Mine had the lag/delay for the first couple of weeks I had it but now seems to be fine.

Hi

I have also noticed lag on our new 1.2 Fabia DSG. Collected 24th Feb 2011. More worrying though, where we live the hills are quite steep and if you are pulling up gently to a stop in D the car will actually roll back a bit. This makes your heart miss a beat. I have had this happen stopping at traffic lights and leaving a friend's drive. - Did not notice any lag whatsoever in the vrs we test drove.

Thinking of having it checked out!

Iv'e put just over 700 miles on the clock and it's behaving much better

Hi

I have also noticed lag on our new 1.2 Fabia DSG. Collected 24th Feb 2011. More worrying though, where we live the hills are quite steep and if you are pulling up gently to a stop in D the car will actually roll back a bit. This makes your heart miss a beat. I have had this happen stopping at traffic lights and leaving a friend's drive. - Did not notice any lag whatsoever in the vrs we test drove.

Thinking of having it checked out!

I think that if you use the handbrake at an uphill junction which is the instinctive thing to do it switches off the hill hold and you can roll back before the DSG engages. It takes a while to trust that the hill hold will work and not use the handbrake

Now got c.2K on my 60 plate VRS. Still hesitates when pulling away. But unpredictable. Got to assume it might hesitate and so have to be very sure before I commit. Embarrassing when someone flashes to let you cross in front of them and you put your foot down and nothing happens for maybe 1 or 2 seconds.

Think I'll get it checked as it seems some of us experience this and others don't.

Now got c.2K on my 60 plate VRS. Still hesitates when pulling away. But unpredictable. Got to assume it might hesitate and so have to be very sure before I commit. Embarrassing when someone flashes to let you cross in front of them and you put your foot down and nothing happens for maybe 1 or 2 seconds.

Think I'll get it checked as it seems some of us experience this and others don't.

i really don't get it, mine has never had this problem... must be something to do withthe "learning software" or different software issues for the box....

I have to say I've through my very varried driving style I have found coding black holes in the software that drives the DSG.

Most of these relate to lifting off for a perticular resson then putting my foot down again.

I shows that the person that wrote the software realy didn't understand the task in hand or that the processing power of the chip in charge of the DSG isn't enough that it can actually monitor enough variables to make the correct choice.

However this is realativly simply fixed by using the paddles once you find these black holes in the code.

I'd still like to give the person responsible of the shonky code a good slapping though.

I have to say I've through my very varried driving style I have found coding black holes in the software that drives the DSG.

Most of these relate to lifting off for a perticular resson then putting my foot down again.

I shows that the person that wrote the software realy didn't understand the task in hand or that the processing power of the chip in charge of the DSG isn't enough that it can actually monitor enough variables to make the correct choice.

However this is realativly simply fixed by using the paddles once you find these black holes in the code.

I'd still like to give the person responsible of the shonky code a good slapping though.

maybe if you and me did some research, and produced a plan, they could pay us? (and I'm not joking Can!) I agree you have to "drive around" stuff... so we could offer feedback on the condition that if its used we get paid i would calaborate with you

I think the Skoda\VW\audi techies behind all the electronic stuff need as much help as they can get.

Probably need to get the car fitted with some sort of monitering eqipment to realy be able to point specificly to where the coding black holes are in the 100% analytical way they probably need to be able to actually build a proper code base.

Thought real world experiance is probably the only way to resolve these issues.

I have found coding black holes in the software that drives the DSG.

Unless you have seen the spec or actually written the code how can you say this? Whilst the software may not always respond in the way you want it doesn't mean it is deficient.

The code not only takes into account input from the driver but all of the other sensors and systems it must account for. There will be some situations where it may have to make a choice between fry the clutch or give the driver power, I would imagine the clutch wins in this scenario. These choices might be affected by faulty sensor readings or the ECU prioritising one thing over another. How many years have computers been on the market and how many operating systems or pieces of software have NEVER crashed, is this all down to poor coding or the limitations placed on developers?

Yes there are situations where choices made by software developers are frustrating for the user but there are very few perfect systems (computerised or otherwise) that can please all of the people all of the time

Yes there are situations where choices made by software developers are frustrating for the user but there are very few perfect systems (computerised or otherwise) that can please all of the people all of the time

Manual gearboxes have always pleased me . Although I could live with a dsg, I have no need for a gearbox that makes decisions about what I may or may not want to do.

I can make that assement by the fact that the coding for the DSG will have been writen specificly for the DSG.

The processor etc will only comply with the instructions included within the code for a given set of pre conditions.

Also given the situations that both of these failure to respone have happened, have been with the car traveling with the clutch's fully engaged. The desicion is not related to protecting the clutch from excesive ware.

It is plain and simply the situation being outside of the contitions anticipated by the author of the code. Ergo the code has a hole in it.

Also the fact that these situations can be overcome by changing the drive mode of the gearbox which obviously uses a diffrent code. The problem must reside within the software. While I don't claim to be able to state that line X in code W is incorrect or is based up on an incorrect assumption. With the apporpriate data monitoring equipment It would be possible to mark the points where the DSG ECU software performs in a manor that is inconsistant and at odds with the opperational situation of the vehical.

Yes while most comercial software is defficent in some form due to reduced testing etc. Some systems must respond as they should at all times. And hence are properly and fully tested across there full operations spectrum conditions.

Hi

I have also noticed lag on our new 1.2 Fabia DSG. Collected 24th Feb 2011. More worrying though, where we live the hills are quite steep and if you are pulling up gently to a stop in D the car will actually roll back a bit. This makes your heart miss a beat. I have had this happen stopping at traffic lights and leaving a friend's drive. - Did not notice any lag whatsoever in the vrs we test drove.

Thinking of having it checked out!

Thanks for responses guys - I think I shall wait a while see if it settles down and try a few things to allow the DSG more time to react. I had lift on an automatic saab this week and did not notice any of the same issues.

Thanks again

Matt

It is plain and simply the situation being outside of the contitions anticipated by the author of the code.

The point is how do you know this, any programmer is given a set of parameters the code must allow for. Just becuase the code crashes or does not respond how a certain user wants it to does not mean the brief was not followed.

One classic programer training method is to describe all the steps involved in making a cup of tea. As you can imagine these are many and you can obtain the same result by performing certain steps in a different order. Just because one person adds the milk before the water does not mean the code is wrong, you still end up with a cup of tea. You would have to run a diagnostic trace program to see which routines the software was running and why it had decided to run each particular piece of code before you could say there was a programming error.

Also the fact that these situations can be overcome by changing the drive mode of the gearbox which obviously uses a diffrent code.

Of course it uses different code as the status of one of the input parameters has changed. The equivalent of using a kettle that sits on a hob rather than being plugged into a wall socket in the tea making example. Change a parameter and the steps must change to achieve the result.

Hi All,

I don't know if this is any help or not, as it's not very scientific.

I have no complaint with my DSG on my vRS, but I have noticed that it is the actual speed of operating the throttle from a standstill that governs how the car takes off.

A gradual squeeze to half throttle results in a slight delay and a smooth takeoff, a sharp application to half throttle results in a brief squeal from the tires and a very quick takeoff with no delay at all.

Let us know what you think.

Regards

Tony

:wonder:

Hi All,

I don't know if this is any help or not, as it's not very scientific.

I have no complaint with my DSG on my vRS, but I have noticed that it is the actual speed of operating the throttle from a standstill that governs how the car takes off.

A gradual squeeze to half throttle results in a slight delay and a smooth takeoff, a sharp application to half throttle results in a brief squeal from the tires and a very quick takeoff with no delay at all.

Let us know what you think.

Regards

Tony

:wonder:

Agreed, and there are lots of inbetween the extreams you say, you can use "an ammount" of throttle where it takes off without delay, and without wheelspin just takes practice.

Agreed, and there are lots of inbetween the extreams you say, you can use "an ammount" of throttle where it takes off without delay, and without wheelspin just takes practice.

Like finding a good balance of throttle and clutch control.

Ive driven auto's and when I drove the fabia, never noticed a lag at all!

If I order, ill let you know how I get on, but it could be a while with lead times the way they are at the moment.

I suppose anything automated will have an inherent amount of delay in it; have to say not noticed too much of a problem with our vRS but low speed manouvers are a bit of a pain. Getting the right amount of drive in a smooth manner certainly takes some practice.

I suppose anything automated will have an inherent amount of delay in it; have to say not noticed too much of a problem with our vRS but low speed manouvers are a bit of a pain. Getting the right amount of drive in a smooth manner certainly takes some practice.

plus the ecu learns how you drive or is that me talking pooh

plus the ecu learns how you drive or is that me talking pooh

No you are definatly right there. Gf hasn't driven for 18 plus years and is the reason I went for the DSG setup. So when she drives it and then I get in to drive it I feel the car is jerky for awhile. Obviously she's a bit more heavy footed at the moment and still needs to get a feel for it

We have an 11 plate VRS and it has 500 miles on, I also notice the lag/hesitation. I think it is because when you sit with your foot on the brake the gearbox disengages drive so as not keeping load on the engine and drive train, release the brakes and hit the go pedal and a momentary delay before drive is taken up, if however you put the hand brake on with your foot on the brake pedal too this helps, when you are ready to move off take your foot off and release the handbrake and there is no lag at all. Another way is to hold it on the hand brake as the car keeps drive engaged.

I also have a BMW 5 series and this car does not drop drive at all when the brake pedal is applied.

Now summer is here, turn off your radio and boom boxes, wind down the window and select "D" drive normally and listen to the clunking the DSG box makes it sounds like there is a guy in there with a hammer!

Mine does it once or twice a week (only do about 200 miles a week in it) when ever it does I just give it the beans and she does as she's told from then on.

Hello All,

Read all the previous mailings with interest as it a subject close to my heart. I would like to add my experiences.

Came to the DSG gearbox via a succession of manual cars and the odd drive in an automatic over many years. The latter were the the reason for not buying auto as experience with Mercs and BMWs of old demonstrated dreadful lag when starting off, poor performance and dreadful fuel economy.

My first auto purchased was a Honda Jazz 1.4 CVT. No loss in performance or economy and creamy smooth take off with acceleration in town to easily stay with or beat the traffic. Not a lot of fun on motorways however and the sticky steering was horrible. At the time I also had a Rover 75 2.0 CDTi manual which apart from a heavy clutch was excellent. No longer requiring 2 cars I decided to give Skoda a try and bought an Octavia L&K 1.8TSI with DSG gearbox. The latter because my wife preferred an auto.

Initial impression were excellent with as much space as the Rover, much better performance and economy almost as good.

Then came the downside. While the DSG box could change gear as good or better than I could, it was totally unpredictable at low speed. Roundabouts as previous mentioned by others became a lottery, long lag while you coasted onto a roundabout with a 40 ton artic bearing down on you followed by tyre squealing wheel spin when the system finally decided you would quite enjoy some forward motion. Not good for the constitution! To overcome this lag the technique used was to press accelerator early in anticipation of the lag, and as you can guess, occasionally instant response would be achieved and emergency braking needed to avoid ramming someone on the roundabout.

Next problem en-counted was trying to parallel park when reversing up a hill. I gave up in the end as I was either going to ram the car behind or roll into the one in front. Despite being assured by the original dealers in Fareham that nothing was wrong I finally got reassurance that my driving was not to blame from a dealer in Lincoln. At this time I was moving house and had to wait until settling in Northants to take to the nearest dealers in Leamington Spa. Their initial findings from hooking the car up to the diagnostics was that nothing was wrong but they arranged to have the car back when they could repeat the checks but also log into the Milton Keynes computer to diagnose further. In the words of the mechanic he "Relearnt the electronics" What ever he did the car was certainly much better, how be it, not perfect. Low speed pick up was still unpredictable to the point that my wife would no longer drive it.

Still being enthusiastic about the good points of the DSG box we bought a Fabia 1.2TSI 105 DSG. The gearbox on this is much better but still pauses to think at times which is disconcerting especially pulling onto our old favourite, roundabouts. There are times when accelerating slowly and then requiring to accelerate quickly, I have pressed the accelerator to the floor with absolutely no effect until the kick down has been engaged, with the resulting screech we all know so well. (Have Skoda got a contract with the tyre people to sell more tyres?)

Speaking of tyres, The Octavia was getting exceedingly noisy on the road which I finally found out to be a problem with Continental and Dunlop tyres. As it was going to cost me around £500 to find out if Goodyear were any better I took advantage of the Skoda offer on petrol Superbs and swapped the Octavia for a 1.8TSI DSG Elegance. So far I can report that the DSG on this car is vastly better than the previous two. Whether this is because the extra weight smooths the drive or because only I drive this car, I am not sure but it much easier to drive smoothly.

To conclude. There appear to be big differences in the DSG boxes, or at least their control systems. Is this a quality control problem? Is it because the the programmers have tried to be too clever by building in a learning system. Would it be far better to keep things simple and have one program that gives consistent results and allows the driver to control how quickly he wants to accelerate by how far he depresses the accelerator? Your thoughts.

firstly I agree that there are big differences in the DSG boxes, not least because I have never experianced any of the problems mentioned (10200 miles now) secondly I don't believe its the way its driven, my car is used for auto driving instruction, where the pupils are never predicable and drive differently, also with me at the wheel, with the signage on, I drive absolutley by the book, and when I take it off, I often drive like I stole it, none of this upsets the apparent 'learning' gearbox.... I have noticed the more enthusiatic I drive it, the more enthusiastic the gearbox is, and also the slower it gets drive the more it will change up early ect, but this is very quick adaptation by the box e.g. after spending a week being driven gently, it only take a few minutes of enthusiastic driving to speed it up again, and the difference is barely noticable anyway....

auricgoldfinger has had problems, and drove mine at a meet, and said mine was a world better, so I have to conclude that the geaboxes are either different, or have different software running them...

mine is the 7 speed, so clearly is different to the 6 speed, but I assume your fabia is the 7 speed too...

I find the reversing bit worse nowadays (although I still have the occasional rear-clench moment as I join a roundabout with the speed of a snail with my foot on the floor). My reversing manouver involves going back a bit then slowing to check the coast is clear and when I put my foot back on the gas.....nowt.....nowt.....nowt......nowt...whooosh I'm off like a scalded cat. It feels worse as your head lurches forwarded and isn't stopped by the headrest. Hey ho, modern technology.