Got an issue with my home wiring.

 

Floodlight to rear garden (operated by PIR) to rear garden blew on Thursday night (lit, pop then dark). No other circuits affected and didn't trip the RCD at the main board.

 

Went to change the bulb on Saturday, couldn't open the compartment to get to the bulb so had to opt for changing the unit. Finally managed to get the unit of the wall and put the new one up, wired it in and went to switch it on.

 

Didn't come on so went in to check the board - nothing tripped. Getting dull by now (about 3.30pm) so went to switch on the kitchen light - nothing. Went to switch on the under unit lights in the kitchen - nothing.

 

Checked all the other lights in the house- fine. Checked sockets etc - fine.

 

To sum it up only the three items appear affected - PIR floodlight, kitchen main light and under unit lights. No tripped RCD (which would normally have taken out the entire ground floor lights).

 

I am completely confused by it.

 

Got a spark coming round but if anyone can shed any light on it I would be grateful.

I am guessing there is either a hidden fused/mcb spur somewhere that has blown, and feeds those three lights, is the kitchen the original or has the house been moved about at some point in time??

 

OR

 

The trip has actually gone, but the handle didnt go with it (it happens sometimes), try flipping the breaker off, then back in the "on" position; if you hear a click, it is still tripping. This is assuming the kitchen lights are running on a different circuit to the other lights in the house.

 

I am guessing this was a halogen spot light?? Buggers are awful for this, the enclosure gets so hot it welds the rubber gaskets, so you cant open them; I hope you fitted a LED version, or you will have the same problem next time.

+1 to GentleGiants post, probably the first option.

Warrior193.

I am guessing there is either a hidden fused/mcb spur somewhere that has blown, and feeds those three lights, is the kitchen the original or has the house been moved about at some point in time??

 

OR

 

The trip has actually gone, but the handle didnt go with it (it happens sometimes), try flipping the breaker off, then back in the "on" position; if you hear a click, it is still tripping. This is assuming the kitchen lights are running on a different circuit to the other lights in the house.

 

I am guessing this was a halogen spot light?? Buggers are awful for this, the enclosure gets so hot it welds the rubber gaskets, so you cant open them; I hope you fitted a LED version, or you will have the same problem next time.

It turned out it was option 1 - hidden behind the kitchen units. Who the hell decided to hide it there and why? Class 1 muppetry IMHO.

 

I didn't fit an LED one - I am moving in 4 weeks and given the price difference (£7 for halogen and £40 for LED) the choice was simple.

The Muppet doing the kitchen wiring was probably not an electrician - do you know when and by whom the kitchen was fitted? There should have been a completion certificate for the works. Nail them.

Warrior193.

The Muppet doing the kitchen wiring was probably not an electrician - do you know when and by whom the kitchen was fitted? There should have been a completion certificate for the works. Nail them.

Warrior193.

 

Actually, some of the worst wiring I have seen was done by an old industrial sparky - live wires left stripped bare and buried in plaster, wall lights running off the power ring with no extra fusing, a frigging NAIL in the kitchen spur fuse......

 

(Yes, I know, I am an old industrial sparky as well).

Hmmm, not enough inspection going on perhaps. Call me naive but I find it a little surprising to hear a "qualified" spark would survive long if they did that sort of thing as standard. Generally a good reason for most of the regs.

Warrior193.

Am I surprised ? No- 20 years ago I moved in to present council place. Loose door framing showed power cables in door frame( deffo live, as I've traced them to a live socket). I had a chat with my long retired sparky uncle who struggled to remember when the regs banned this . We did have a council electrical inspection not so long ago. I mentioned this to get the "air through teeth " method of doubt.

Hmmm, not enough inspection going on perhaps. Call me naive but I find it a little surprising to hear a "qualified" spark would survive long if they did that sort of thing as standard. Generally a good reason for most of the regs.

Warrior193.

 

Old sparkies look at the new regs and think "well, if the old method was good enough for "x" years, why change it - and ignore the new rules.

 

I must admit to doing this myself, when the UK electrical rules were rewritten (and largely downgraded) to meet EU rules, I ignored all of the downgraded bits.

Old sparkies look at the new regs and think "well, if the old method was good enough for "x" years, why change it - and ignore the new rules.

 

I must admit to doing this myself, when the UK electrical rules were rewritten (and largely downgraded) to meet EU rules, I ignored all of the downgraded bits.

Hi GG, it's one thing giving lip service where possibly a downgrade in "harmonised" regs is involved - but the practices you mention in post #6 are bl**dy dangerous.

Warrior193.

Hi GG, it's one thing giving lip service where possibly a downgrade in "harmonised" regs is involved - but the practices you mention in post #6 are bl**dy dangerous.

Warrior193.

 

Oh, I am not condoning what I found in #6, I was horrified, but I also remember how bad the wiring was in my grandparents house, and HE was an old sparky as well.

 

The old, unfused round pin sockets werent replaced until he was too old to do anything (mid 1980's), and then we had the house rewired by professionals (while we took him and Grandma away for a holiday).

 

Its a bit like Doctors making the worst patients......

 

 

Kudos to my Granddad, I only found out the full story at his funeral, but after missing out on the Arnheim catastrophe (hurt during parachute training), where only 8 of his REME company got out; he volunteered to drive the munitions trains down to Portsmouth (sea mines); one near miss and he would have been a cloud of vapour.

 

I knew about the Arnheim bit because he told me while drunk one night, but no one knew the rest, not even my Grandmother; the story only came out when the Regimental old boys turned up to give him full military honours.

Edited 19 November, 20169 yr by GentleGiant

Generally a good reason for most of the regs.

Totally agree.

 

IMHO the problem is Part P and not the regs Why do I say that?

 

Because the requirements to be able to certify an electrical installation under Part P do not IMHO reflect skill or knowledge of the person (thanks John Prescott). There are 2 people in my family who cannot  certify installations:

1) My brother, who was on the IET Committee that agreed the 17th Edition.

2) I'm a Chartered Electrical Engineer and have a C&G Level 3 qualification in the 17th Edition - I sat that with many electricians who CAN certify work under Part P who got marks in the exam that were barely a pass but I got 100% (much to my embarrassment).

Hi GG, it's one thing giving lip service where possibly a downgrade in "harmonised" regs is involved - but the practices you mention in post #6 are bl**dy dangerous.

Warrior193.

Exactly why less and less is DIY able these days.

Too many people who think they know it all, and do stupid and dangerous things because they're actually not as clever as they think they are or their 'knowledge' is years out of date.

Amazing that anyone & everyone thinks they're competent to do electrics. Thank heavens hardly any of these experts touch their gas boiler/cooker/fire.

I wonder how many also think they could carry out an operation because they watched Casualty once?

Oh, I am not condoning what I found in #6, I was horrified, but I also remember how bad the wiring was in my grandparents house, and HE was an old sparky as well.

 

The old, unfused round pin sockets werent replaced until he was too old to do anything (mid 1980's), and then we had the house rewired by professionals (while we took him and Grandma away for a holiday).

 

Its a bit like Doctors making the worst patients......

 

 

Kudos to my Granddad, I only found out the full story at his funeral, but after missing out on the Arnheim catastrophe (hurt during parachute training), where only 8 of his REME company got out; he volunteered to drive the munitions trains down to Portsmouth (sea mines); one near miss and he would have been a cloud of vapour.

 

I knew about the Arnheim bit because he told me while drunk one night, but no one knew the rest, not even my Grandmother; the story only came out when the Regimental old boys turned up to give him full military honours.

It;s interesting how a lot of the old uns didn't like to talk about their war experiences, my dad fought with 22 inf.btn. (NZ) - North Africa and Italy, and I only ever remember him talking about it once - Anzio. I do however remember him being adamant against me joining the Infantry myself when I signed up for my National Service in the 70's. Some of the photos he took in the Italy theater were a little "raw"

Warrior193.      

National Service ended in the 60's :wonder:

National Service ended in the 60's :wonder:

Not in New Zealand - CMT only finished there in (I think) 1973 or 74.

Warrior193.

Is the war over?

Is the war over?

dunno but the OP's outside light works

 

NS ended in NZ in '72.

Totally agree.

 

IMHO the problem is Part P and not the regs Why do I say that?

 

Because the requirements to be able to certify an electrical installation under Part P do not IMHO reflect skill or knowledge of the person (thanks John Prescott). There are 2 people in my family who cannot  certify installations:

1) My brother, who was on the IET Committee that agreed the 17th Edition.

2) I'm a Chartered Electrical Engineer and have a C&G Level 3 qualification in the 17th Edition - I sat that with many electricians who CAN certify work under Part P who got marks in the exam that were barely a pass but I got 100% (much to my embarrassment).

 

I quite agree, at the time Part P was coming through, I had equipment installed on RN Nuclear subs, shared 2 Queens Awards for Technology, and my company were charging £100 per hour for me, yet because I didnt have the time to sit down and do the stupid course - that made me unable to do simple house wiring?? PEE OFF!!

 

Mind you, I have known a Chartered Electrical Engineer who had neutral and earth crossed in his table lamp !!    Could have been very nasty if he had been at the companies other St Johns, Worcester site, I discovered THAT building had NO earthing at all on 90% of the equipment!!

I always wanted to be an electrician but I wasn't grounded enough so I became a conductor!

I always wanted to be an electrician but I wasn't grounded enough so I became a conductor!

I was unsure whether I was on or off so I became a semi-conductor

I always wanted to be an electrician but I wasn't grounded enough so I became a conductor!

And spent time looking for a POSITIVE earth

Siks munce ugo eye cudint evin spel elektrisun now eye R wun.

Warrior193.

im so glad there are no negative commemts

im so glad there are no negative commemts

Forum community at its best :D