2 hours ago, Wino said:

I'm sure they would.

Why do you need to know the temperature? Can you not just adjust it until you're comfortable?

 

It would make adjusting the aircon for short in-city trips easier and safer. With all that city traffic i want to fiddle the knobs as little as possible. If i manage to set it up properly (as close to optimal) at start it will mean less adjusting, more focus on the traffic and more time driving in the comfort zone. For longer trips, the "adjust until comfortable" approach is OK.

 

And i really don't need to know the exact temperature. It's really impossible to know in a manual system like this. If the system was that precise, Škoda would have had the values printed on the knob. A ballpark number would be nice.

I had to chuckle on the way to work this morning, because when I looked down at the Climatic heater panel on my (2003) Polo, I noticed there are temperature markings on the dial.

Looking at an Owners Manual for a Mk1 Fabia, it appears on those too.  Doesn't your car have these numbers?

 

(Apologies for the extreme dirtiness of the dashboard!)

 

 

 

You might want to google for SSP 513 (or 891143C). It's an overview of a MK7 Golf which is very similar to a MK3 Octavia once you ignore the body shape. The interesting parts for this discussion are pages 28 onwards as it covers the three styles of heating system.

 

On page 31 there is a schematic of the manual AC system but notice the only temperature sensor is for the evaporator and is probably to prevent it icing up. That would suggest the temperature knob just moves the 'temperature flap' at a set ratio with no intelligence. Even more so as the document states "There is no automatic regulation. All settings must be activated and adjusted manually, when required."

 

Only the Climatronic system shows the extra temperature sensors needed to correctly regulate temperature.

 

10 hours ago, damjanev said:

It would make adjusting the aircon for short in-city trips easier and safer. With all that city traffic i want to fiddle the knobs as little as possible.

 

I can only suggest you practise reaching for the knob while stationary. I'm sure after a few attempts it'll start to become muscle memory so you can find and adjust it without taking your eyes of the road...

 

Edit:

Just to point out, there is no reference to Climatic in the SSP which suggests that system may no longer exist. I believe Climatic systems were able to regulate temperature which might be why they've dropped the name given the current system doesn't appear to have that feature.

 

Edited 17 September, 20196 yr by langers2k

A manual system is far safer, you keep your eyes on the road and by feel just nudge the control up or down according to how you feel, just as it always was, you dont need to know or see the temperature.

 

I know that my Climatronic regulates the temperature very accurately but the body feeling is something else, setting out on a journey after being outside 20°c may not feel warm enough, turn it up to say 22° c and after a while too hot, back down to 20c on a long journey I end up dropping it to 18°c, when returning from a running training session I will have it on LO and the face vents open.

 

Each one of these means me taking my eyes off the road, a manual system would just be a nudge up or down or all the way to the upper or lower stop.

 

I will soon be driving a non Climatronic car for the first time (I think because I have not yet seen the vehicle) it will be interesting to see how it compares, I have a feeling that I will prefer it for its simplicity and safety.

@langers2k

A quick look at the wiring diagrams for the J301 control unit in a mk3 Octy (e.g. in section titled "Climatic , (L0R) From November 2012" says that the "Dash panel temperature sensor" G56 is still there, so I imagine it has some function to do with temperature control?

 

16 minutes ago, Wino said:

@langers2k

A quick look at the wiring diagrams for the J301 control unit in a mk3 Octy (e.g. in section titled "Climatic , (L0R) From November 2012" says that the "Dash panel temperature sensor" G56 is still there, so I imagine it has some function to do with temperature control?

 

 

Also, the marketing materials advertises the Climatic for the Octavia MK3 FL as a semi-automatic A/C system. There are no temperature markings whatsoever on the temperature gauge.

 

 

@Wino - is that from elsawin with 2013 Skoda data that's been around for a while?

 

Looking on 7zap, the options for a MK3 Octavia are:

- PR-9AC heating only

- PR-KH6 air-conditioning

- PR-9AK air-conditioning system with electronic regulation (Climatronic)

 

Only the latter seems to have any temperature sensors fitted aside from the evap one. Looking at the UK owners manuals available to download, both the earliest and latest MK3 Octavia's make no mention of Climatic.

 

Despite all our conjecture, the easiest way to check of course it to grab VCDS or similar and connect it to a car with manual AC. If there is any automatic regulation happening, you should be able to see if from the measuring blocks. At the very least, I'd expect one or more temperature readings and the flap should change position as the engine warms up as the heater matrix makes the air hotter.

4 minutes ago, langers2k said:

is that from elsawin with 2013 Skoda data that's been around for a while?

No, erWin, downloaded a while ago though. Document has a date 06.2015

 

5 minutes ago, langers2k said:

Despite all our conjecture, the easiest way to check of course it to grab VCDS or similar and connect it to a car with manual AC. If there is any automatic regulation happening, you should be able to see if from the measuring blocks. At the very least, I'd expect one or more temperature readings and the flap should change position as the engine warms up as the heater matrix makes the air hotter.

Indeed. Pretty sure you can see what G56 is measuring within one measuring block group, will have a look on my Polo shortly.

Two vent temp sensors and one panel sensor, as well as the (not shown) evap temp and ambient temp.

 

 

 

 

Searching G191 in the Octy3 diagrams has no hits, G192 only within Climatronic diagrams, and G56 in both Climatic and Climatronic. So it does look like the Climatic system has been 'cheapened down' a bit since my car was made. 

Edited 17 September, 20196 yr by Wino

That makes me think the G56 sensor is normally part of the heater control panel which would explain why it's not shown on the parts diagrams. Can you post that section of the WD?

 

If you look at recent Climatronic control panels, there is normally a shiny black thing on the face somewhere.

- on a MK3 panel, it's between the middle two buttons (menu/setup?)

- on a MK2 FL panel, it's above the rectangular block of buttons

- on a pre-FL MK2 panel, it's between the centre two buttons again

 

I expect on Wino's Polo panel, it'll be behind the vents, much like on a MK1 Octavia panel.

 

The 'modern' ones look something like these:

 

There isn't anything similar on damjanev's panel which make me think it can't measure or indeed regulate the temperature :/

 

24 minutes ago, langers2k said:

G56 sensor is normally part of the heater control panel which would explain why it's not shown on the parts diagrams

 

Yes it is. As I said upthread somewhere. It has the cutest little fan you ever saw pulling cabin air in across it (on the Polo 9N/Fabia mk1 platform).

Just shown as a thermistor within the J301 block, as it is on the Octy 3 diagrams.

 

 

 

 

When did facelift mk3 come in? Was it from feb 2017? I don't have wiring info for those, so may have been giving slightly off-topic info if so, as it may have all changed.

Edit, yes I see that it was jan 2017. 

 

Looks like they may have taken even more cost out!

Edited 17 September, 20196 yr by Wino

15 hours ago, Wino said:

Just out of interest @J.R., who do you think initially said the evaporator was always cooling, even with A/C off?

This line of yours - "the talk of the incoming air going over the cold evaporator "

Which talk?

 

Cant recall without reading back through the whole thread.

 

I just ran a VCDS test and found the incoming air does go over the evaporator which is cooled but only to the amount needed either for dehumdifying or cooling to the set temp.

 

The figures are my stab at recollection as I have severe short term memory problems.

 

Climatronic est to AUTO

 

Outside temp was 23.5°c

 

Setting the temperature to 16.5° or MIN the compressor current was 0.8 amps (max I believe) and the evaporator temp dropped to and stabilised at 5°, I may need another canister of regfrigerant.

 

Setting the temp to 29.5° or MAX and the compressor current dropped to 0.3 amps and the evaporator temp stabilised at 10°c.

 

So I can deduce that there are fuel economy gains to be made by switching to ECO mode, unless set to recirculating I dont think the aircon actually dehumidifies what is in the car ie clears the misted screen so much as pushes the damp air out and replaces it with drier air, on a dry day I find its no better on AUTO than ECON.

@J.R. So I was right then?  🎣

On ‎17‎/‎09‎/‎2019 at 19:41, SuperbTWM said:

@J.R. So I was right then?  🎣

 

Pending J.R.'s response, I'd say yes, for the Climatronic system, which seems quite wasteful in my opinion. The default situation seems to be to cool air and then warm it again?  Handy when dehumidifying is of value, but how much of the year is that really required?

 

However, I think the situation is probably different in the Climatic system that's the focus here.

As @damjanev's picture up-page shows, there's an on/off button for the A/C, and no ECO button that I can see, so I should think the evaporator cooling is probably minimal or non-existent when the A/C is not switched on. VCDS in the hands of someone with this system can soon confirm.

I can try it on my car, but I suspect it's a few iterations too old to be conclusively relevant.

Edited 25 September, 20196 yr by Wino

2 hours ago, Wino said:

As @damjanev's picture up-page shows, there's an on/off button for the A/C, and no ECO button that I can see, so I should think the evaporator cooling is probably minimal or non-existent

 

Yes I agree.

 

I've never liked the fact that some cars had an air con button and some had an economy button. My mrs never got her head round the fact that if she wanted air con she had to have the 'econ' button in the off position.