Just thought I'd see what peoples views are on this? To me its a grey area.

So do you class things like Koni dampers, eibach springs, big turbo's, lexus light, spoilers etc as modification?

Do you class things like factory fitted options as modification? eg metalic paint, Air-con, parking sensors etc?

Any deviation from standard............. HTH

That's the way i see it too. If you happen to retrofit a dealer option after getting it, you might be able to bluff your way by saying the car came with it (i'm thinking along the lines of oem stereos, cupholders, etc) but anything non-standard is a modification for sure.

If it's a factory fitted option then no it's not a modification as it's how the car came supplied. All factory extras are factored into giving the car an Insurance Group rating.

A friend of mine works in insurance and said the only exception to this is the Speed limiter removal you can get on Audi's and BMW's as that is performance altering.

However some insurance companies can get fussy. So if they do change companies as most big ones don't or shouldn't but business is business.

As for Koni's, Turbo's Etc then yes they are Mod's that will probably require an extra premium or change to specialist insurer.

HTH

Carl

If it differs from how it left the factory, then it should be declared if you'd like a payout in the event of a claim.

BBC NEWS | Programmes | Moneybox | Insurers warn on car alterations

If it's a factory fitted option then no it's not a modification as it's how the car came supplied. All factory extras are factored into giving the car an Insurance Group rating.

Well thats what I thought

Not all insurance firms treat factory fitted options as non notifiable.

Mine clearly demand to know everything non standard from the brochure, including factory fitted options. Many will demand similar so always check rather than assume even factory options are safe not to mention!

Of all my factory options, curtain airbags add £50 to the premium as their cost to replace is likely to write the car off in the event of a claim. They are very expensive, as are new seats if the side cushion bag goes off. Was a thread where someone set one off, and everyone told him he was mad for wasting a £300-£500 resellable part!

If your unsure of anything ask your insurer, better to ask them than try to make a claim and finding out your not covered.

Factiory fitted extras are modifications too as these increase the value of the car from the standard and will affect your insurance premium. If you add anything to the standard model (classic, ambience(?), elegance, vRS, L&K) then they are modifications and need declaring.

Are you sure about factory fit items all being included?

I've read on two other forums that it is only the basic specification items that are included.

So just because you decide to have HIDs at the factory doesn't mean they are automatically covered - it is still an option, still a modification and still needs to be mentioned.

Same for extras such as Cruise Control etc - unless it comes in at the basic spec.

I'm only going by what I've read on other forums

I mean, if you think about it, it makes sense.

I prang my Octy with standard projector lights, now if I do the same with my HID fitted Octy the repair cost is going to be considerably more.

Turn the question on it's head; if you were an insurer, what would YOU want to know about?

I'd want to know about anything that:

1) makes the car faster (or allows it to be driven faster, e.g. brakes), which make a claim more likely

2) makes the car more nickable, which makes a claim more likely

3) increases the value of the car, which makes a claim more expensive

In other words, tell them about anything that isn't trivial!

In my case, I have rear parking sensors, which were factory fitted but are not standard. I am getting cruise control fitted this weekend. I also have front mud flaps fitted, which again are not standard on my car. I intend to make my insurance company aware of the parking sensors and the cruise control, but will draw the line at mud flaps!

Are you sure about factory fit items all being included?

I've read on two other forums that it is only the basic specification items that are included.

So just because you decide to have HIDs at the factory doesn't mean they are automatically covered - it is still an option, still a modification and still needs to be mentioned.

Same for extras such as Cruise Control etc - unless it comes in at the basic spec.

I'm only going by what I've read on other forums

I mean, if you think about it, it makes sense.

I prang my Octy with standard projector lights, now if I do the same with my HID fitted Octy the repair cost is going to be considerably more.

I'm with you on this!

As has already been mentioned if you are unsure then it is best to check with your insurance company.

However i spoke to a friend of mine who works in the vehicle insurance industry. He said to me that basically when a manufacturer submits a car to be examined by ABI (association of british insurers) they have to include a list of factory fitted optional extras (this does not cover retrofitting yourself) this then is used in conjunction with the *basic* specification for each model. So in Octavia case Classic, Ambiente, Sport, L&K, vRS. All of this is then looked at and determines what insurance group a car comes under.

So take a vRS for example. IIRC is a Group 15E insurance (the E means it exceeds the security requirement for that group however Value of replacement/repair still warrants the higher grouping) Now they come as standard with 18" Alloys, Dual Zone and Jumbo box and all the other stuff. If you were then to add lets say Xenons & Columbus. Your insurance company should still only charge you the same amount as all this has been factored in with the original Designation of Insurance grouping.

Now i say should as i already mentioned insurance companies are a Buisness and the ABI is just a guide for them. if they wish to charge more they can, Hence different companies offer different prices etc etc. They should not charge you £50 extra lets say just cos you have curtain airbags or Columbus or Xenons etc. But they can if they wish

The best way to stop them charging you is ring round and get a few quotes from other people with those factory fitted extras on and tell them they aren't charging you so unless they remove that charge you will take your business elsewhere. This will usually allow them to accept the *extra* item. The only exceptions to this my friend could think of off the top of there heads was the Speed Limiter removal option you get on the likes of M series BMW's and R series Audi's as this is a performance enhancement. Carbon Ceramic brakes are actually being argued by certain organisations as an insurance lowering option due to being a safety increase. But that is not for me or us to argue it will be decided by ABI and those organisation

In the case of retro fitting. Even if it is done by a dealer then it is considered a modification as it was never assembled on the car in the first place and unless you can prove it was then you could be up **** creek if you tried to claim and they were being fussy and just looking for a way out of paying out.

Most insurance companies when dealing with claims will only look for the main things that invalidate insurance so mainly Performance enhancing mods or Body modifications etc. But there have been cases in the past of modifications like stereo's etc being used to try and invalidate insurance claims.

Thats basically what i have been told by someone in the industry. But the overarching message is to check with your Insurance coy and if your not happy take business elsewhere or live with it and pay the extra.

HTH

Carl:thumbup:

Any deviation from standard............. HTH

So that would include tyres then?

tyres dont make a car faster or more nickable. Yes they can enable you to go round corners faster but the car its self will not be able to go any quicker than it did before.

imo a modification is anything which was not on the car when it left the factory. My old honda civic 1.4 had steelies with hub caps but an option extra was alloys BUT as the car didnt leave the factory with them OEM honda alloys is a modification

tyres dont make a car faster or more nickable. Yes they can enable you to go round corners faster but the car its self will not be able to go any quicker than it did before.

imo a modification is anything which was not on the car when it left the factory. My old honda civic 1.4 had steelies with hub caps but an option extra was alloys BUT as the car didnt leave the factory with them OEM honda alloys is a modification

Actually, he has a point. Upgraded suspension parts won't make your car faster (in a straight line) or more nickable (unless you've lowered the car), but you can be sure your insurance company would want to know about this.

It could be argued that fitting tyres other than the type fitted when it left the factory IS a modification. If you fit very expensive tyres, it could even be argued that you've increased the value of the car!

But as I say, turn it around. I've fitted lots of different types of tyres, but I never considered myself to be modifying the car. However, if I fitted fancy shocks or upgraded brake discs, I would consider that a mod and so would the insurance company.

Just use common sense, IMO. Like I said, with my car I intend to declare everything apart from the mud flaps

tyres dont make a car faster or more nickable. Yes they can enable you to go round corners faster but the car its self will not be able to go any quicker than it did before.

imo a modification is anything which was not on the car when it left the factory. My old honda civic 1.4 had steelies with hub caps but an option extra was alloys BUT as the car didnt leave the factory with them OEM honda alloys is a modification

But the way I see it, if the OEM were dunlops then anything else is not OEM. I have put the same size brake discs and pads on the front of my Fabia Vrs but not OEM " Is that classed as a mod "??

We could argue this for hours and hours (im not having a go i think its a good discussion)

The fact remains that If it is fitted by the factory including optional extras (less the speed limiter i talked about in an earlier post) the the insurance company ***shouldn't*** charge you extra but they hold the right to if they so wish. If it is fitted after the car has been purchased and (in the example of brake discs) they perform to a higher standard than OEM then they are classed as a modification.

As for tyres it will state that the car has (for example my vRS) 225/40/17 tyres. It won't state which manufacturer as that would be too inhibitive. Same as other parts. Skoda may use Bosch to supply some parts then all of a sudden fall out or get a better offer from Hitachi who then supply the same part (say a fuel pump) if it didnt just say Fuel pump it could be argued that a different maker of the same pump is a modification.

It's a grey area really and i would suggest an insurance company would only not pay out if you had altered the performance or body work in some way and not informed them. Well a decent insurance company anyway.

As with anything if your unsure ask.

And if they get picky write down a list of everything from putting winter screenwash in to using a different make of dust caps. They'd soon get bored

Carl:thumbup:

(im not having a go i think its a good discussion)

Me too. Thats why I thought I'd post it.

Yeah I also thought about the tyre one too. Too me it should be made a certified standard as whats classed as a "modification" as it varies from one company to the next.

My personal view is the same as Mater's but like already said it different from one company to the next.

So how many black fabia vRS owners are insured with Swift Cover In case you dont know Swift Cover wont insure modified cars.

Actually, he has a point. Upgraded suspension parts won't make your car faster (in a straight line) or more nickable (unless you've lowered the car), but you can be sure your insurance company would want to know about this.

Yup, anyone like me that went for the 17" Pegasus upgrade should be declaring the alloys AND the lowered sports suspension.

All my factory fitted mods with current insurer cancel each other out (ie alloys & susp, MFSW & maxidot up, but xenons and TPM lowers again as safety). Just the curtains that they actually want more cash than a std elegance would cost. Have checked online

I think just using common sense will work 99% of the time.

I think deep down, we all have a pretty good idea of when we are modding a car to improve it's performance/appearance and when we are just changing something.

Things like tyres are a grey area, but I doubt any insurance company would refuse to pay out because you have a different brand of tyre fitted to the OEMs.

The fact remains that If it is fitted by the factory including optional extras (less the speed limiter i talked about in an earlier post) the the insurance company ***shouldn't*** charge you extra but they hold the right to if they so wish.

If the insurance bands for each car are set for the standard basic option for that model then surely adding options to your car before it comes out of the factory would not be taken into account for this and therefore are viewed as modifications and need declaring?

If the insurance bands for each car are set for the standard basic option for that model then surely adding options to your car before it comes out of the factory would not be taken into account for this and therefore are viewed as modifications and need declaring?

I would have thought you were right here, seems sensible to me. Otherwise you could (in theory) have a remap as an option, but not need to tell your insurance company because it was "factory-fitted"?!

This is the way I've always imagined it too - however I don't work in insurance, so no real proof at all.

I always thought:

You've got a make and model - lets go for Skoda Octy.

You've got numerous "specification levels" - for ease lets just call them Spec A, B, C & D

Call Spec A your base model, Spec B gets you a few things extra, C a few more and finally D where nearly every option is standard.

These are your "4 base models" so to speak, 4 different trim levels, 4 different sets of "standard" equipment.

On top of A, B, C D you can manually add "other features" and it is these other features that I would have thought you would need to tell insurance about.

I buy a Spec A Skoda Octy.

This is a known specification and insurance costs include everything standard on this model.

However to my Octy Spec A I add 4 features from the Spec B list of "options".

Just because these will be fitted at the factory they were not taken into consideration when Spec A was valued, so surely need to be declared and ultimately paid for.

Anyway, I'm sure I could make my own post even more confusing and complicated than it needs to be.

I think the best advice is simply mention everything as the insurance company should know if certain features are included in the standard specification or not.

I think the best advice is simply mention everything as the insurance company should know if certain features are included in the standard specification or not.

Agreed, tell them everything that isn't absolutely trivial. In my case, I'll tell them about the parking sensors and the soon-to-be fitted cruise control.

Then they have no excuses to get out of a payment, if they spot either.

The only thing I'm not mentioning is my mud flaps!