Diesel Particulate Filters (DPF) - this article may interest diesel users

[GentleGiant]

My favourite warning was by KP on a tin of dry roasted peanuts I saw last year. It said WARNING!! MAY CONTAIN NUTS!!

[Browny_37]

Interesting to read.

Im particulaly interested in this paragraph

"If you ignore the light and keep driving in a relatively slow, stop/start pattern soot loading will continue to build up until around 75% when you can expect to see other dashboard warning lights illuminate too. At this point driving at speed alone will not be sufficient and the car will have to go to a dealer for regeneration. "

Now what i'd like to know is, can the car be foced to do a regeneration cycled with VAG-COM?

Edited 6 January, 2010 by Browny_37

[aerofurb]

Rather than adding to the Octavia v Yeti thread which has turned to DPF hating, I'll post my experiences here.

Given the slightly over the top weather in the UK since my Yeti arrived, much of its 1100 miles has been spent at a pretty slow pace. It normally has a 15 mile commute morning and evening, fair bit of it in the evening in stop start traffic and not above 50mph or so for any stretch more than a mile or two. Its travelling has also included a few decent 100 mile trips but they are very much in the minority at the moment.

Touch wood, so far no problems with DPF lights appearing. I do remember Autocar having a DPF light on when they were first running an Octavia vRS in traffic but is it really still a problem or is there a bit of old wifery tales concerning the 'latest' DPFs? Can the tales of 'I know dozens of people who had DPFs fail, engines fail, sold their VAG diesels though DPF hatred, set light to small children and dogs that got caught underneath the car because of the intense heat etc' really be substantiated? Surely if this were the case, more would have been made of it in the motoring press and VAG would go a different route.

On my Fabia vRS I fed it BP Ultimate 99% of the time and that definitely smoked a lot less than standard diesel. Does Ultimate really make a difference to engine cleanliness, performance, MPG? Who knows in reality - I worked out, very roughly, that using Ultimate would cost about £100 a year more than standard stuff so I'm feeding the Yeti on it too. Anyone out there in the know, know if Ultimate keeps the DPFs cleaner?

[Anthony 1]

I do not know aerofurb. We tend to use what ever Tesco have in their tanks or the local garage which sell Shell. So far as diesel is concerned i have never noticed any difference no matter what the suppler. From a region, it will be all the same any way, it will all come from the same refinery. Each Supplying company just adds their own additives, I beleive either at the tanker or at the garage.

[JCB4165]

Since I have had the new DPF on my 170 Octavia (see my earlier post), I have only used Shell ordinary and BP ordinary diesel - rather than the Morrison or supermarkes type I used before. No problems since the change - dont know whether its the fuel or the new software and senser that have made the difference - they were done at the same time as the new DPF.

I tend to think its the new sensor and software that have helped rather than the fuel - but who knows!

I

[bahnstormer vrs]

On my Fabia vRS I fed it BP Ultimate 99% of the time and that definitely smoked a lot less than standard diesel. Does Ultimate really make a difference to engine cleanliness, performance, MPG? Who knows in reality - I worked out, very roughly, that using Ultimate would cost about £100 a year more than standard stuff so I'm feeding the Yeti on it too. Anyone out there in the know, know if Ultimate keeps the DPFs cleaner?

I think that you have answered the question yourself by stating your experience. I have a preference for Shell V-Power but very much the same animal as BP Ultimate; good level of cleaning/detergents and improved cetane rating for more power.

[Anthony 1]

Higher octane rating does not necessarily increase power, it reduces the likely hood of pre detonation and the possibility of over heating because of this. Of course that could limit power ultimately, catastrophically speaking. What a higher octane rating allows is the use of a higher compression ratio which would then increase power. Their is no advantage what so ever in any car using a higher octane fuel than it was designed for. It is a waste of money and could reduce power ultimately by retarding compression ignition in diesels and retard the spread of the spark and flame path in petrol motors. I agree about the importance detergents but is their any evidence other than anecdotal that one manufacturers better than another's?

The petrol companies spend an awful lot of money promoting their fuels and many tend to favour one or another but is that for want of a better word just placebo. is anyone aware of any articles that can substantiate any facts because it might benefit all if their was something more definitive either way.

[GentleGiant]

BP spout that you can go an average of 28 miles further on a tank of Ultimate petrol, than you can on standard. I worked out that I can do over 150 MORE miles for the same money using standard petrol. (17.5 gal tank)

[grobster]

I've had dpf issues on my Vrs Tdi....the raised tick over, the warning lights on, running like a stuffed pig etc. etc.

One of the interesting things that lept out to me on the AA article was in regards to some motorway running not always allowing the dpf to reach sufficient temperature to get the regeneration going, due to high gearing and low rpms etc.

Quite often due to the high torque at low rpm for diesels, we all tend to get them up into a high gear at relatively low rpms. We often tend to do the same for economy reasons on A roads etc. Maybe we think we are doing the right thing by giving the engine the chance for a cleaner more efficient burn of the fuel, where as the additional fuel thrown in by higher rpms and a bit more throttle may help the dpf filter do that job for us.

Perhaps now and again....we should give the car a good run on the motorway without troubling 6th gear...just sticking it in 5th etc. Food for thought!!!

Edited 7 January, 2010 by grobster

[Gilesmengland]

Perhaps now and again....we should give the car a good run on the motorway without troubling 6th gear...just sticking it in 5th etc. Food for thought!!!

That's exactly what I do with the wifes smax now and again - keep the revs up above 2.5k

[bahnstormer vrs]

That's exactly what I do with the wifes smax now and again - keep the revs up above 2.5k

IIRC the optimum is to drive at around 1,800 - 2,000 rpm in 4th or 5th gear; as recommended in the handbook when doing a 'regeneration'.

[Ultima]

Does the size of the engine make a difference to how quick the DPF fills? Or do different size engines have different size DPF's? I was wondering because I have a Vauxhall Combo CDTi 1300 with my job, which I've been using daily for very short journeys to work (less than a mile each way) for the last week but no light has come on; how soon will it be before the warning light comes on?

Also, how often would I have to do a long run if I had a VAG CR diesel if I was doing a short journey every weekday to avoid a visit to a dealer?

Thanks

Edited 28 October, 2010 by Ultima

[mannyo]

Does the Vauxhall van even have a DPF, it may not have one and hence why no problem.

[Ultima]

Does the Vauxhall van even have a DPF, it may not have one and hence why no problem.

It's an 09 reg, we had an e-mail about the DPF issues but I don't know for sure if it has one or not, how can I tell?

[Macdemon]

Our dealer informed us of this and a good 10/15 min blast along the by-pass can fix it..........................so I don;t know why you're all making a big deal from it

When the DPF filter light come on just 'burn excess soot off again.................................simple.

[Ultima]

Our dealer informed us of this and a good 10/15 min blast along the by-pass can fix it..........................so I don;t know why you're all making a big deal from it

When the DPF filter light come on just 'burn excess soot off again.................................simple.

But there's also the worry if the DPF goes faulty out of warranty, then its big bills!

[GazzaC]

But there's also the worry if the DPF goes faulty out of warranty, then its big bills!

You seem to be questioning something different here? Your original query was on the rate that the DPF 'fills up', which seems to be been answered by having a 10-15 minute blast (really tough in a Yeti ) If you're really concerned about the cost of the DPF going TU after the warranty expires then that same issue could be levelled at numerous components (turbo's, ECU etc etc) on just about every modern car in existence. Simply purchase an aftermarket warranty for peace of mind.

Edited 28 October, 2010 by GazzaC

[Ultima]

You seem to be questioning something different here? Your original query was on the rate that the DPF 'fills up', which seems to be been answered by having a 10-15 minute blast (really tough in a Yeti ) If you're really concerned about the cost of the DPF going TU after the warranty expires then that same issue could be levelled at numerous components (turbo's, ECU etc etc) on just about every modern car in existence. Simply purchase an aftermarket warranty for peace of mind.

I'm just trying to reduce the probability of encountering big bills out of warranty, I don't particularly want to pay out for an extended warranty. I'm a low mileage driver 3-4K per yr but was thinking if I factor in some longish journeys on a regular basis could I get a Octy diesel VRS, instead of a petrol Elegance. The DMF's also seem to have a higher failure rate on the diesels than the petrols.

[GazzaC]

I'm just trying to reduce the probability of encountering big bills out of warranty, I don't particularly want to pay out for an extended warranty. I'm a low mileage driver 3-4K per yr but was thinking if I factor in some longish journeys on a regular basis could I get a Octy diesel VRS, instead of a petrol Elegance. The DMF's also seem to have a higher failure rate on the diesels than the petrols.

I see where you are coming from but having been there myself (only 10K miles a year so on pure costs grounds Petrol would be the way to go) I think you can be too clinical trying to work out all the pro's and cons. Have a good long test drive in all your prospective cars and decide which you prefer to drive (in my case the diesel by far). You will get the enjoyment of driving the car all the time but only suffer the potential problems with say DPF and DMF if you're unfortunate, mostly these will be covered in the three year warranty period anyway. I'm not suggesting you shouldn't consider those elements at purchase time but I'd be reluctant to make them too big a deciding factor - I did that and made a mistake. I bought a petrol 2.0 Qashqai in March 2009 thinking no turbo to go wrong, no DPF (the diesel Qashqai's were awful at the time for DPF issues) and the car has indeed proved very solid and reliable. But dull as dishwater to drive hence turning back to Skoda and their wonderful driveability.

Petrol or diesel there are expensive things that can go wrong.

PS I'm not aware of any current Dual mass flywheel problems afflicting the diesels unduly - if there are I've missed it!

Good luck :yes:

[Macdemon]

But there's also the worry if the DPF goes faulty out of warranty, then its big bills!

And you COULD end up being squished by a meteorite and end up killed

We're talking about well manufactured quality engineered components here, so no, I'm not that worried

[jst_at_home]

I ran a Passat 170 Tdi with DPF for 3 years and 60,000 miles until July this year with absolutely no problems at all from the DPF.

It's my understanding that it's not the annual mileage or the speed, it's that you need to do some journeys where the engine is able to get up to temperature and it's not doing stop-start.

My commute with the Passat was about 8 miles each way to my office.

In all those 60k miles I have never been aware of the engine doing anything unusual.

My Yeti is following the same regime and I do not anticpate anything different.

John

[Llanigraham]

The biggest "killer" of the DPF is numerous short journeys where the engine and exhaust never gets up to full temperature, so the short commute/down the shops/school run are going to be the worst.

I've done 5k miles in mine now and don't think it has gone into "cleaning mode" once. One of the joys of a 100 mile round trip commute.

[loadswine]

I do lots of stop start driving during the week, with stops less than a mile apart in some cases, so that helped sway my decision to go petrol this time.

I shall miss the huge torque of a diesel like I had in my remapped 2.0 Altea though.

[FAB-Bri]

In my quest for a "bigger boot" I kept an open mind and considered, amongst others, a Renault Kangoo, don't laugh, it has 2,800 litres of boot space and would make life so much easier in the "putting stuff in the boot" sort of way BUT this is what Renault says about its new DPF:

This innovative solution is not suitable for vehicles which are soley used in urban areas, where cars move at slow speed and frequently have to stop and start.

At least they have come clean and said this and it wasn't too hard to find, so, if Renault are saying this (a company not renound for their reliability) then it may apply to all DPF fitted cars and on this basis I'm looking for a petrol car to replace my non-DPF diesel Fabia.

[Terfyn]

Re the DPF ..... I took a look at the Yeti Owners Guide - something to peruse whilst I wait for mine......

I thought this was interesting.... on Page 170

• The diesel particle filter achieves very high temperatures. Therefore do not

park at points where the hot filter comes into direct contact with dry grass or

other combustible materials - risk of fire!

With all the Snow about - not a problem to consider - but I wonder about off-roading in the Summer months??

Just a thought ...

This is also true of the petrol catalytic converter. Warnings are posted in the user manuals for petrol cars.

The Yeti has a decent ground clearance so the heat from a DPF or CC should pose less problem.

But a warning:- If you want to mess about in the long grass, do make sure its dry. Damp grass could cause all sorts of problems in later life!