7 Speed DSG Hesitancy

[oldstan]

First off, hoping to collect around about the second week in May (was built week 15 as I understand it and dealer is watching progress daily to assist in arranging collection date as he's not exactly local to me, but that's the timing he expects).

Moreover, just noticed, on another motoring forum, a gent who'd driven a 7 speed 1.2 DSG Roomster with a view to seeing whether he'd like the equvalent Yeti. He wasn't at all keen due to the hesitancy at, say, the approach to roundabouts sometimes spoken about (on that particular forum it's been referred to more than once) and the ensuing debate makes most of the usual points.

Am only really asking now as I wonder what to expect when mine arrives and by now more people will have driven DSG's for long enough to know how much of an issue they do or don't find it.

Be pleased to receive owners latest views with the benefit of experience. By comparison, my current Jazz is CVT which, when driven gently/normally (as opposed to flooring it), is seamless and smooth. And, no, I didn't drive one prior to ordering it.......they weren't exactly plentiful at the time! I just asumed it would be OK.

Thanks in advance for any thoughts.

[lol-lol]

The 7 speed is not perfect but it is way better than the CVT like in the Honda.

The 7 speed, when matched to the TSI engines, actually helps fuel consumption.

But the human brain is much better than even the quite clever DSG control unit.

I probably use my gear stick and paddles almost as much as I use the manual gear stick.

In busy traffic I usually knock it sports mode when approaching roadabouts etc.

I knock it in to neutral on long downward slopes, helps the fuel consumption one or 2 mpg.

The Borg-Warner 2 clutch-2 gearbox system to the dog's douberries, 0.03 second gearchanges etc, but to get the best from it it is best to use the paddles and stick and then it does not frustrate in any way.

[Macdemon]

The 7 speed is not perfect but it is way better than the CVT like in the Honda.

The 7 speed, when matched to the TSI engines, actually helps fuel consumption.

But the human brain is much better than even the quite clever DSG control unit.

I probably use my gear stick and paddles almost as much as I use the manual gear stick.

In busy traffic I usually knock it sports mode when approaching roadabouts etc.

I knock it in to neutral on long downward slopes, helps the fuel consumption one or 2 mpg.

The Borg-Warner 2 clutch-2 gearbox system to the dog's douberries, 0.03 second gearchanges etc, but to get the best from it it is best to use the paddles and stick and then it does not frustrate in any way.

My DSG only has 6 gears???

I have the 2.ol 4x4.

How come the 1.2L TSi has 7????

[the_raz]

Hi!

After driving almost a year with 1.2 TSI DSG Yeti I am more than pleased with the performance of the gearbox. I can agree on the slight hesitation when almost stopping and then not, but I have adopted a driving stile where this does not bother me. Other than this I don't have anything to complain about when it comes to the DSG. During the winter season I even noticed that when on slippery surface the gearbox is so smooth that it's possible to get away without any wheel slip at all - I would even say that it's more precise than me when it comes to clutch control! During normal driving it's always in the right gear, and the changes are so smooth that I have to check from the dash what gear it is in. I have not have any need for manually overriding the gearboxes decisions, and I even very rarely use the S-mode. The only times when I select gears manually is when I want more efficient engine breaking, and switches down 2 or 3 gears from what the car would like to use.

Lol: If you put the car in neutral in long downward slopes the enginge will still be running and consuming some fuel according to it's idle settings. If you leave the car in gear and use engine breaking (or a high gear if you don't want to slow down that much) the engine is turning around, but no fuel will be used. You can check this for yourself from the instant consumption view in the MaxiDot.

[mannyo]

All diesels have 6 speed DSG because it can handle more torque than the much weaker 7 speed box which cannot handle the torque of diesel. The 7 speed is also quiet restrictive because of this should you want to remap. The diesel will never see the 7 speed, because to shoe horn in the extra gear everything is much smaller and hence weaker.

Knocking into N going down hill uses more fuel than leaving in D or S, reason being on the overrun (Eg. no foot on throttle but in gear) the engine injects no fuel at all and uses just momentum to keep the engine running, in N then the car needs to inject fuel to keep the engine running. If you switch to the instant MPG, then you'll see that in D or S the MPG figure will go and display its maximum value, but in N it will display a figure.

[Yetiflute]

The diesel will never see the 7 speed, because to shoe horn in the extra gear everything is much smaller and hence weaker.

Not sure about that. I'll bet that VAG will bring it out strong enough eventually. Fairly sure that it is used on some weaker 1.6 VW diesels.

[Yetiflute]

I probably use my gear stick and paddles almost as much as I use the manual gear stick.

In busy traffic I usually knock it sports mode when approaching roadabouts etc.

I knock it in to neutral on long downward slopes, helps the fuel consumption one or 2 mpg.

The Borg-Warner 2 clutch-2 gearbox system to the dog's douberries, 0.03 second gearchanges etc, but to get the best from it it is best to use the paddles and stick and then it does not frustrate in any way.

I had a 1.8TSI DSG Octavia and never needed to use paddles or manual stick or indeed the sports mode with that engine. I thought the DSG system was near perfect and didn't even notice any of the reported hesitances.

[rockhopper]

The 7 speed is not perfect but it is way better than the CVT like in the Honda.

The 7 speed, when matched to the TSI engines, actually helps fuel consumption.

But the human brain is much better than even the quite clever DSG control unit.

I probably use my gear stick and paddles almost as much as I use the manual gear stick.

In busy traffic I usually knock it sports mode when approaching roadabouts etc.

I knock it in to neutral on long downward slopes, helps the fuel consumption one or 2 mpg.

The Borg-Warner 2 clutch-2 gearbox system to the dog's douberries, 0.03 second gearchanges etc, but to get the best from it it is best to use the paddles and stick and then it does not frustrate in any way.

lol has an octavia with the 7 speed gearbox and flappy paddle steering wheel.

None of our diesel Yeti are fitted with either. The 1.2tsi doesn't have flappy paddles either.

the exception......Elsie the Helipad, she has flappy paddles..........

VW fit a 7 speed DSG to their Tiguan, so eventually that box will come to Skoda, but it is not the same as the 7 speed in the 1.2tsi or the 1.8 octavia.

[Auric Goldfinger]

My DSG only has 6 gears???

I have the 2.ol 4x4.

How come the 1.2L TSi has 7????

The New Fabia Vrs in Sport Mode only gives you 6 gears, 7th cannot be reached cos your at max speed

Disclaimer:- "So I'm Told, never tried it"

[hertsnminds]

The diesel will never see the 7 speed, because to shoe horn in the extra gear everything is much smaller and hence weaker.

I think that VAG may have sorted this with the Audi RS3 Sportback

The Audi RS 3 Sportback has a 340 PS, turbocharged 2.5 litre TFSI engine. It requires just 4.6 seconds to reach 62 mph

the engine produces 450 Nm of torque and has a 7 speed DSG gearbox. OK it's not quite the 1000 Nm torque of the Q7 V12 TDi (which uses the 6 speed box) but powerful enough for most drivers.

[the_raz]

I remember reading something about a new 7-speed DSG that will be able to handle the higher torque. Currently the 6-speed is uses a wet clutch, and the 7-speed dry clutch, so they are actually totally different. I think that the new 7-speed (for the higher torque engines) will also use a wet clutch.

[900000]

I remember reading something about a new 7-speed DSG that will be able to handle the higher torque. Currently the 6-speed is uses a wet clutch, and the 7-speed dry clutch, so they are actually totally different. I think that the new 7-speed (for the higher torque engines) will also use a wet clutch.

No secret. Just click on the Tiguan area on any VW website and you will notice that the 7 speed DSG has been fitted to the 2,0 TDI for some time already. It has just not yet filtered down to the Škoda sister company yet!

Now back OT: you need not worry about the DSG being hesitant. There are MANY threads on that on this forum just use the search function or just use Google and start your search with "site: briskoda.net". Because a DSG has two clutches the computer pre-selects the next gear already based on you going faster or slower. So if you are in 2nd the other clutch has already got 3rd ready for a super fast change. So slowing at a roundabout it will sense this deceleration and have 2nd ready if you are in 3rd. Then as you approach you see a gap and give it some gas, not what it was expecting see and then it has to undo 2nd and get 4th ready. This takes time and might be read as hesitancy. Easy solution is to use your Tiptronic function. Tap it left, down, down and it will be in 2nd, see the gap, take it and tap the lever back to D. Job done. Computers are clever but they cannot see gaps in traffic alas.

[oldstan]

No secret. Just click on the Tiguan area on any VW website and you will notice that the 7 speed DSG has been fitted to the 2,0 TDI for some time already. It has just not yet filtered down to the Å koda sister company yet!

Now back OT: you need not worry about the DSG being hesitant. There are MANY threads on that on this forum just use the search function or just use Google and start your search with "site: briskoda.net". Because a DSG has two clutches the computer pre-selects the next gear already based on you going faster or slower. So if you are in 2nd the other clutch has already got 3rd ready for a super fast change. So slowing at a roundabout it will sense this deceleration and have 2nd ready if you are in 3rd. Then as you approach you see a gap and give it some gas, not what it was expecting see and then it has to undo 2nd and get 4th ready. This takes time and might be read as hesitancy. Easy solution is to use your Tiptronic function. Tap it left, down, down and it will be in 2nd, see the gap, take it and tap the lever back to D. Job done. Computers are clever but they cannot see gaps in traffic alas.

Thanks to you, J, and all the others to date....my main reason for a fresh enquiry was to gauge experience now you've had them a while and I feel happier now, especially with J's, explanation of approaches to hazards and features (on my Jazz I can, and usually do, use it's 'manual' feature to drop down through the gears to gain engine braking when slowing down (the Honda mechanic assures me that it doesn't increase wear on the box and isn't detrimental to fuel economy as fuel is cut off on the over-run).....(hope not to start an enthusiastic debate on the last point)

The dealer (you know the one, Johann) has been fine throughout and I'm just in the process of booking transport for the first week of May - dealer says the car was shipped yesterday [18th April] and is confident that the 9th May onwards will be OK to collect....hope so as you lose your train fare if you don't use it on the day.

Lastly, very disappointing response to adverts for the Jazz. My supplying dealer said he's experiencing a very flat spot in sales enquiries at the moment - maybe the initial enthusiasm for Yeti is finding a level now and times generally are difficult?

[mhjonesuk]

I have had the 1.2 DSG for almost a year and driven 21000 miles on it, I agree with the hesitancy when accelerating after slowing down or when you are pootling along in high gear at low speeds and want to speed up, it's as if the box has settled into a lazy mode and just needs to wake up again. You get used to it and it is only really noticeable if you want to accelerate smartly. It's nothing to worry about and you soon get used to it. Most of the time the gearbox is so smooth you hardly notice it and I rarely even bother to use the manual mode.

Hope this helps

Mark

[oldstan]

............ Most of the time the gearbox is so smooth you hardly notice it and I rarely even bother to use the manual mode.

Hope this helps

Mark

Indeed it does - thanks.

[rockhopper]

I. Most of the time the gearbox is so smooth you hardly notice it and I rarely even bother to use the manual mode.

Hope this helps

Mark

And the same applies to the 6 speed DSG in the diesel. beautifully smooth. I have yet to be caught out at a roundabout or junction like I used to be in the old Octavia DSG. But I have only done 6,600 miles in 4 months.

[rockhopper]

I was out this evening in my 6 speed DSG, and as usual, no hesitancy. With the old DSG in the '06 Octavia I had before, the box would drop into 1st all the time, but the 6 speed DSG in the Yeti has to be almost stationary before it goes into 1st, which means, if you hesitate approaching a junction, slowing down, then deciding it is clear to go,or you approach some traffic lights which are red and change just before you stop, the car will stay in 2nd and give you a much smoother drive. I suspect just a software tweak, but a very welcome one.

[lol-lol]

All diesels have 6 speed DSG because it can handle more torque than the much weaker 7 speed box which cannot handle the torque of diesel. The 7 speed is also quiet restrictive because of this should you want to remap. The diesel will never see the 7 speed, because to shoe horn in the extra gear everything is much smaller and hence weaker.

Knocking into N going down hill uses more fuel than leaving in D or S, reason being on the overrun (Eg. no foot on throttle but in gear) the engine injects no fuel at all and uses just momentum to keep the engine running, in N then the car needs to inject fuel to keep the engine running. If you switch to the instant MPG, then you'll see that in D or S the MPG figure will go and display its maximum value, but in N it will display a figure.

The 7 speed DSG fitted to Skodas are only being fitted to engines with a torque figure of 250 Nm or less. VAG do fit it to both the 1.6 and 2.0 diesels which produce 105/110 hp but just 250 Nm.

Because the petrol engines rev much higher than the diesel they can produce much more power even with slightly less torque. My 1.8TSI produce 250 Nm at 4500 rpm and 160 hp (measured on some rolling roads at 170 hp). If the torque was allowed to stay at 250 Nm it would be producing 240 hp at 6750 rpm, 250 rpm short of red line.

Limiting box to 250 Nm is estimated to allow the box to do 400,000 Km without being opened to change the plates. Box has been proving to be reliable in handling 380 Nm, presumably tens of thousands of kilometers.

1.8 TSI Face lift Octy2 is already half a second quicker to 60 than any of the skoda diesels, 2 seconds quicker to kilometer marker ie 20 seconds against 22 seconds, in DSG or manual form.

1.8 TSI engine (it is a shorter stroke version of VRS engine), and the DSG gearbox, is capable of handling and running at 300 hp if mapped to produce 320 Nm at 6500 rpm, turbo change required but 220 hp is possibly with just mapping and still keeping within 250 Nm. Times are sub 7 sec 0-60 and 155 top end.

7 speed DSG in the Octy does not run out of revs as at 6K it is a genuine 154 mph ie off the clock on the speedo.

Edited 20 April, 2011 by lol

[mhjonesuk]

Another thing I noticed with the DSG in the 1.2 is that quite often you can "short shift" by just taking your foot off the accelerator for a second. Might be old hat to the more experienced auto users but being my first auto I think it's a really useful way of overriding the gearbox.

[rockhopper]

Another thing I noticed with the DSG in the 1.2 is that quite often you can "short shift" by just taking your foot off the accelerator for a second. Might be old hat to the more experienced auto users but being my first auto I think it's a really useful way of overriding the gearbox.

ditto for the 6 speed diesel DSG