Faraday bag recommendations

[Choclab]

After 8 months, my faraday bag (£5 from Halfords) has stopped shielding my keys. Can now open car, start engine, drive and then lock car, with keyfob in bag. I know the fob switches off after a while, but not if walking across car park, so at risk if bag not working. I know dealer sells bags, so may get one from them. Any other bag recommendations ?

[Winston_Woof]

in reality how big is the "risk"?

Yes we all know that there are various relay techniques available but equally there are techniques to get you in without need ing remote access to the key fob.

I would say personally that for the majority of people  with an average car  then the biggest risk is a scrote with a brick or broken spark plug cap. 

Faraday pouch ain't going to help there

(and yes I am of the opinion a lot of these things are marketing hype preying on irrational fears)

[mumpsim]

A small tin with a well-fitting lid works perfectly for me and fits in my pocket if need be.

[Winston_Woof]

it's a pity smoking isn't so fashionable these days. Used to have a collection of tins like this that would be suitable

[BTandSid]

I bought one on-line though couldn’t tell you who from

[Choclab]

Yes, I think the risk has been hyped up. I had a Subaru with Kessy for 5 years, and never bothered, then the Octavia was old school, now back with a car with Kessy. Just annoyed that the bag had given up.

[StEdmund]

If you are going to use a tin to keep your key(s) in, check that it does actually work. I discovered that a 'tin' didn't work (wrong metal?) whereas a bit of kitchen foil worked perfectly well.

[Karock]

I had the same experience also trying to use an aluminium tin, a tinned steel tin such as the tobacco ones shown above should provide an efficient Faraday shield but they are bit on the large size.

[Winston_Woof]

1 hour ago, Karock said:

I had the same experience also trying to use an aluminium tin, a tinned steel tin such as the tobacco ones shown above should provide an efficient Faraday shield but they are bit on the large size.

Size was never a problem back when I smoked rollies lol

[Sanqhar]

I don't understand?

 

Doesn't the procedure where you lock the car with the button on the key and then within 5 seconds touch the 'lock' sensor on the handle not work with the motion sensitive keys?  This disables Kessy and means the car can only be unlocked using the button on the key.

 

tom

[mumpsim]

9 hours ago, Sanqhar said:

I don't understand?

 

Doesn't the procedure where you lock the car with the button on the key and then within 5 seconds touch the 'lock' sensor on the handle not work with the motion sensitive keys?  This disables Kessy and means the car can only be unlocked using the button on the key.

 

Yes, that procedure disables Kessy. But:

 

   (a) you have to remember to do it;
   (b) you have to assume the system is working correctly, i.e. that the button-press on the key followed by the touch on the handle really has disabled Kessy;
   (c) you have to assume thieves have not (yet) developed a way to overcome that.

 

Some will conclude that is quite secure enough. Others will be sceptical and prefer to add their own layer of security with a metal shield to block the radio signal.

 

It might be better to make sure keys are not kept on a hall table overnight, or anywhere else they can be easily found after a front door is breached.

 

Edited 8 May by mumpsim

[mumpsim]

On 06/05/2024 at 17:35, Choclab said:

 I know the fob switches off after a while, but not if walking across car park, so at risk if bag not working.

If the system is working correctly, you should be protected when walking across a car park. That is because, as I understand it, the Kessy system, and those from some other manufacturers, incorporate a time-of-flight signal as part of the communication between key and car, just as GPS does: time of flight determines distance accurately. So the reason touchless unlocking stops working when one is more than a few feet from the car is not because the signal is getting weak but because the car knows for sure the distance between it and the key (the real key, not the thief's device).  That renders man-in-the-middle attacks useless -- unless someone invents a way to circumvent it.

 

[StEdmund]

Mumpsim, you will worry yourself into an early grave. It is a Skoda - not a Lamborghari - when did you ever hear of a Skoda being nicked?

[Winston_Woof]

52 minutes ago, StEdmund said:

Mumpsim, you will worry yourself into an early grave. It is a Skoda - not a Lamborghari - when did you ever hear of a Skoda being nicked?

errm this chap ;o)
 

 

[Paws4Thot]

2 hours ago, StEdmund said:

It is a Skoda - not a Lamborghari - when did you ever hear of a Skoda being nicked?

I've never heard of a Lambourgspaghetti being nicked (well except in "Gone in 60 Seconds" and that gang only wanted sports and luxury cars)/

[mumpsim]

On 09/05/2024 at 07:09, StEdmund said:

 It is a Skoda - not a Lamborghari - when did you ever hear of a Skoda being nicked?

 

In London alone, more than 100 Skodas were stolen in the year from May 2022 to May 2023.

 

[Winston_Woof]

7 minutes ago, mumpsim said:

 

In London alone, more than 100 Skodas were stolen in the year from May 2022 to May 2023.

 

104 according to the Met  which looking at other marques is quite low



For context 2356 Toyotas were stolen in the same period


Meanwhile elsewhere in the VAG arena



https://www.met.police.uk/foi-ai/metropolitan-police/disclosure-2023/september-2023/total-figures-breakdowns-car-motorbike-van-thefts-may2022-may2023/

[Paws4Thot]

5 hours ago, Winston_Woof said:

For context 2356 Toyotas were stolen in the same period

The thing that surprises me there is that only 2 of the Toy Otas were beige!

[Sanqhar]

I have only just got back to this.

 

Regarding the three reasons above:

 

 (a) you have to remember to do it.  

You also have to remember to carry the Faraday bag/tin box.  

 

(b) you have to assume the system is working correctly, i.e. that the button-press on the key followed by the touch on the handle really has disabled Kessy.  

If you are that concerned you can just test it while you are there.  Walk away, wait 10 seconds and return with the key and touch the handle.

 

(c) you have to assume thieves have not (yet) developed a way to overcome that.  

 ?? You are already making assumptions e.g. that the Faraday bag works, that the stationary key has switched off, being two that come to mind.  The latter will be even harder to test

 

Thieves won't go to that much trouble in order to nick a Skoda.  I'm not sure Skodas are nicked 'to order' to be shipped in a container to the Middle East. Range Rovers will be way ahead of you in the queue.  

 

At least with the lock/touch method even if the thief has captured the 'signal' once the 10 seconds are up they can't use it.

 

tom

 

[Sanqhar]

RE my last post.  On thinking about it the last statement.

 

"At least with the lock/touch method even if the thief has captured the 'signal' once the 10 seconds are up they can't use it."

boils down to an assumption on my part.

 

Not sure how you would test it however.

 

tom