New tyres or whole tyre/wheel combo?

[MarkyG82]

Having just swapped to my winter boots I need to think about replacing the summer tyres. I have a set of 18 inch wheels for the summer with 225/40/18 tyres. Original plan was to replace with Goodyear eagle F1 or efficient grip performance. 

But...after fitting my winters today I realised how much more comfortable the 17s are. I have torsion beam rear suspension btw. So I am tempted to sell the set of 18s and get some 17s for the summer too. If I did that, should I go for a set from the VAG stable or go full aftermarket?

 

However, would a fresh set of 18 tyres be a smoother more comfy ride as the old ones have gone hard?

 

My head hurts!

[SurreyJohn]

40 profile tyres are fairly shallow, going to give a firm ride, great for an enthusiastic driver.   However lots of downsides : not comfy, crash over bumps, don’t like potholes, make it easy to kerb alloys, often cost more, will not be appreciated by most passengers, unnecessary unless intend to drive at speeds of about 140+mph

 

Newer tyres will be softer than old hard ones (but depends on brand as to how soft).    Anything with stiff XL sidewall or higher load rating is obviously going to be less supple.
 

Like most people in UK, I do not understand the obsession with tyres designed for billiard table smooth autobahns, when used on poorly maintained UK roads.

 

Not sure which car you have, but if it won’t foul your brakes then going down two rim sizes will make you ride much better.     Often the Irish configurator will show you smaller wheels so is good place to start to get ideas

[MarkyG82]

More info:

Octavia mk3 2.0tdi (not vrs)

Original wheels are what the winter tyres are on so 17. In hindsight I should have got a set of 16s for the winter instead of putting winter tyres on the 17s but you live and learn. 

Happy with 17 as a smooth/supple compromise. Hence the want for swapping out the 18s to 17. 

 

Thanks for the input. I think I'll start hunting for a suitable set of 17s.

 

So, OEM or aftermarket?

[Carlston]

22 hours ago, MarkyG82 said:

More info:

Octavia mk3 2.0tdi (not vrs)

Original wheels are what the winter tyres are on so 17. In hindsight I should have got a set of 16s for the winter instead of putting winter tyres on the 17s but you live and learn. 

Happy with 17 as a smooth/supple compromise. Hence the want for swapping out the 18s to 17. 

 

Thanks for the input. I think I'll start hunting for a suitable set of 17s.

 

So, OEM or aftermarket?

One problem with aftermarket is the problem of finding a single replacement if one gets damaged. With OEM, it should be easier to find a replacement especially if it is a popular model. If you want to look further afield than Skoda alloys, you could try VW alloys.

 

Here's one steel option that is made for the Kodiaq in size 6.5Jx17 ET38 5x112 57.1 that would also fit the Octavia.

 

https://www.oponeo.co.uk/steel-wheel/alcar-kfz-9021#20971290

 

Suitable tyre size for the Octavia with this 6.5" wide rim is 205/50R17. With the ET38 offset, it will increase the front and rear track by 20mm compared to ET48 rims.

 

205/50R17 is a more expensive tyre size than the more common 205/55R16 tyre size. Often about 50% more. You can get 6.5Jx16 ET33 steel rims from the VW Tiguan that will push each tyre further out by 13mm to 15mm compared to ET46 and ET48 offsets. Should certainly help fill those wheel arches if you're into that sort of thing.

 

https://www.oponeo.co.uk/steel-wheel/alcar-kfz-9922#20929934

Edited 11 November, 2019 by Carlston

[MarkyG82]

@Carlston thanks for the input. How do 205/50r17 compare to the more standard 225/45r17? 

I'm looking at alloys in the 7.5 width region to make better use of the tyre width. 225 on a 6.5 seems a little narrow for summer tread to me. If the 205/50 works then I may go that route.

 

Edit:

A quick look on black circles shows the 205/50 to be >£10 more expensive than 225/45.

Edited 11 November, 2019 by MarkyG82

[Carlston]

2 hours ago, MarkyG82 said:

@Carlston thanks for the input. How do 205/50r17 compare to the more standard 225/45r17? 

I'm looking at alloys in the 7.5 width region to make better use of the tyre width. 225 on a 6.5 seems a little narrow for summer tread to me. If the 205/50 works then I may go that route.

 

Edit:

A quick look on black circles shows the 205/50 to be >£10 more expensive than 225/45.

Mytyres list Goodyear EfficientGrip Performance in size 205/50R17 89V at £77.10 and 225/45R17 91V at £68.70. So yes, 205/50R17 do tend to be a little more expensive. However, the 205 size is 1dB quieter, doesn't have a rim protector which makes the ride better, reduces unsprung weight, and is less prone to aquaplanning. 225 have more drag as they are wider, are heavier especially if you include the wider rims, and will reduce the track by about 22mm front and back. For example, you might use an offset of ET49 for the 225 tyres, but only ET38 for the 205 tyres. So you get a wider track if you use the narrower tyres. You have to reduce the track with the wider tyres or they would stick out past the edge of the wheelarch.

 

However, if you want OEM alloys the case goes back in favour of 225/45R17 tyres simply because the rim widths at 7" or 7.5" and the offsets are right for this tyre size.

 

17" OEM Alloy Rims for 2016 Octavia

 

http://www.oemepc.com/skoda/part_single/catalog/sk/markt/CZ/modell/OCT/year/2016/drive_standart/753/hg_ug/601/subcategory/601070/part_id/2543668/lang/e

 

If you were interested in the 205/50R17 tyre size, there's a further argument that 205/55R16 might be a better choice. The 205/50R17 tyre size is about 50% more expensive than the 205/55R16 tyre size. If you don't need 17" wheels to clear your front brake discs/calipers the 16" option starts to look good. So maybe compare 225/45R17 with 205/55R16. 205/50R17 does still have something going for it. Looks of the 17" wheels and the wide track, plus all the other things that I have mentioned.

 

I once drove a car with 275/40R17 tyres on 9.5" rims and I always thought that it would have been better on 245/45R17 tyres on 8" rims with the track increased by 1.5" (38mm) so that the outside of the rims were still in the same position relative to the edge of the wheelarches. And those 275s felt like they had so much drag, plus they were noisy. So in my experience, wider tyres aren't always better.

Edited 12 November, 2019 by Carlston

[Gmac983]

6 hours ago, Carlston said:

doesn't have a rim protector which makes the ride better, 

 

Would a rim protector really affect ride quality? 

Is it not just a an extra lip on the tyre just to give slightly more cover for the wheel rim.

Is the tyre structurally any different to one without rim protection?

 

For the OP

Would it be worth you considering an all season tyre? 

Edited 12 November, 2019 by Gmac983

[MarkyG82]

4 hours ago, Gmac983 said:

 

For the OP

Would it be worth you considering an all season tyre? 

 

For a few years I have run winters in the colder months as I prefer the safety and also the better performance in the summer of the dedicated rubber.  I still have plenty life left in the winter tyres also.

So, I would rather not go all season at this stage.

 

I think I'm looking at roughly £10 a tyre cheaper for 17s so £85 a tyre vs £75.  So if I can geta set of 17s for under £300 and sell my 18s for £250 it would cost about the same and get the smoother ride of more rubber.

 

Do Goodyear Efficient Grip Performance have rim protection?

[Gmac983]

41 minutes ago, MarkyG82 said:

Do Goodyear Efficient Grip Performance have rim protection?

 

I think they do, in some sizes anyway.

 

Higher profile tyres don't really need rim protection. 

[Greenline3Matt]

Goodywar Eagle F1's have an amazing rim protector. 225/40/18's are bought for under £100 eaxh and they're excellent, I had them on my Superb. 

 

I had mine lowered on H&R springs with the 18's and the ride was great, I never considered it to be hard or uncomfortable at all. 

[Carlston]

15 hours ago, Gmac983 said:

 

Would a rim protector really affect ride quality? 

Is it not just a an extra lip on the tyre just to give slightly more cover for the wheel rim.

Is the tyre structurally any different to one without rim protection?

The extra rubber moulded into the sidewalls (and it is sometimes quite thick) makes the sidewalls less flexible. I fit my own tyres by hand using motorcycle tyre levers and a cheap chinese made tyre fitter that holds the rim horizontally at working height while you mount the tyre (cost about £50), and so have a good feel for tyres. You can feel the difference when you try to flex the sidewalls of an unmounted tyre. I no longer buy tyres with sidewall protectors. However, when I do fit low profile tyres (not very low profile tyres), I tend to fit them to minimum width rims so the sidewalls bulge out protecting the rims from damage if you gently nudge against a kerb while parallel parking. Fitting tyres to minimum width rims helps the sidewalls to flex more easily, which gives a softer ride. Many car manufacturers are now fitting tyres to narrower rims for this very reason. 165/60 and 165/65 tyres now being fitted to 4.5" rims rather than 5" rims on the Toyota Aygo/Peugeot 108. 185/55 tyres now being fitted to 5.5" rims rather than 6"rims on some VW/Skoda cars. 205/55 now being fitted to 6" rims rather than 6.5" rims on some VW/Skoda cars.

Edited 12 November, 2019 by Carlston

[Carlston]

10 hours ago, MarkyG82 said:

Do Goodyear Efficient Grip Performance have rim protection?

Goodyear EfficientGrip Performance have rim protection in size 225/45R17 but NOT in size 205/50R17...at least according to the Goodyear EU website and also the mytyres website. However, always check with the seller before purchase if this is important to you. Sellers often make mistakes or omissions in their tyre descriptions.

Edited 12 November, 2019 by Carlston

[Ootohere]

If tyres are XL (reinforced) sidewall makes a difference. 

There are low profile tyre cars on models as OEM and some are not with XL's and some have Rim Protection and some do not.

Rim protection has never made any difference to comfort or ride in my experience, as the protection is at the tyre bead and rim.

 

@Carlston

Since you do not say i have asked a few times are you in the UK,

& what vehicles is it that you are fitting these tyres to with motor bike tyre levers or what sized rims?

 

I find the firmer bead and rim protector makes getting a bead on much easier but then its different from brand to brand, rim types & tyres compounds and tyre types. Some can be a battle, some a doddle.

 

Not many DIY fit tyres or break the bead off rims these days in the UK on Alloys on modern vehicles using tyre levers and bead breakers unless offroading or where the likes when tyre fitters or mobile tyre fitters are readily available.

 

Personally i have had the good the bad and the ugly as well as some totally crap tyres from Pirelli on the same cars, same suspension and the same roads and XL sidewalls and Rim Protectors are not an issue if the pressures are right and the cars suspension is, 

and going narrow and taller sidewall does not improve crap suspension but can maybe please some, or disguise the issue a car has.

Edited 13 November, 2019 by Roottootemoot

[Gmac983]

Carlston.

What sort of car were your own experiences of this phenomenon with? 

Personally haven't noticed the rim protectors making any odds on vehicles that I've had them on. 

 

Things like:

Tyre pressure, 

Defective suspension, 

Runflats, 

Extra load, 

Budget/mid range/premium

 

These things genuinely make a difference to feel and ride quality. 

Even if rim protectors did slightly effect ride then it would be a price I'd be willing to pay to help protect my alloys from risk of kerbing and more importantly from pot holes. 

Certainly on the broken and scarred roads where I am, a minute difference one way or the other doesn't matter, lower profile tyres that typically have rim protectors give a rougher ride anyway. 

Edited 13 November, 2019 by Gmac983