5 hours ago, lol-lol said:

 

I would hope that drivers want to know what range they might get ie how close to WLTP in Standard Temperature and Pressure and other ambieny Scenarios they might experience.

 

We're the tester Ms driving the cars like an experienced EV driver would ? Probably not 

 

I have drive an hour or two and not touch the foot brake.

I slow down naturally or using slight, medium or high regen via my paddles. This get me about 10% more range i reckon.

 

That is how an experienced EV driver could and should drive but probably not how your average car tester would. Or worse the Q4 driver may not driver that way but the Explorer driver might and undermine the test as looks might have happened.

 

 

 

Driving like that in a city environment during rush periods will just prolong the agony for all the other drivers waiting for you to crawl your way along the road, and could possibly set some road rage off in the process.

2 minutes ago, Graham Butcher said:

Driving like that in a city environment during rush periods will just prolong the agony for all the other drivers waiting for you to crawl your way along the road, and could possibly set some road rage off in the process.

 

I never accelerated towards a red light in an ICE vehicle. Not stopping if you can saves more fuel than rushing to the lights, stopping then setting off again.

 

Numpties  get annoyed when you are saving them money?

9 minutes ago, Stonekeeper said:

 

 

Do those figures make sense? 20 X 22kw charge points on a 63amp MCB  using 16mm cable  (50amp) at the end point.

 

22kw is 95amp?

 

63amp = around 14.5kw between 20 cars

 

 

equivalent of 2 home chargers shared between 20 cars

 

Hope they all don't want to go far next day after an overnight charge.

 

At least the heating bill for the flats will go down

 

120 cars on a 400 amp supply. 3.3amp each when all plugged in  = 2 miles an hour.

 

Hopefully someone can explain what i have wrong?

 

I agree, but the system does shift chargers onto other phases to try and balance them, and it clearly relies on not everyone wanting to charge every day, so clearly gambling on most of the cars being used as city cars and doing a very limited mileage each day. That in reality is not always going to be the case and there will be some cases where the management system will fail to throttle people's chargers and severe overloading or disconnection of the supply could occur with all the potential hazards and problems that can bring.

16 minutes ago, Stonekeeper said:

 

 

Do those figures make sense? 20 X 22kw charge points on a 63amp MCB  using 16mm cable  (50amp) at the end point.

 

22kw is 95amp?

 

63amp = around 14.5kw between 20 cars

 

 

equivalent of 2 home chargers shared between 20 cars

 

Hope they all don't want to go far next day after an overnight charge.

 

At least the heating bill for the flats will go down

 

120 cars on a 400 amp supply. 3.3amp each when all plugged in  = 2 miles an hour.

 

Hopefully someone can explain what i have wrong?

 

 

3 phase connection i presume as he talks about three distribution boards.

 

Not sure if that is 400 A each for each phase meaning 1200A at 240v ?

 

3 minutes ago, lol-lol said:

 

3 phase connection i presume as he talks about three distribution boards.

 

Not sure if that is 400 A each for each phase meaning 1200A at 240v ?

 

 

I think it must be three phase to get the 125 at the start of each leg. 125 to 2 x 63. But my point was the end point cannot be over 50amp = 11.5kw = 46mph . So if 20 cars are plugged in to charge the most available to each is still governed by the 63amp mcb even if the clever system can switch phases to maintain the 125amp

 

 

6 minutes ago, Stonekeeper said:

 

I never accelerated towards a red light in an ICE vehicle. Not stopping if you can saves more fuel than rushing to the lights, stopping then setting off again.

 

Numpties  get annoyed when you are saving them money?

I see plenty of those numpties and they take a distinct dislike to having their journey prolonged even more. I always try and slow things down if I can because I know only too well how slow and steady can save you fuel and therefore money, but it also lengthens the trip time and the traffic jams as a result of not keeping up with the traffic flow and thus getting caught up and also making those behind you also have to sit there and watch the traffic lights go through several sequences before you get your turn get past them, because numpties going at snail speed only manage to get two or maybe three cars over the lights when they are on green because they can see a jam further down the road so they crawl along.

1 minute ago, Graham Butcher said:

I see plenty of those numpties and they take a distinct dislike to having their journey prolonged even more. I always try and slow things down if I can because I know only too well how slow and steady can save you fuel and therefore money, but it also lengthens the trip time and the traffic jams as a result of not keeping up with the traffic flow and thus getting caught up and also making those behind you also have to sit there and watch the traffic lights go through several sequences before you get your turn get past them, because numpties going at snail speed only manage to get two or maybe three cars over the lights when they are on green because they can see a jam further down the road so they crawl along.

 

 

How can approaching a stationary car slower extend your trip time?

When it moves you keep moving and avoid the race to a stop.

 

44 minutes ago, lol-lol said:

 

3 phase connection i presume as he talks about three distribution boards.

 

Not sure if that is 400 A each for each phase meaning 1200A at 240v ?

 

He only has a 400A incoming supply coming to the main disconnect that he showed you, and then that in turn splits off to feed the three, three-phase distribution boards which he again showed you on the schematic.

 

Edited 6 December, 20241 yr by Graham Butcher

18 minutes ago, Stonekeeper said:

 

 

How can approaching a stationary car slower extend your trip time?

When it moves you keep moving and avoid the race to a stop.

When I say further down the road, I don't mean a few car lengths away but hundreds of yards and in many cases the traffic lights are biased such that when they turn green, as soon as they don't sense another vehicle close enough to trigger the embedded road sensor, they start the sequence back to red again and to allow traffic from the other side junctions to flow out onto the main road. The council in my city are quite open about the fact that they have biased the lights to take advantage of such gaps, especially if it results in slowing the speed of traffic flow into the city. They really want people not to drive in the city, regardless of what the means of propulsion is. 

Edited 6 December, 20241 yr by Graham Butcher

7 hours ago, wyx087 said:

Not seeing much cars there......

 

Is there private underground parking?  If so, they'd be in my first group.

 

 

 

Some of the blocks have parking underneath

 

Edited 6 December, 20241 yr by Stonekeeper

35 minutes ago, Graham Butcher said:

Driving like that in a city environment during rush periods will just prolong the agony for all the other drivers waiting for you to crawl your way along the road, and could possibly set some road rage off in the process.

 

In the city environment EVs love shaming ICE car off the light and it does not waste power having a bit of fun whap it up to 30 in about 3 seconds before the ice has even reached max power in first gear.

 

EVs are very efficient round town, even more than an ICE with start stop so one does not even think about conserving except doing the braking with regen.

 

It is in speed range over 60 that one starts thinking about the cubic law of aero drag, unless in a Polestar or model 3 Highland it seems.

 

We are awaiting these Enso tyres and next generation of batteries, investors and lecky motors which will move from 90% to about 95% plus efficiency and a few more kj per kilogram.

 

2 minutes ago, lol-lol said:

 

In the city environment EVs love shaming ICE car off the light and it does not waste power having a bit of fun whap it up to 30 in about 3 seconds before the ice has even reached max power in first gear.

 

EVs are very efficient round town, even more than an ICE with start stop so one does not even think about conserving except doing the braking with regen.

 

It is in speed range over 60 that one starts thinking about the cubic law of aero drag, unless in a Polestar or model 3 Highland it seems.

 

We are awaiting these Enso tyres and next generation of batteries, investors and lecky motors which will move from 90% to about 95% plus efficiency and a few more kj per kilogram.

 

Problem there is, once again, the number of ICE cars on our roads still do and will do for many years to come, vastly outweigh the electric cars and hence my comment about making things worse for others still holds true.

21 minutes ago, Stonekeeper said:

 

I think it must be three phase to get the 125 at the start of each leg. 125 to 2 x 63. But my point was the end point cannot be over 50amp = 11.5kw = 46mph . So if 20 cars are plugged in to charge the most available to each is still governed by the 63amp mcb even if the clever system can switch phases to maintain the 125amp

The key is not every EV will be charging all the time, and having ability to plug in is more important than quickly charging. This is the flexibility of EV's, when it's parked, it can charge whenever it is able, doesn't need to be straight away at maximum.

 

63 amp across 3 phases, assuming 240v, is 45 kW.

45 kW over 24 hours gives 1,080 kWh.

1,080 kWh is good for ~4000 miles.

So unless cumulatively, all the residents' total mileage is consistently more than let's say 3000 miles a day to give lots of leeway. The shared incoming supply is not going to be a problem.

 

This is the same with rapid charging hubs. 350 kW charger will not deliver anywhere close to 350 kW for vast majority of the time.

I really like Kempower and Tesla method of sharing charger capacity across multiple ultra-rapid stalls.

 

 

 

2 hours ago, Graham Butcher said:

UK Government have already banned EVs from their car parks in London

You keep saying this, but never provided any solid evidence.

My searches fail to provide any supporting evidence to it.
https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&q=UK+Government+banned+EVs+from+their+car+parks+in+London

 

  

55 minutes ago, Graham Butcher said:

Well here in Chelmsford there are currently approaching 1,000 new flats nearing approval stage that will involve demolishing shopping areas including a mall and rebuilding a new mall with flats above and surrounding it, with other blocks of flats, all of which have zero, yes, that's right zero parking arrangements, so anyone with a car will be forced to look for alternative parking solutions.

This is more of a problem with those type of re-developments, where the developers are probably citing close public transport links in order to not build any car parks. It would be the resident's lifestyle choice to live that way rather than us arm chair keyboard warrior's problem.

 

As for the pictured, I'm 100% sure this has been brought up, current proposed solution is some sort of cross-pavement solution: https://find-government-grants.service.gov.uk/grants/electric-vehicle-chargepoint-grant-for-households-with-on-street-parking-1

I understand it's not a great solution and there is many problems biggest one is not able to park in front of own house.

40 minutes ago, wyx087 said:

I understand it's not a great solution and there is many problems biggest one is not able to park in front of own house.

6.93 million terraced houses in the UK, which was 26.3% of the total housing stock

 

Many with more than one car

Edited 6 December, 20241 yr by Stonekeeper

41 minutes ago, wyx087 said:

The key is not every EV will be charging all the time,

 

True at the moment but when they eventually become the majority people will plug them in at every opportunity to be sure they get charged because of the throttling that will be going on?

26 minutes ago, Stonekeeper said:

True at the moment but when they eventually become the majority people will plug them in at every opportunity to be sure they get charged because of the throttling that will be going on?

Exactly. Then they can offer incentives to keep the car plugged in with head room in the battery left for flexibility.

 

Like Intelligent Octopus Go, but with an initial baseline charge.

Or like Tesla drive on solar, but controlled by grid operators:

https://www.tesla.com/en_gb/support/tesla-app/charge-on-solar

 

As I always say, EV are an asset to the grid when plugged in. People just need to get used to doing it every time parked up.

28 minutes ago, Stonekeeper said:

 

True at the moment but when they eventually become the majority people will plug them in at every opportunity to be sure they get charged because of the throttling that will be going on?

 

I think this will be more than counterbalanced by millions of place that will have excess electrical power. So if my relatives visit me I will have the two chargers, my own batteries, v2v, solar feed to send them away with topped up batteries in their EVs.

 

The place we, facilitated by Greg Jackson, that having electricity is like filling up a flask with water and electricity units is super cheaper abd no issue to give away to visitors.

 

21 hours ago, Graham Butcher said:

 

Well here in Chelmsford there are currently approaching 1,000 new flats nearing approval stage that will involve demolishing shopping areas including a mall and rebuilding a new mall with flats above and surrounding it, with other blocks of flats, all of which have zero, yes, that's right zero parking. 

 

 

It's the same in many places...   Lots of flats and high rise blocks going up in many cities with zero parking provision.  Pretty much everything here in Sheffield in or near the city centre that has got planning approval is the same, with zero or very minimal parking provision. 

 

Not an issue if occupiers are prepared to use public transport and the latter is good but, unlike London it isn't because we don't get anywhere near the funding per capita London gets. 

Edited 7 December, 20241 yr by skomaz
Can't spell

 

10 hours ago, skomaz said:

 

It's the same in many places...   Lots of flats and high rise blocks going up in many cities with zero parking provision.  Pretty much everything here in Sheffield in or near the city centre that has got planning approval is the same, with zero or very minimal parking provision. 

 

Not an issue if occupiers are prepared to use public transport and the latter is good but, unlike London it isn't because we don't get anywhere near the funding we get per capita London gets. 

Yes, people in London just do not comprehend just how lucky they are compared to the rest of the country, things that they take for granted, we would almost kill for. My son works in a shop just 200 yds away from the central bus terminus where all the local shuttle buses terminate and return on their outward trips again, (we no longer have joined up bus services that take you from side of the city to the other, they all go from edge into the centre and return again, called "shuttles"). The other day he waited almost an hour for a bus to show up and this is supposed to be a 15-minute service?

12 hours ago, wyx087 said:

You keep saying this, but never provided any solid evidence.

My searches fail to provide any supporting evidence to it.
https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&q=UK+Government+banned+EVs+from+their+car+parks+in+London

Er excuse me, but yes I did, I provided a document that spelled it out, issued by the government for their own private government only city centre car parks around Westminster, back at the time when we last had this discussion.

Edited 7 December, 20241 yr by Graham Butcher

UK Government Car Parks.  Not local authority cars parks, Council Car parks.  Actually the peoples car parks.

This week seemingly some Railways were taken back into Public Ownership.  The first etc.

That was the UK government and in England.

Like the NHS this week, Sir Keir Starmer.MP.   NHS England that was.  More houses, More houses in England. 

6 minutes ago, Ootohere said:

Like the NHS this week, Sir Keir Starmer.MP.   NHS England that was.  More houses, More houses in England. 

 

Do you keep saying Starmer always talks about England as if he is ignoring Scotland or is it to clarify that he cannot address Scotland on these issues because he has no say?

 

The Scottish Government is the devolved government for Scotland and has a range of responsibilities that include: the economy, education, health, justice, rural affairs, housing, environment, equal opportunities, consumer advocacy and advice, transport and taxation.

I know he can not other than Energy and the Power UK, Defence and some other stuff.  

So just say that clearly for the not so up on anything dafties about.

& the SKY and BBC presenters and News Editors with these organisations could just point this out. 

 

They say "This Country."   Say England if it is England and not Britain or the UK.

 

So he speaks about British People, fair enough, people in Britain, be them British or not.

Then he goes on about the Country, then The Nation.

The Country is England, the Nation might be, or the 4 countries, Nations, or might be the 'Great Britain & Northern Ireland, ie The UK. 

 

Wales has an Assembly /  Parliament, and is a Principality. 

North Ireland has an Assembly. Powers to make laws.

Edited 7 December, 20241 yr by Ootohere