2019 F1 General Discussion Topic

[camelspyyder]

1 hour ago, moley said:

It appears that the FIA have been taking parts of the Ferrari fuel systems for investigation. 

 

And also from a Ferrari customer team  - and more interestingly  a Non-Ferrari-engined team too!

 

Source - Planet F1

[moley]

2 hours ago, camelspyyder said:

 

 more interestingly  a Non-Ferrari-engined team too!

Red Bull? 

[camelspyyder]

15 minutes ago, moley said:

Red Bull? 

 

You wouldn't think so since they started the whole fuel system witch-hunt last month?

[moley]

1 minute ago, camelspyyder said:

 

You wouldn't think so since they started the whole fuel system witch-hunt last month?

Hamilton and Vettel were both 'surprised' at the straight line speed of the Honda Red Bull in qualifying at Brazil. RB were putting forward various questions regarding what was permissible with the fuelling systems after Mexico and the FIA were issuing technical directives. After one of the technical directives Ferrari seemed to go slower and RB went faster. Just saying 

[camelspyyder]

Strangely, I haven't found this story on any major Motorsports websites, just fanboy pages, and of course the Sun. Could just be fake news. I'm sure the FIA scrutineers examine parts of cars closely at or after every event?

[camelspyyder]

Regarding Honda, most of their best races this year have all been at the high altitude tracks, Gary Anderson ( ex F1 team technical director) in Autosport believes their turbo loses less power at altitude than the others. In a similar way to how cars with poor chassis are often more competitive on wet tracks than in the dry.

Edited 21 November, 2019 by camelspyyder

[Fabia-format]

On 20/11/2019 at 23:44, moley said:

Red Bull? 

 

No Renault, as I understand this choice was made to compare with a team which is not suspected for breaking the rules.

[camelspyyder]

32 minutes ago, Fabia-format said:

 

No Renault, as I understand this choice was made to compare with a team which is not suspected for breaking the rules.

 

Or perhaps because they were the last team to get caught with PU parameters outside legal limits back in September 

 

 

 

 

Edited 24 November, 2019 by camelspyyder

[camelspyyder]

https://www.autosport.com/f1/news/147343/the-main-factor-behind-honda-f1-future-decision

 

Apparently it's reducing spending that primarily concerns Honda. No 5h1t?

 

Well,  if they didn't introduce 4 or 5 new engine specs during a season (instead of the 3 allowed by the spirit of the rules), and didn't run on average double the amount of engines that Daimler or FCA do in their works teams, then just maybe they wouldn't be spending so much in the first place.

 

To quantify that, Honda have run at least 27 engines in their 4 works cars this year (I gave up counting at that point), Daimler have run only 6 engines in 2 works cars, and FCA just 7 engines in the 2 Ferraris.

 

I think the FIA should make the penalties more painful, I disagree with grid penalties but maybe docking constructors points for excess engine use would discourage them - Say a car uses Engine#4 is not eligible for constructor points for the first race, #5 - 2 races etc.

Also freeze the engine spec at the 3rd one introduced, so any further improvements cant be run till next year.

 

 

 

 

Edited 25 November, 2019 by camelspyyder

[camelspyyder]

Honda have extended their RBR & STR contracts through 2021.

[Robjon]

Bo77as to start last due to engine change.

[camelspyyder]

7 hours ago, Robjon said:

Bo77as to start last due to engine change.

 

Thought the penalty for using a 4th engine was a 10 place grid drop? As Leclerc got in Brazil??

 

Ah. Also looking at penalties for new Turbo and new MGU-H.

Edited 28 November, 2019 by camelspyyder

[camelspyyder]

Last 2020 race seat filled. Nic Latifi to join George Russell at Williams.

[camelspyyder]

New motor is giving Bottas around 0.3 advantage over Hamilton on a fast lap today.

HAM, VER and LEC all very close otherwise.

Both Ferraris hit the barrier at the same corner during the day.

[moley]

Ferrari still off of the pace since the FIA clarified the rules of fuel flow. 

[camelspyyder]

8 hours ago, moley said:

Ferrari still off of the pace since the FIA clarified the rules of fuel flow. 

 

...and tactically inept too. Leclerc missing the last Q3 lap again.

[moley]

Ferrari fuel issues not going away.

Quote

Ferrari is under scrutiny in the build-up to the Abu Dhabi Grand Prix over a fuel breach that has been referred to the stewards by FIA technical delegate Jo Bauer.

Bauer reported in his pre-race notes that an irregularity had been found in the amount of fuel declared to be in Charles Leclerc's car by the Ferrari team, and the amount actually found when a check was completed by FIA officials.

A bulletin was issued just 48 minutes before the start of the race confirming the matter had been referred to the stewards at the Yas Marina Circuit.

 

Bauer's report in full reads:

"The fuel declaration of car number 16 was checked before the car left the pit lane. There was a significant difference between the declaration of the team and the amount of fuel inside the car.

 

[moley]

Leclerc finished 43 seconds behind Hamilton and Vettel was 1.04 seconds behind, where has Ferrari's pace gone? Ferrari claimed that their mid season gains was down to aerodynamic changes. Have they taken these mods off of the cars?

[camelspyyder]

Not just Ferrari but RedBull too; at sea level the Honda seems a lot weaker.

The second half of the season has seen a real 3 way fight till now, but today Mercedes just rubbed their noses in it.

They nearly got Bo77as on the podium from the back row as well.

 

When they're not taking it easy for reliability, it seems Mercedes are still utterly dominant.

It doesn't matter how many fresh engines Honda throw at their cars, when Hamilton can still do a lap record with a 7 race old engine on 30 lap old hard tyres .

 

Ferrari and RBR are going to be  utterly dismayed at being taken to the cleaners like this.

It seems like Mercedes have deliberately chosen to flex their muscles on the track today just to put a bit more pressure on the others' winter programs.

[moley]

Ferrari fined for fuel irregularity.

Quote

Leclerc was at risk of losing third place because governing body the FIA discovered before the race that the amount Ferrari said was in his car was different from the amount that was when it was checked.

But after a post-race investigation, Ferrari were fined €50,000 for what had been a 4.88kg discrepancy and the result stood.

 

[camelspyyder]

13 minutes ago, moley said:

Ferrari fined for fuel irregularity.

 

Other team principal was quoted earlier "It's unthinkable he wont be disqualified".  The infamous FIA in action again?

[camelspyyder]

Bye Bye 2019.

 

That seemed like it has been quite a competitive season, but in reality it wasn't at all.

 

Mercedes actually won 4 more races than last year and gained 739 points versus 655 (all down to Bo77as improvement)

 

Ferrari won 3 less ( despite often having a clear speed advantage over everyone else ) and dropped to 504 down from 571

 

and after all the hype, Red Bull also won less races (3) with unlimited Honda engines than they did last year (4) with their much derided Renault's, with a virtually unchanged points haul and Dr Marko's pre-season quote ringing in their ears "We will win at least five races".

 

Maybe next year Helmut? but after today's complete spanking, will anybody be confident of challenging Mercedes next year?

 

 

[camelspyyder]

Had to clip this quote from Autosports report on what was wrong with RedBull #33 during the Abu Dhabi GP:

 

Verstappen's ability to make the finish capped an impressive season of reliability for Honda, which completed the entire year without a race-ending failure on either Red Bull.

 

 

"impressive"...apart from the fact they had to use more than double the mandated amount of engines to complete the season that is, and then have the nerve to complain about the amount they're spending  

 

 

[magic62]

There wasn't a race ending failure, that is correct. 

They used more than the mandated amount due to development of the engine.

They took the calculated risks and penalties to further develop the engine.

 

FIA prizegiving is on YouTube now.

 

Edited 6 December, 2019 by magic62

[camelspyyder]

32 minutes ago, magic62 said:

There wasn't a race ending failure, that is correct. 

They used more than the mandated amount due to development of the engine.

They took the calculated risks and penalties to further develop the engine

 

 

Agree, after all the FP blowups they just chucked another new engine in and it lasted to the end of the race.

but then to moan about the cost of F1 after using 27 Saturday/Sunday engines between 4 cars...

 

The 3 engine rule they (Honda) completely ignored was put there as a cost control measure in the first place.

 

And even with all that spend they're not on the pace, except at the 3 high altitude tracks where maybe the RedBull works best or maybe the Honda.

Either way that's still the other 18 tracks where the Honda cant really cut it at present.

 

At the awards Hamilton revealed that Max has phoned Toto about a job recently, so clearly the Verstappen's don't feel Honda is their best bet for the future.

 

 

 

Edited 6 December, 2019 by camelspyyder