vote Leave, it's the only option that brings with it optimism. Vote Remain to continue wallowing in the EU bile.

Of which of the figures, almost 2/3 are from OUTSIDE the EU - which we already have control over. So leaving the EU has no bearing on those numbers

[trundlenut]

Plenty of organisations not funded by the EU support Brexit. It seems that if you receive funding from UK Treasury or EU, you have to promote Remain for fear of losing funding.

Today's net migration figures http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36382199 (which the BBC would prefer not to have to report) amply demonstrates why Remain live in Cuckoo Land.

June 23rd - Vote Leave, it's the only option that brings with it optimism. Vote Remain to continue wallowing in the EU bile.

And over half came from outside the EU...

Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk

[Scribbler]

And over half came from outside the EU...

Sent from my D5803 using Tapatalk

 

Because we need them no one disputes that. We probably need more from the likes of Canada , Australia & India etc. but we have to keep the numbers down because of the never ending train of unskilled migrants from the EU. I don't blame them if i was in a country with high unemployment i would move to the uk also. I regularly hear the argument that eu migrants are propping up the NHS. They arn't its more like the Asian & African Continent are proping up the system but lets play devils advocate and say that EU migrants are keeping the NHS ticking over. What we should be asking is why thats the case and why we have allowed this situation to happen. Its largely down to neglecting our own training of nurses and doctors creating this vacum. Why? because subsequent governments have realised its cheaper to bring in labour rather than train our own. This has led to wage supression and unrealistic working condition because they know the EU migrants are desperate and will work in these condition. What we should be doing is putting all that wasted money into the NHS and mainly in training programs for UK citizens because contrary to the tripe they do want careers in the NHS if the conditions are amenable. This will take time and short term leave a massive hole in the NHS Staffing. Simple give all the EU doctors and nurses currently here permanent citizenship or visas. until the trained staff filter through, bring more in if we need them but at least its controlled.

[trundlenut]

Because we need them no one disputes that. We probably need more from the likes of Canada , Australia & India etc. but we have to keep the numbers down because of the never ending train of unskilled migrants from the EU. I don't blame them if i was in a country with high unemployment i would move to the uk also. I regularly hear the argument that eu migrants are propping up the NHS. They arn't its more like the Asian & African Continent are proping up the system but lets play devils advocate and say that EU migrants are keeping the NHS ticking over. What we should be asking is why thats the case and why we have allowed this situation to happen. Its largely down to neglecting our own training of nurses and doctors creating this vacum. Why? because subsequent governments have realised its cheaper to bring in labour rather than train our own. This has led to wage supression and unrealistic working condition because they know the EU migrants are desperate and will work in these condition. What we should be doing is putting all that wasted money into the NHS and mainly in training programs for UK citizens because contrary to the tripe they do want careers in the NHS if the conditions are amenable. This will take time and short term leave a massive hole in the NHS Staffing. Simple give all the EU doctors and nurses currently here permanent citizenship or visas. until the trained staff filter through, bring more in if we need them but at least its controlled.

So it is a complicated issue, but when Boris'd it becomes oh so simple. Why aren't the Brexit lot making arguments like this? Instead it is portrayed as all of these Europeans coming here, cause of all ills etc.

The question also becomes, who is going to do something about this post Brexit?

As for suppressing wages etc, it's one of those things that is waved from upon high and then dissolves into muttering when questioned. It may be happening but those who shout loudest seem to know the least.

There's also the demographic issue, the population is getting older and we ain't making enough new ones.

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[moley]

Bank crash (Lehmanns) was a confidence thing which is hard to create paradigms for.

I was in the USA the day there was the 'run; on Northern Rock, which was September 2007, The US news channels said this was a local problem in the UK, but it was clear to most people in the US and in the UK that too much money was being lent out on mortgages and that a crash was inevitable.

Oil is Geo-political.

So the experts are just guess what the price will be next week /month / year

 

Trade deals are legal documents that take on average 4 to 9 years to put in place.

Only because they want to make it so complicated

 

Being a PwC alumni, judged by their salaries and salaries of people who are ex-BoE, IMF, Big 4, big banks, yep one would say they are paid as the smartest people on the planet.  

They're that smart that they can predict what the UK economy will be like if we leave the EU, but they are not predicting what it will be like if we say in the EU 

[@Lee]

Freedom to travel!, last two times i have been to Europe the French have been on strike and it was bedlam, Oh guess what they are on strike again.

Do they direct it at their other borders no just facing their friends across the channel. We traveled the world before the EU and we can do so after. Look

at Tunisia currently begging us for our holiday money. Do you honestly think the south of France, Spain and Portugal will function without UK travel? 

Not exactly a 'safe' country is it?

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/africa/tunisia-bombing-bus-explodes-near-rcd-party-headquarters-a6747166.html

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3480611/More-50-people-killed-including-eight-civilians-ISIS-fighters-carry-massacre-streets-Tunisia-near-Libyan-border.html

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2015_Sousse_attacks

[moley]

Nice to see the French behaving themselves again yesterday. Now the French unions at EDF are unhappy with the Hinkley Point power station project.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36394601

Why we get involved with the French I'll never know. 

[lol-lol]

Nice to see the French behaving themselves again yesterday. Now the French unions at EDF are unhappy with the Hinkley Point power station project.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-36394601

Why we get involved with the French I'll never know. 

 

Storm in a tea cup which the British gutter press/Sky like to blow up to sell newspapers.

 

French productivity is so much higher than Britain they can have a day off and still be on a par with the UK.

 

Glad to see the French Unions have some balls and stand up to labour laws that favour business over the individual, looks like they will compromise now.

 

I went on strike as a UK Customs Officer on a couple of occasions, something you got to do sometimes.

 

Like the Junior Doctors soon brings governments in to focus when you have to pay Consultancy twice the money to cover, the economic argument soon evaporates and bring everyone back to the table again.   

Edited 27 May, 2016 by lol-lol

[moley]

Storm in a tea cup which the British gutter press/Sky like to blow up to sell newspapers.

French productivity is so much higher than Britain they can have a day off and still be on a par with the

Whenever I see burning barricades and riot police on the streets I always think it's a storm in a teacup.

French unemployment 10.5% UK 5.4% Germany 4.8%.

The only good thing to come out of France is the ferry to Dover