Can you help me please TSi vs Tdi & Hatch vs Estate

[langers2k]

So your £30 tax will be £140 next year and hence same as mine. Fact.

 

Only if we both buy new cars registered from 1 April 2017

[vRSAnt]

Best not tell my wife If I have got a girlfriend, she won't be happy.

 

As Petrol Dave posted above fact that diesels are becoming unpopular and unwanted in society, sorry if you don't like it and want to spit your dummy about it, but its just the truth whether you like it or not, there is no need to take it personally - just take account of it and decide if you need to do anything about it.

 

Yeah ok the above is old 2015 changes that confirms there won't be any cheap tax vehicles ( so you will pay same to TSI as TDI - bit of a no brainer there then.

As for existing cars - just keep watching for other changes, I think it will be a case of when, not if.

[Lew0-VRS]

Best not tell my wife If I have got a girlfriend, she won't be happy.

As Petrol Dave posted above fact that diesels are becoming unpopular and unwanted in society, sorry if you don't like it and want to spit your dummy about it, but its just the truth whether you like it or not, there is no need to take it personally - just take account of it and decide if you need to do anything about it.

Yeah ok the above is old 2015 changes that confirms there won't be any cheap tax vehicles ( so you will pay same to TSI as TDI - bit of a no brainer there then.

As for existing cars - just keep watching for other changes, I think it will be a case of when, not if.

If you are referring to me spitting a dummy I haven't lol. Just boils me when people take "what may happen" as gospel. Let's sit back relax and enjoy the cars. I don't care what the government do with regards to tax.

[PetrolDave]

 I don't care what the government do with regards to tax.

Lucky you!

 

Some of us are on limited budgets and don't have the luxury of being able to ignore how motoring costs will increase in coming years (the reason I sold my Audi RS4 in July and bought a 1.4TSI Octavia was it will save me approx £2000 per year in Road Tax, fuel, servicing, tyres, insurance, etc.).

[Lew0-VRS]

Lucky you!

Some of us are on limited budgets and don't have the luxury of being able to ignore how motoring costs will increase in coming years (the reason I sold my Audi RS4 in July and bought a 1.4TSI Octavia was it will save me approx £2000 per year in Road Tax, fuel, servicing, tyres, insurance, etc.).

Why worry about something that's purely speculation?

[vRSAnt]

I guess for some because its more like speculation going onto becoming fact? Like when they report about potential for terrorism

 

Plus its sourced from governments/ councils

( perhaps you have your own sources bigger and better- but I know directly from knowing family working as councillor very close / knowing MPs in gov't that councils and gov't are concerned with illegal limits for pollution as per link from PetroDave, its not speculation its fact they need to do something about it urgently).

 

Tell you what, lets just vive le difference in this case as this isn't something that concerns you or going to make you change your mind. In your case, I'm not trying to, no one cares either way.

I don't even care if I win an argument with you.

 

As long as I get the point across to others to they don't lose out in the long run as they could lose money putting money into diesels right now, I think it could be a mistake. No one was saying you can't enjoy your diesel for the meanwhile, carry on ( I have one myself ) but its the bigger picture that people should be aware of.

I am allowed to clarify that if you don't mind - do forgive me for just wanting to be sensible and potentially save people money ?

[Lew0-VRS]

I guess for some because its more like speculation going onto becoming fact? Like when they report about potential for terrorism

Plus its sourced from governments/ councils

( perhaps you have your own sources bigger and better- but I know directly from knowing family working as councillor very close / knowing MPs in gov't that councils and gov't are concerned with illegal limits for pollution as per link from PetroDave, its not speculation its fact they need to do something about it urgently).

Tell you what, lets just vive le difference in this case as this isn't something that concerns you or going to make you change your mind. In your case, I'm not trying to, no one cares either way.

I don't even care if I win an argument with you.

As long as I get the point across to others to they don't lose out in the long run as they could lose money putting money into diesels right now, I think it could be a mistake. No one was saying you can't enjoy your diesel for the meanwhile, carry on ( I have one myself ) but its the bigger picture that people should be aware of.

I am allowed to clarify that if you don't mind - do forgive me for just wanting to be sensible and potentially save people money ?

I totally get you dude honestly I do. I'm not looking for an argument I suppose I just try not to stress over things that may or may not happen. Governments can never be trusted as we know. Hopefully they will scrap All the old buses and taxis at the same time. Edited 11 September, 2016 by Lew0-VRS

[Gerrycan]

Interesting point

 

".......Ford Falcon AU and despite being a lot bigger car than a current Octavia vRS":

Actually it was lighter car with no doubt less modern systems in than the Octy ! Safety etc.

 

Dimensions

  Wheelbase 2,793 mm (110.0 in)–3,096 mm (121.9 in) Length 4,907 mm (193.2 in)–5,077 mm (199.9 in) Width 1,870 mm (74 in)–1,871 mm (73.7 in) Height 1,437 mm (56.6 in) Curb weight 1,437–1,645 kg (3,168–3,627 lb)

 

Dimensions

  Wheelbase 2,686 mm (105.7 in)^[24]

2,680 mm (105.5 in) (1.8TSI and 4x4)^{[citation needed]} Length 4,659 mm (183.4 in)^[24] Width 1,814 mm (71.4 in)^[24] Height 1,461 mm (57.5 in) (hatchback)^[24]

1,465 mm (57.7 in) (estate)^[25]

^{Gross Vehicle Weight, 1,907kg}

 

Most the owners of the 4.0's are in the 20mpg......

http://www.fuelly.com/car/ford/falcon

 

http://www.fuelly.com/car/skoda/octavia/2016?engineconfig_id=478&bodytype_id=&submodel_id=

 

Unless you talking LPG here (being economic with your information) or perhaps inaccurate information of one ?

,Because on the collective information available, your assumptions seem to be rose tinted - despite being heavier, its definitely a more modern, economical vehicle

 

Also for a 4.0 going back to that time seems it is around the BHP of the current Octy diesel rather than petrol?

Hard to find hard info on this with it being such an old motor but suggest even at 4.0 it was only putting out 172kw as standard.

http://www.powerchipgroup.com/datasheets/5/FOR0079.pdf

 

So whilst getting 2/3rd the mpg of the "all round" economy of the vRS 2.0 petrol you were also probably getting 2/3 the performance too ! Progress eh ?

 

If you do have anything to add to this though please back this up with cold hard facts rather than forum speculation - thank you. Nothing worse grates me that rose tinted "back in my day" etc etc, you aren't doing modern engine improvements the true recognition it deserves.

I'll presume when you wrote this you were having problems with your medication as it adversely affected your comprehension, collation of factual data and general attitude.

Using your own sources the Falcon is longer by 248mm and wider by 56mm but surprisingly lower by 24mm, so generally a bigger car.

The Octavia vRS tsi produces 162kw/257Nm, the Falcon 157kw/350nm, and I'd call that similar.

My first new company car so it was just a base model which would mean it would come in at the 1437kg kerb weight, for some reason you copied the gross weight of a 4x4 at 1907kg but the vRS tsi tare mass is 1397 kg - similar (although I always thought the Falcon was a little more than than 1437kg).

CD drag for the Falcon was 0.29, a mere .01 less than an Octavia but the Falcon would have a larger frontal area for slightly higher overall drag.

The fact that the Octavia is faster, safer and meets far higher emissions standards is not disputed or relevant.

The consumptions you quote from Fuelly are to be expected, these cars are hopeless in town and Australia is a highly urbanised society.

My Falcon was possibly an exception but I serviced three separate sites that were coincidentally all about 450km away so it was fun to see if I could do a round trip on one 65 litre tank. but as there was always some incidental mileage involved I never quite did it, chickening out when over 900 km had been covered on several occasions and taking about 63 litres to refuel. So I probably bettered 40mpg travelling at whatever speed limit prevailed but would take just under 5 hours.

 

You must also consider that the Falcon only had a two valve head, low compression to run our 's***e' 91 Octane fuel and no variable cam timing,

In the specific set of circumstances of a longer distance cruise it seems that the reported Octavia vRS consumption does not represent as much of an efficiency improvement for all its tech as you might expect.

 

The OP will only be doing 5000 miles a year (unsuitable for diesels) so I'd still go the petrol version especially if what PetrolDave says about diesel vehicle access possibly being limited to City centres is true could effect the situation where he is carrying wheelchair bound person (?)

Edited 12 September, 2016 by Gerrycan

[vRSAnt]

Ha   I made a mistake with kw comparison, its not a property I'm used to and I overlooked the conversion of this from bhp to quickly try and understand the stats of your old car.

( Half the problem here is finding a website that offers decent stats you can compare all the cars in the world like you can do with CPUs )

 

They are closer performance but with far better potential / real world economy on the Octavia - sigificant design improvement on past cars for only 10ish years.

 

I would agree that the OP ought to seriously look at the petrols particularly the smaller ones if economy is the key though.

 

In my case I've been spoiled by the performance of the Fabia vRS and nothing less than the Petrol vRS will do for me as its in a different league to the other engine combinations, but still, with very reasonable performance if you compare to old ones like yours or newer big performance cars like Nissans with similar 20mph or less ( which many of us would struggle to justify). I know someone with a VRS 6.0 and that's not really that much better on performance but everything else cost a lot more to run including fuel £££

 

Looking at official stats, Octy 220 TSI offers only about 11 mpg less than the 1.4 TSI on paper,

( whilst offering 220hp instead of 138hp, and 350N insead of 250Nm and 6.8* seconds to 60 compared to a 8.5 ) -

I think that is quite remarkable and makes justifying owning a vRS not at all difficult for the petrolhead looking from more of a conservative slant on fuel, tax etc.......

 

I don't think their upper limits on economy are so unrealistic.

They claim 56 mpg on your engine, so real world you are probably maxing only 50mpg in real world, presumably you are quite chuffed with that ?

 

For some odd reason the Diesel guys that are apparently claiming far worse than claimed ( with some massive variances between different drivers oddly I'm not sure why this is ), you aren't seeing thread after thread of TSI owners doing this so I don't think there is a problem personally.

 

If you don't want one that's fine though, you are welcome to stick with somewhat slower, but better economy TSI engines, no one's forcing you to have one

Edited 12 September, 2016 by vRSAnt

[Lew0-VRS]

For some odd reason the Diesel guys that are apparently claiming far worse than claimed ( with some massive variances between different drivers oddly I'm not sure why this is ), you aren't seeing thread after thread of TSI owners

Os achievable if you drive like a granny lol

Edited 12 September, 2016 by Lew0-VRS

[vRSAnt]

Yeah similar to my Fabia 1 ( I think I had that trailing lorries in lane 1 too, I think 60mph was the sweet spot).

 

Probably done it a few times also in "oh sht" just very close to running out of out fuel moments also underestimating my consumption ( had it reading 0 a few times for quite a few miles lol).

Though in reality its also quite easy to drive it hard and get at very least, 40mpg and not much higher.

 

The fact there are such massively different claims between different users, suggest the following:

either really poor servicing from Skoda, poor setup between different cars of different MY builds, or massively different driving styles and combinations of driving (like poor braking, massively different countries/inclines, or all of the above.

 

Personally I prefer not having tarnished brake disks and don't mind braking a bit aggresively from time to time, but certainly progressive driving styles (learn lesson from more advanced motorcyclists and drivers, look well ahead reading the road) can do wonders for economy. Driving like a tw*t rep certainly won't help your econony a bit though

Edited 12 September, 2016 by vRSAnt

[Lew0-VRS]

Yeah similar to my Fabia 1 ( I think I had that trailing lorries in lane 1 too, I think 60mph was the sweet spot).

Probably done it a few times also in "oh sht" just very close to running out of out fuel moments also underestimating my consumption ( had it reading 0 a few times for quite a few miles lol).

Though in reality its also quite easy to drive it hard and get at very least, 40mpg and not much higher.

The fact there are such massively different claims between different users, suggest the following:

either really poor servicing from Skoda, poor setup between different cars of different MY builds, or massively different driving styles and combinations of driving (like poor braking, massively different countries/inclines, or all of the above.

Personally I prefer not having tarnished brake disks and don't mind braking a bit aggresively from time to time, but certainly progressive driving styles (learn lesson from more advanced motorcyclists and drivers, look well ahead reading the road) can do wonders for economy. Driving like a tw*t rep certainly won't help your econony a bit though

Full on tarnished brake disks here and also hofe an advanced bike licence. But I do see why TDI drivers are annoyed at mpg figures made by Skoda. It's achieveable of needs be. But then why buy a VRS and complain. Our A1 185 BHP is just as good on fuel around town. Just not on a run.