Hi all

 

has anyone experienced issues with warped brake discs.

They appear to be very prone to warping on the mighty citigo.

i recently fitted a new set as my originals were yes you guessed it warped. The new ones were original oe they were padgit with new pads.

almost immediately within 500 miles they have warped I have got the dredded judering at high speed when braking and lurching when braking at low speed.

i don’t drive fast brake hard or keep my foot on the brake pedal when stationary to cause the warping 

i have had many different brands of car and this is the first time I have experienced this issue 

was wondering if anyone had any tips or brands of disc that seem to have done the trick. 

 

@Stevie46 - Have you checked the runout with a dial gauge or just said "brake vibration therefore warped discs"? I think it's more likely that you have a resin deposit on a disc, or a worn wheel bearing.

Is this on all corners or one or both fronts as you just say warped discs? ........edit........stupid me they are drum on the rear.

 

Sometimes they'll warp if they get hot, like a sticking caliper or slide pins, I've had this on  a Mazda.

 

BTW I owned a Citigo it was ok brake wise but that was nearly 5 years ago.

Edited 13 February, 20188 yr by MickA

Welcome to the forum.

Just some of the threads.

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/311938-i-had-to-order-new-brake-discs 

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/323774-brakes 

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/328890-citigo-front-brake-discs-replaced 

Might be worth getting the wheels balanced. I had this on my previous Superb I - terrible brake shudder/vibration but it was hard to detect vibration without the brakes being used (althought it was there a bit at certain speeds).

 

Tried all-sorts but it went away when I changed tyres / had them balanced.

 

Also check none of your wheels are damaged

 

So the latest update on this saga 

 

I took the discs off cleaned everything up again all looked perfect. They were perfectly flat put everything together and it was still shuddering.

I thought it must be something else upon looking into brake fluid resouvoir it was massively overfilled took it to correct level with a syringe.

now it’s fixed suprising what effect it had on the brakes.  Never seen it before on any car. It must have been down to pressure in the system somehow would never have thought too much fluid would have that effect 

Edited 17 February, 20188 yr by Stevie46

Sadly my last update was wrong

 

it wasn’t the fluid 

 

i ended up fitting another set of discs and pads even though the other on a have done a grand total of 1600 miles 

 

100 miles later warped again 

 

im at a loss 

 

the wobble is so bad when I brake it feels like the wheel are coming off on the power though it’s smooth as silk

 

feel like driving the thing off a cliff 

 

all bushes look and feel fine wheel bearings all good as well 

 

it was fine for a week after putting a new set on but now it’s back to wobble central

 

had enough the cars going unless anyone can suggest anything that’s not on a previous thread which I have read 

 

 

 

 

 

 

32 minutes ago, Stevie46 said:

Sadly my last update was wrong

 

it wasn’t the fluid 

 

i ended up fitting another set of discs and pads even though the other on a have done a grand total of 1600 miles 

 

100 miles later warped again 

 

im at a loss 

 

the wobble is so bad when I brake it feels like the wheel are coming off on the power though it’s smooth as silk

 

feel like driving the thing off a cliff 

 

all bushes look and feel fine wheel bearings all good as well 

 

it was fine for a week after putting a new set on but now it’s back to wobble central

 

had enough the cars going unless anyone can suggest anything that’s not on a previous thread which I have read 

 

 

 

 

 

 

What sort of discs are you using?

Do you sit with your foot on the brake a lot? 

Is the piston in the calliper not moving as it should? (I.e dragging the brake pads against the disc all the time?)

I have tried pagit and also another brand both were fine initially then the dreaded wobble when braking it’s more noticable  when driving slow 

 

i have checked the piston and there is no drag on the wheels and it’s not binding 

 

i don’t sit with my foot on the brake soon as I stop handbrake goes on to make sure i didn’t create the heat spot even though it’s got the auto hill start feature 

 

i have also also noticed first thing in the morning when it’s minus 1 it’s not so bad a mile down the road it gets much worse 

 

also there is brake squeal even though they are brand new pads and discs 

 

its driving me insane if honsest I have stripped the whole thing apart cleaned greased our everything back together and it still does it

 it’s like driving a ship or someone else is controlling the foot brake pumping it. I can’t feel any pressure difference in the pedal when it does it which makes me think there may be a bush or suspension part to fault. I can’t see any bushes gone but you never know unless I replace everything it’s going to remain a mystery. 

 

My mates one doesn’t do it and it’s the same year 2014

 

 

Edited 19 March, 20188 yr by Stevie46

1 hour ago, Stevie46 said:

I have tried pagit and also another brand both were fine initially then the dreaded wobble when braking it’s more noticable  when driving slow 

 

i have checked the piston and there is no drag on the wheels and it’s not binding 

 

i don’t sit with my foot on the brake soon as I stop handbrake goes on to make sure i didn’t create the heat spot even though it’s got the auto hill start feature 

 

i have also also noticed first thing in the morning when it’s minus 1 it’s not so bad a mile down the road it gets much worse 

 

also there is brake squeal even though they are brand new pads and discs 

 

its driving me insane if honsest I have stripped the whole thing apart cleaned greased our everything back together and it still does it

 it’s like driving a ship or someone else is controlling the foot brake pumping it. I can’t feel any pressure difference in the pedal when it does it which makes me think there may be a bush or suspension part to fault. I can’t see any bushes gone but you never know unless I replace everything it’s going to remain a mystery. 

 

My mates one doesn’t do it and it’s the same year 2014

 

 

Sounds as though it’s still heat related then? Hmmm

I’m wondering duff inner drive shaft cv joint 

Rear brakes comes to my mind. If not working properly it might stress front brakes more. Cleaning rear brakes wouldn't do any harm. And check that parts mowing as they should. After that you probably need another set of brake discs. 

Edited 21 March, 20188 yr by Emil

Had this on mine shortly after buying it (secondhand), had discs and pads replaced and no problems since (about 2 years ago)

OEM pads, or something else? As it seems to be clear that pads are culprit in this warped discs problem. 

Highly unlikely that it is associated with warped disks especially after so many replacements. I think you have even confirmed that the ones you removed appeared ok. Distortion for the effect you are experiencing should be detectable.

 

Others have suggested valid other possible  physical wear issues but you might need to investigate whether it is associated with malfunctioning electronic or valving on the  ABS and/or EBD systems? 

When they are working properly then when you brake hard enough (emergency braking situation) to cause a skid you will get a pulsating feedback through the pedal as the sensors detect and avoid possible tyre lock on individual wheels. In that situation the feedback is correct and the correct response is to apply more pressure on the pedal although unexperienced drivers often ease off due to the unusual sensation. 

 

In your case the ABS might be operating unnecessarily under your much lighter braking?

 

Might have to go to a brake specialist to confirm 

 

 

Edited 11 April, 20188 yr by Gerrycan

For sure it is not ABS. I guess and hope that everyone who have driving licence knows how ABS works.

Emil,

You guess lots.   Hopefully they do understand ABS on car.    Hopefully VW Group Engineers do as well.

 

There is a Fundamental Design , Manufacturing, Hardware Materials or Software failungs on some UpMiiCitigo because the Warped Discs on some of these light cars that are not that powerful and are just being driven on public roads but needing replacement parts from almost new, and replaced replacement warranty parts shows something is up!

 

Edited 11 April, 20188 yr by AwaoffSki

I'm sure that VW Group engineers knows how ABS works. But I don't know what is your point.

Point is there is a Engineering / Manufacturing fault or a software engineering fault on a pretty modern small car designed by VW Group.

Brakes or braking system not fit for purpose on some of the vehicles. Supplier issue, or quality control.

Not on the VW Up GTI it would seem, only 115 ps but they engineered and fitted brakes that will not be needing owners to upgrade them just to be able to use the car in the same way as those driving 60 or 75ps ones that supposedly warp the brakes by just driving the car.

Edited 11 April, 20188 yr by AwaoffSki

After having 3 sets of discs and pads I have established through lots of research and reading that it’s not the discs to fault.

 

they are actually much to large for the car as they are used on other vw made cars such as the Leon.

 

its the pads to fault if you buy cheap ones the metal content is much to high this means they last much longer but they end up warping the disc as they don’t dissipate the heat.

 

if you get more expensive pads they have different material I.e not metal particles as the cheap ones do they wear out quicker but don’t warp the disc.  

Plus metal content create more friction, which is good when city safe or ESP function is needed. Especially when brakes are cold. So I don't believe that they chose cheap but effective pads for OEM pads.

To summarise: you have a light car that you don't drive fast, with brakes fitted to heavier vehicles and you have got through 3 sets of rotors and pads and only one report of having a one-off similar problem.

 

I'm not convinced we have all the facts or that you have truly identified the problem, until more time has passed with no recurrence.

Edited 11 April, 20188 yr by Gerrycan

Drum brakes at rear, which doesn't brake a lot as Citigo is so light. -> More work for front brakes. Less grippy front pads -> rear brakes needs to brake more. Better braking distribution. 

 

Works great in my car. OEM discs with EBC Ultimax pads. Pads changed when car driven about 5000km. No judder after 32 000km.

Mk2 Fabia 2007-2010 & 2010-2014 with 60, 70,75,86,105ps Petrol or Diesel Manual or Auto/DSG could have rear Drums, ABS, ESP or no ESP and not large front discs and not get warped discs or come from the factory with 'not up to the job brake pads', or ones that have people believing they have warped discs that then get replaced under Warranty, then they need to replace, and buy 'Special Brake Pads for'.

 

Many hundreds of thousands of the Mk2 Fabia were sold globally, Polo, Ibiza as well,  with these models

there were issues, many reports of brake issues were not common.

Online, or to Main Dealers or to Skoda / VW,  because the same was on VW's, SEATS & Audi's.

Edited 11 April, 20188 yr by AwaoffSki

48 minutes ago, Emil said:

Drum brakes at rear, which doesn't brake a lot as Citigo is so light. -> More work for front brakes. Less grippy front pads -> rear brakes needs to brake more. Better braking distribution. 

 

Works great in my car. OEM discs with EBC Ultimax pads. Pads changed when car driven about 5000km. No judder after 32 000km.

I am not sure I understand what you are saying in the first paragraph so I'll paraphrase and you can correct me.

Are you saying the (impressively named) EBC Ultimax pads were less grippy than OEM pads so that the rear drums worked more which resulted in better overall braking performance?

 

Were you experiencing brake judder with the original pads?