DSG or Manual??

[Penguin]

Thanks for the responses everyone. I agree that our economy is fecked which is precisely why I plan on offloading some wonga!!!

I can see I'm going to have to drive one not least of all, I'm puzzled as to how these things take up from a standing start. If there's no torque converter, at what point does the engine engage. Some folks creep and others don't??? - As the clutches are essentially conventional but operated by a pneumatic control system, surely any creep at a standstill could result in premature wear of the plates? That said, what's the story for a standing start? How does the control system decide at which point to engage the clutch as you depress the accelerator. . . . .

Will nip down the local VAG dealer tomorrow and try it out. All said and done, if I don't like it, the 6 speed manual is an even better deal.

I'm opting for tyre pressure monitoring as well and was intrigued to hear that this works off the ABS system using differential wheel speed as the trigger. That's got me even more puzzled . . . . why would a tyre with say 10psi less in it rotate any faster/slower than the opposing wheel. Sure, it will have a larger "footprint" on the road but the overall diameter of the tyre and hence its rotational speed should be unaffected. Anyone have any experience of this system? How sensitive is it to pressure loss? Is it any good?

Once again, thanks for your constructive comments

Tyre pressure monitor on mine came on the other week - after nearly a year with no air needing added. I thought "here we go - bloody fault " ...stopped , got out and looked - no flat tyres, checked pressures all round...sure enough OS rear was showing 22 PSI (others 30ish). pumped up & 1 week later same problem. Seems I have a very slow puncture/ valve leak & I'm impressed - this system certainly seems to work.

[ibex777]

Does anyone know if the DSG gear lever set-up is the same on the LHD and RHD models? It seems strange that you have to shove the gear lever over to the passenger side (so it is angled away from you) in order to use the manual up/down shift - just wondered if this was a hangover from the LHD version?

[badbaz]

I'll fling in my thoughts having had my DSG vRS cr 170 Estate for over a month.

Gearbox - overall I'd say it's fantastic, worth having if you can. I just wouldn't buy a manual now.(For weekends I have a 350hp Impreza) For every day driving you can't beat it, it's relaxing, smooth and is one less thing to think about in this crazy world.

If it's faults you are looking for then my opinions are: it changes down marginally quicker than I would on downhill, light braking scenarios. This gives a slight lurch as the engine braking rises. For this reason, on some hilly parts around me, I pop it into sequential for the hill, holding the gear of the moment, then back to D afterwards. If i forget, it'll still change down as you slow but not up if your speed increases! Not a big negative.

If i'm in a rush (this car has calmed me somewhat) and about to overtake then I'll use the sequential shift. Explain - when you're driving it's always in the highest gear possible, so if you're over 35ish it's in 6th if not under load, up a hill for example, so if you then want to overtake it's gonna drop two gears which causes a slight, we're not talking mad, but short delay. So I control shifts for overtaking selecting my chosen gear to pass and shifting up as i pass. Straight back to D afterwards.

It also will hold each gear to the red line under full throttle for upshifts which I hate because the engine doesn't need to wait so long for the next gear, it has a broad enough torque spread that it could shift sooner. I'm too sympathetic to the machine to thrash it's **** constantly.

I shift to N at lights, out of sympathy again. It's a lease car but it's not in my nature to cause probs so I like to think I'm saving it just a little bit by sticking it in N, or even P to avoid blinding the poor sods behind with the brake lights. Just one thing to remember and it's caught me out a few times, if you've not got your foot on the brake, you can't go N to D, so if you let it roll, you can't select D, your brain can't process that you only need feather the brake, so on goes the anchors to allow selection of D, meanwhile behind you the guys dumped his old fashioned clutch via that thing in his footwell and floored it. Yes, you know what happens next. It's surprising, trust me!!

It will go from N to D when rolling without brake pedal application but at speeds over what a traffic light roll would generate. Practice makes perfect!!

The gap from 4th to 5th is noticeably disproportionate.

Mines occasionally shifts into third too soon and causes a rumble through the car as it struggles for about 1 sec.

Never used S. Pointless.

Does creep occasionally. (Brakes are ideal at preventing this - nice extra Skoda!)

Yes hill starts a little unnerving to begin with but you can also use the handbrake to eliminate any roll back to give you a mechanical procedure rather than an electronic one.

When I got mine, it seemed to whine like mad when it changed down into second gear when slowing. Not sure if it still does or it's got better. I was worried to begin with but I guess it's gone or I'd have had it in already.

Finally, tyre pressure monitor: god send! Does work, unfortunately had a side wall puncture on O/S/F and after about 2 miles warning lamp and gong came on. Close inspection revealed tyre going down and trip to petrol station backed this up with 18psi in tyre. So in my experience very good system. It does work as previously described with the difference in rolling radius triggering the warning.

PS I am a car loving, part time racer, mechanic and HGV Licence holder, driving is my thing and this gearbox, in fact this car has changed my view on vehicles altogether. I'll never buy another car for it's badge and I'll never have another manual everyday car in my life!

PPS As for girlfriends, let me explain. If you don't need your left arm to change gear every 10 seconds, then there is no obstruction for your girlfriend to lean over and . . . . Trust me, it's worth it's weight in gold for that single reason alone!!!!!!

90% in D, 99% happy with DSG. Get it, don't regret it.

[Javaman]

Thanks for that Badbaz . . . very useful comments. I also noticed the Passat holding on until the redline when on a heavy throttle in drive - that does seem to defeat the whole purpose of a diesel. That said, I would rarely accelarate so hard and if anticipating it, you can always pop it into sequential and change earlier.

The passat had autohold and no manual handbrake - it sounds like the Skoda system is slightly different.

Very useful remarks about the possibility of getting rear-ended when allowing the car to roll in neutral - will bear this in mind.

The PassatCC is a stunning car I must say but like you say, I don't want to pay for the badge and the Octavia is a superb buy at the moment.

Off to the dealers on Monday to take a look at a L & K Octy - watch this space

I want to find out a bit more about turbo reliability - it never occured to me that this could be an issue with diesels but it seems a number of folks have had problems. Will pop accross the road tomorrow and ask the Taxi rank boys if they've had any problems. Also, one of my punters is a police driver and I can give him a ring and ask for his thoughts

I'm inclined to go for the L & K and Badbaz . . you've convinced me about the DSG - your attitude to driving is similar to mine - I've got a triumph tiger 1050 as well and enjoy bikes and cars etc but a daily drive is a daily drive at the end of the day.

Very interested to hear about the tyre pressure monitoring. For £83 extra, this is absolutely a no-brainer for me. Who can honestly say they check their tyre pressures regularly and even if you do, you can pick up a puncture at any point which can end up in a flat and you shouldn't underestimate how dangerous this can be. Frankly, if it was one or the other, I'd have this over ABS. It doesn't sound that sensitive if the tyre loses circa 8psi before the system activates but that is good enough by my way of thinking and could just keep you on the road and out of a ditch

Happy Christmas one and all!!

[Tech1e]

Something else that may factor into things is higher service cost. Your looking at around £150 - £200 every 40k to get your DSG box serviced.

[cjb]

Something else that may factor into things is higher service cost. Your looking at around £150 - £200 every 40k to get your DSG box serviced.

On that subject, is any special equipment needed a good independent wouldn't have?

[badbaz]

On that subject, is any special equipment needed a good independent wouldn't have?

Was wonder the same thing. What needs doing? It won't be rocket science and probably only cost a quarter of this in real life!!

At half a pence a mile i wouldn't be fazed. You can't buy the relaxing factor of the DSG.

[Tech1e]

I have all the equipment.

You need the filling tool and VAG COM.

Oil is £10 ish per litre, 6 litres required. Filter is a couple of quid iirc.

[cjb]

I have all the equipment.

You need the filling tool and VAG COM.

Oil is £10 ish per litre, 6 litres required. Filter is a couple of quid iirc.

It's a bit of a trip for me to you, but I'll bear it in mind

[Fellwalker]

I have had DSG for over 3 years. Nearly 50k miles. Average 44 mpg with a heavy right foot. Approaches 50 if I drive sedately. Yes there is a little hesitation from stop, but as soon as you start to move you are ahead of the others, so who cares? Its hard to remember the last time I lost a race from traffic lights. Oh yes I remember now, a Porsche 911.

My last 6 cars had been normal automatic, and this knocks the spots off them.

Regarding creep - PUT THE HANDBRAKE ON!

[badbaz]

I have all the equipment.

You need the filling tool and VAG COM.

Oil is £10 ish per litre, 6 litres required. Filter is a couple of quid iirc.

Whats VAG COM required for in the changing of the oil?

[cjb]

I think it's to check temperature of the oil during filling.

DSG Service (PDF)

[skippy41]

Something else that may factor into things is higher service cost. Your looking at around £150 - £200 every 40k to get your DSG box serviced.

What you have to get an oil service on the box???????

I would have though it would easily cover 100K before an oil and filter change

[ged.fi]

Regarding creep - PUT THE HANDBRAKE ON!

Why bother? The hill hold option isn't that expensive, after all.

[Tech1e]

What you have to get an oil service on the box???????

I would have though it would easily cover 100K before an oil and filter change

Yes and its essential, every 40k oil and filter.

Seen plenty going wrong recently due to lack of servicing and you void any warranty if its not done.

[cjb]

Yes and its essential, every 40k oil and filter.

Seen plenty going wrong recently due to lack of servicing and you void any warranty if its not done.

And these days manufacturers are very keen to keep service costs low (for the fleet market) so if it wasn't required, you can bet it wouldn't be specified.

[pastiche]

Our Octy 2.0 dsg Elegance has the dsg and it to me is the best auto i have ever drove , as i said "drove". I have a relation who lives on a steep hill and it has double yellows apart from one space where you have to park facing up the hill. He leaves this space for me by putting his car there until we arrive. Then the fun starts, any one seen a Fred Astaire film?, its a tight fit and if you do not balance the pedals you can shunt the guy behind .I think one time the clutches started burning as it was getting very hot.I still would buy another dsg car in future though.

[badbaz]

Having thought a lot about the function of the DSG, paying more attention to it just after my big post, I'd like to add another thought:

the box shifts from 1st to 2nd as I leave my driveway in the morning, I can guarantee it then slips the clutch itself until it's happy with the speed. This is slightly unnerving as again respect for the machine would not allow me to do this on a manual. It's under warranty and I'm not bothered, the clutches are not controlled by the driver and unlike a conventional manual you will never hear "Sorry but you must be riding the clutch you've burnt it out!"

Controlled reversing uphill is not easy to do smoothly either - still doesn't outweigh the gains though.

One other thing, in sequential mode this morning to pass, foot to the boards and it dropped a gear itself, cheeky little box!

[bertJ]

Regarding creep - PUT THE HANDBRAKE ON!

:eek: There is no way you should hold a DSG car when in drive on the handbrake. The clutch (clutches?) are still engaged and could cause the gearbox to go into shut down mode. If stationary in drive you must keep the brake pedal depressed to disengage the clutches; or shift into N. Don't forget the DSG is an automated gearbox, not an automatic gearbox. It works in a completely different way to a conventional automatic box.

[cjb]

:eek: There is no way you should hold a DSG car when in drive on the handbrake. The clutch (clutches?) are still engaged and could cause the gearbox to go into shut down mode. If stationary in drive you must keep the brake pedal depressed to disengage the clutches; or shift into N. Don't forget the DSG is an automated gearbox, not an automatic gearbox. It works in a completely different way to a conventional automatic box.

What's more, if you *do* try that, the clutches engage harder, increasing the creep.

The handbook specifically says to use the footbrake.

[Javaman]

Still haven't managed to take time off work to get a look at an L & K but hoping to over new year. Have just taken a test drive in a BMW 123d Hatch. Oh dear, it's an extra £6k but what a car!!! Creamy smooth, 204bhp, 400NM of torque from 2 litre CR engine and combined cycle of 54 mpg . . . total lack of toys but the basic machine is something else.

I'm tempted to stick with the Skoda brand but the BM's a little rocket and runs on fresh air!!

[skippy41]

Still haven't managed to take time off work to get a look at an L & K but hoping to over new year. Have just taken a test drive in a BMW 123d Hatch. Oh dear, it's an extra £6k but what a car!!! Creamy smooth, 204bhp, 400NM of torque from 2 litre CR engine and combined cycle of 54 mpg . . . total lack of toys but the basic machine is something else.

I'm tempted to stick with the Skoda brand but the BM's a little rocket and runs on fresh air!![/

quote]

So will your wallet:eek::eek::eek:

[Brimma]

Still haven't managed to take time off work to get a look at an L & K but hoping to over new year. Have just taken a test drive in a BMW 123d Hatch. Oh dear, it's an extra £6k but what a car!!! Creamy smooth, 204bhp, 400NM of torque from 2 litre CR engine and combined cycle of 54 mpg . . . total lack of toys but the basic machine is something else.

I'm tempted to stick with the Skoda brand but the BM's a little rocket and runs on fresh air!!

Stick with the Skoda - all the extra toys, extra space etc - and you'll still stand a chance of being let out of a side road !!!

[richardjh]

i am not a car racer, so dont see the point of manuals. the dsg is a lovely gearbox. yes, it has a few quirks, but i can live with them. in very slow traffic the box stays in second and slips the clutch. if this is for an extended period i will slip it it into manual mode and engage first.

i suspect it does this to give a smoother ride.

[Luis_1.9TDi]

i am not a car racer, so dont see the point of manuals. the dsg is a lovely gearbox. yes, it has a few quirks, but i can live with them. in very slow traffic the box stays in second and slips the clutch. if this is for an extended period i will slip it it into manual mode and engage first.

i suspect it does this to give a smoother ride.

a few quirks and sliping cluch is due to a bad gearbox computer... it happened in mine... also made damage to the flywheel...

about car racer and manual... DSG is better for performance then a manual gearbox...

the DSG is THE BEST GEARBOX EVER MADE.

GO FOR THE DSG.

(btw the bad computer and flywheel was covered by waranty)