TDi 90 vs 110, Which To Go For?

[JoeyEunos]

Hi all

 

I've developed a bit of a soft spot for the Mk1 Octy estates and I'm now very much in the process of hunting for a clean example in derv flavour to replace my Passat PD130 saloon. Initially I'd set my sights on the SDI models (I have somehwat of a fetish for SDI variants and at present already own a Mk4 Golf SDI and a Lupo SDI) but they seem to be fairly thin on the ground so I thought I may as well broaden my search to include the non PD TDi's too

 

My questions are fairly simple...

 

1. What are the pros and cons of the 90ps models vs the 110ps? Clearly the 110's are faster, but in terms of longevity, reliability and running costs is there much difference?

 

2. I know the 90ps ALH engine has a great reputation, although it seems at some point in production the turbo switched from VNT to to regular type? VNT vanes sometimes block and need clearing, does avoiding the VNT bestowed cars negate this issue? Is there any way to spot or distinguish what turbo type is fitted to any given car? Which turbo type i preferable?

 

3. Is there anything else I should know or be looking out for?

 

Thanks in advance chaps!

Edited 10 January, 2018 by JoeyEunos

[Guest]

The 1.9tdi VE engines are pretty bulletproof and not a huge difference in the 90 or 110 apart from more power. The 110’s do suffer with the vnt sticking on them, but there’s a mr muscle cleaning guide on here. I own a 110 tdi Estate with a touch of vRS ness and they are a great car. Apart from the tailgates which rust for some reason. You can do an EGR delete on them which will help with the carbon build up on the vanes, but if you do longer journey's then you will have less issues with the vanes sticking.  

Edited 10 January, 2018 by Guest
Addition

[bspman]

On VNT issues - provided it's not TOO bad - you can probably get away with running it on shell v-power as I find it tends to burn a little cleaner and is a little less sooty

[JoeyEunos]

Thanks guys

 

After some research it sounds as though the earlier 90ps cars had the AGR engine code and were fitted with a wastegate turbo where-as later 90ps cars carried the ALH engine code and had the VNT turbo.... Does anyone know when the change took place? Are the issues with sticking vanes avoided by opting for an earlier car with the wastegate type turbo fitted?

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, JoeyEunos said:

Thanks guys

 

After some research it sounds as though the earlier 90ps cars had the AGR engine code and were fitted with a wastegate turbo where-as later 90ps cars carried the ALH engine code and had the VNT turbo.... Does anyone know when the change took place? Are the issues with sticking vanes avoided by opting for an earlier car with the wastegate type turbo fitted?

I don't know on the change date, but the vane issue is not a major problem and I put Redex diesel additive in my tank every time I fill up and very, very rarely get any issues with sticking vanes. I use Tesco fuel too, I used to have issues with it going into limp mode (sticking vanes), but after putting in 2 turbo cleaning solutions into the tank and then using the Redex every tank full I now have no issues with limp mode. I wouldn't let it put you off buying a tdi with vnt turbo as the faults a very easily solved.

[JoeyEunos]

Many thanks.

 

Also, after some similar research RE the 110 engines, it seems that the only difference between the AHF and the later ASV engines  is the ASV has oil cooled pistons  and newer software in the ECU.

 

It would still be interesting to know...

 

* When did the 90ps change from AGR to ALH and which is preferable?

 

* When did the 110ps change from AHF to ASV and which is preferable?

[SuperbTWM]

I think the deciding factor should probably be condition and service history on a car that age rather than a minor technicality with the engine.

[Guest]

I'm not sure when they changed, I would guess when the face lifted Mk1 came in, in 2000. Mine is a 2002 and an ASV engine. Personally I would say the later engine code would be the best to go for, as you have found out that the ASV has better oil cooling and upgraded ECU. It goes without saying service history is king with these cars. Mine is undergoing many engine upgrades this year which gains power quite easily (if that's what your after). 

Edited 10 January, 2018 by Guest
Addition

[SuperbTWM]

Don't forget the EVRY mod for that ghetto remap http://forums.tdiclub.com/showthread.php?t=12165&highlight=evry+mod

[KenONeill]

The 110 is torqueier; it may not be an issue for you, but "feet off" driving in motorway jams in 3rd gear is possible with the 110.

[lulzyboy]

Mine was a 2001 ALH so they were in use then. Absolutely fantastic engine ironically let down by the engine mounts collapsing on a motorway.

[JoeyEunos]

8 hours ago, lulzyboy said:

Mine was a 2001 ALH so they were in use then. Absolutely fantastic engine ironically let down by the engine mounts collapsing on a motorway.

 

Cheers.

 

Scary stuff RE engine mounts failing at that kind of speed, not something I've heard much about TBH so hopefully not a common occurrence  Was the car repairable?

[Peterj222]

I had a 2002 110 ASV estate for a few years, it was great, only problem I had was the sticky vanes now and again.

Was going to replace it with a mk2 F/L but ended up buying another MK1 with the PD130 ASZ engine, on a run it is even better on diesel than the ASV (probably due to the 6 speed box) and Ive had no problems as of yet. Incidently I still speak to the guy that bought my old car and its still going strong @ 250K miles!!!

[lulzyboy]

7 hours ago, JoeyEunos said:

 

Cheers.

 

Scary stuff RE engine mounts failing at that kind of speed, not something I've heard much about TBH so hopefully not a common occurrence  Was the car repairable?

I was in Italy when it collapsed, I then bought dog leads and managed to lift the engine off the ground enough to drive it entirely through France and to Spain to a place that tried to repair it. He had to make new holes as the bolts as snapped inside the old ones. 2 days later and €780 down he got the engine in place and filled it with oil, then we noticed the transmission gasket had broken as well. Drove to figures to a dealership to try and buy a gasket and when they inspected the entire car they realised the gearbox rods and bearings snapped entirely. €8600 to repair it and would take 5 months to get all the parts they need for some reason. I loved that car, bought in UK and took it to every single country in Europe, parts of Africa and some of the Middle East.

 

Naturally I flew from Barcelona to the UK and bought another one within the same day :P

[kevberlin]

I owned both the 90 and 110 in estate form. I cannot say I noticed much difference between the two. The 110 suffered from sticking turbo vanes though. I also owned a sdi which was not nearly so nice as the more powerful turbo versions.

 

Good luck

[JoeyEunos]

2 hours ago, Peterj222 said:

I had a 2002 110 ASV estate for a few years, it was great, only problem I had was the sticky vanes now and again.

Was going to replace it with a mk2 F/L but ended up buying another MK1 with the PD130 ASZ engine, on a run it is even better on diesel than the ASV (probably due to the 6 speed box) and Ive had no problems as of yet. Incidently I still speak to the guy that bought my old car and its still going strong @ 250K miles!!!

 

I've got the PD130 in my 2004 Passat Highline, albeit in AWX flavour. Great engine although perhaps not quite as strong as the earlier non PD types. FWIW I'll probably end up trading the Passat in against an Octy estate should the right car turn up.

 

18 minutes ago, lulzyboy said:

 

Naturally I flew from Barcelona to the UK and bought another one within the same day :P

 

Another ALH?

[lulzyboy]

4 minutes ago, JoeyEunos said:

 

I've got the PD130 in my 2004 Passat Highline, albeit in AWX flavour. Great engine although perhaps not quite as strong as the earlier non PD types. FWIW I'll probably end up trading the Passat in against an Octy estate should the right car turn up.

 

 

Another ALH?

Nope, Could only find a 2008 AXR Classic, pictured below in it's native home of Czech Republic. I actually plan on buying a fully specced out 130BHP version from UK very soon, waiting for a deal to pay off before hand.

Edited 11 January, 2018 by lulzyboy

[JoeyEunos]

21 hours ago, kevberlin said:

I owned both the 90 and 110 in estate form. I cannot say I noticed much difference between the two. The 110 suffered from sticking turbo vanes though. I also owned a sdi which was not nearly so nice as the more powerful turbo versions.

 

Good luck

 

Thanks,

 

TBH the SDI's have their place, never having to worry about dual mass flywheels or turbos going pop is a nice way to live but a Golf Mk4 and a Lupo is enough SDI wise   I use the Golf and the missus drives the Lupo and they're great cars, they will 100% stay put and continue to be used for the weekly slog to work and back (10 miles ech way).

 

Our Passat was bought as a kind of weekend car for longer journeys and trips to the lakes etc, with the PD130 engine it feels powerful compared with the NA SDI's, also in highline spec it boasts heated leather, aircon etc and is a really nice place to be! The only problem being that after a few months of owning it I've relised I actually should have bought an estate for the extra room. I was tempted to start looking for another Passat in estate format but it struck me that Mk1 Octavias have only slightly less space, seem cheaper to buy and also share the Mk4 Golf platform so good used/aftermarket parts seem to be more plentiful and affordable, it's a no-brainer IMO

 

In an ideal world I'd like a decent Mk1 estate in L&K spec but TBH I'm prepared to look at any decent estate models that turn up, I've always loved hunting for cars and finding a good one should provide me with some entertainment for the forthcoming weeks/months.

[kevberlin]

Yes. The sdi is a good option. I had it in Golf, Polo and Octavia format. However, as you point out, it does have its place.

 

I really like the Mk1 Octavia and recently sourced a 130bhp beauty for my son. I drove it to Manchester recently and it was first class.

 

Good luck and enjoy the hunting around.......it’s good fun!

[KenONeill]

@JoeyEunos - Well, the main difference between the Elegance and L&K trims is that the Elegance doesn't have leather.

[JoeyEunos]

3 hours ago, KenONeill said:

@JoeyEunos - Well, the main difference between the Elegance and L&K trims is that the Elegance doesn't have leather.

 

Cheers, I'd assume heated seats are also missing in 'Elegance' trim too?

[KenONeill]

11 minutes ago, JoeyEunos said:

 

Cheers, I'd assume heated seats are also missing in 'Elegance' trim too?

Well yes, but with cloth seats and UK temperatures heated seats are something else to go wrong more than a "luxury item". (parents had a Honda Sickbrick Executive with leather and heated seats, and they were hardly ever used)

[JoeyEunos]

2 minutes ago, KenONeill said:

Well yes, but with cloth seats and UK temperatures heated seats are something else to go wrong more than a "luxury item". (parents had a Honda Sickbrick Executive with leather and heated seats, and they were hardly ever used)

 

I take your point and for the most part I agree, none the less having owned cars with heated seats (Passat Highline/MX5) they are one of life's little pleasures. I've got a bad back these days and find they help, also it's nice to have somewhere that's toasty and warm to sit until the heaters start to do their thing...

 

All that being said mK1 Octy's are now at least 13 years old, heated seats are by no means a deal breaker and I'd buy on condition/history more than anything else! Elegance trim level would do nicely

[Guest]

Quick look at Gumtree found this.

https://www.gumtree.com/p/skoda/skoda-octavia-1.9-tdi-130-laurin-klement-/1282422100

[JoeyEunos]

1 minute ago, simspj said:

Quick look at Gumtree found this.

https://www.gumtree.com/p/skoda/skoda-octavia-1.9-tdi-130-laurin-klement-/1282422100

 

Thanks for the heads up.

 

Great that it's L&K trim but I'd prefer to avoid the 130 PD engine and opt for the earlier non-PD 110ps or even 90ps engines (I appreciate L&K wasn't available in 90ps) on the basis that I don't have to worry as much about the correct PD oil having not been used at some point and the cam wear that results as a consequence. I recon the non-PD engines are just that little bit tougher, less stressed.

 

Also mileage is just a bit higher than I'd like, + it's a fair trek away, I'm based in Durham.