I Cannot rememeber what brake pads i had fitted the last time around,

but all i can say is im not very pleased with the sheer amount of brake dust that these pads are letting off

so id like to ask, what aftermarket pads do folks use with no issues with major brake dust issues?

is there any particular brand that folks tend to sway towards?

I would be far more concerned with stopping performance than dust.

The ATE pads fitted as OE were good, but very abrasive. The original set wore the disks to 23 mm when the pads were worn out at about 60k miles - new disks needed. Present pads are Pagid - performance OK, time will tell as far as disk wear and durability are concerned.

There is a lot of junk out there in the market place - China and India have been busy...

rotodiesel.

I fitted EBC discs and pads last time round, no dust, and fantastic braking performance.

can the front discs from a 2.5L superb fit the 1.9pd.? is it a straight forward swap or is there other work involved?

The caliper brackets need to be changed to accomodate the larger disks. Not worth doing unless you drive like a loony - the 288 mm disks will stop the car to the limit of tyre adhesion for one crash stop.

If you keep doing this, you're definitely a loony or have too much money to spend on tyres and fuel. The standard brakes are fine if kept in good order and fitted with reputable friction material.

rotodiesel.

I use EBC with green stuff, i'm amazed how long they last vs the price.

EBC green are OK, but EBC yellow are better.

I disagree re 288mm vs 312mm brakes making little diffrence. 288mm with stock pads can be boiled when used on some dual carriageways with lots of roundabouts. A505 near Royston is a classic, if you brake prior to each roundabout, you can moderately fade the pads on 3rd roundabout each way.

Even 312mm are not enough on autobahn if you do more than 1 braking from 120mph - 50mph in summer. The only combo that has not faded yet for me is solid rotors (I use Febi, but stock and EBc will do too) and EBC yellow pads. EBC Greens pad liner tends to crack after a while, and VW stock pads fade.

Make sure you use Super Dot 4 fluid with uprated pads, as they can boil the standard fluid. Also tested, though I wish I'd rather hadn't.

Edited 19 July, 201213 yr by dieselV6

It's a Superb, not a sports car...!

Seriously though, if you guys are braking this hard and often you're just throwing good money after bad aren't you?

i use pagid pads. last set of fronts lasted 50,000 miles and they have a reasonable feel so im quite happy

I fitted Pagid pads and disks too - no problems whatsoever as outlined above. The standard brakes are perfectly adequate for any normal driving.

Only a complete loony buys a diesel engined car to give low running costs and then burns up the tyres and brake linings...

rotodiesel.

It's a Superb, not a sports car...!

Seriously though, if you guys are braking this hard and often you're just throwing good money after bad aren't you?

Actually, I do not brake this hard often, my last front pads lasted for 3 years / 35k miles, changed them 2 weeks ago. You should plan brake pads for worst stop not average use. Once brakes are faded, your only choice is where to crash into.

Stock VW pads can be cooked in no time, EBC greens I managed to cook once over 2 cars and 3 sets of pads (but the pad lining tends to crack after a while), and EBC Yellows still stand as uncookable

Only a complete loony buys a diesel engined car to give low running costs and then burns up the tyres and brake linings...

Tyre wear is a noticeable issue only above 130mph. Oops, I forgot, your 1.9 cannot do 130mph sorry.

While it seems there is an inferiority complex developing under the hood of that particular 1.9 engine, no one wants to burn tyres or pad linings. A typical scenario for emergency braking that is bad enough to cook brakes is at night, on autobahn, driving quietly for a few minutes at 120mph+, and then a lorry suddenly pulling out and blocking the lane. At night it happens surprisingly often, due to a lot of HGV drivers being overworked / on stimulants. Which is unfortunate, because for just about any other road obstacle air drag is good enough brake if you drive sensibly and let your foot off accelerator as soon as an obstacle is visible.

Diesel makes perfect sense when driving motorway/autobahn at high speeds. In the UK, engine rpms are low enough to keep diesel consumption far lower than petrol. Outside the UK, diesel is 20% cheaper so makes even more sense. Good low end torque means motorway driving is actually far less effort in a diesel, not to mention the range between fill-ups is 20%-30% longer and cost 30%-40% lower than petrol. And if you do crash, fire risk is far lower.

I often do ~1000 mile trips. aside from the fun of driving fast, if I were to do 70mph, I'd need to stop for an overnighter and travel during daytime in traffic. Triple hit on time and double on cost, so for the time being I'll stick to apocalypse riding my 2.5TDI giving ~120mph trip average / 151mph peak speeds across Germany (night only), and ~100mph typical average between most motorway connected destinations in continental Europe.

Edited 18 July, 201213 yr by dieselV6

I'm sorry dieselV6 i've never experienced the problems you mention on autobahn with my 288mm EBC brakes, despite the numerous braking from 130mph (yes that's no problem when the 1.9 is chipped).

I'm sorry dieselV6 i've never experienced the problems you mention on autobahn with my 288mm EBC brakes, despite the numerous braking from 130mph (yes that's no problem when the 1.9 is chipped).

I have in a 2.0PD octy combined with Dutch towing tourists on an a/bahn. 288mm, OEM pads, New OEM fluid.

There is limited feel left after that and the stopping power much reduced.

Move up to 312mm and EBC red combined with fresh super 4 or DOT 5.1 brake fluid and the issue went away.

It's a trade off obviously, but the cost of the carriers was very small and the car needed new 288mm discs anyway, so the move up to 312 was about £4 extra on top of the carriers.

I'm sorry dieselV6 i've never experienced the problems you mention on autobahn with my 288mm EBC brakes, despite the numerous braking from 130mph (yes that's no problem when the 1.9 is chipped).

It's the pads + fluid that matter most for brake fade or lack of it, disc size affects mostly wear rate if uprated pads are already used.

If you have EBC green, red or yellow pads, 288mm is probably enough for 1.9. But as always, if 288mm to 312mm upgrade is simple, it reduces brake system wear (lower thermal load) and is a good idea if you intend to keep car more than a few years, especially that nowadays you can get brake carriers cheaply from scrapyard (lots of Passats/old A6s there).

Chipped 1.9 will do 130mph, but if you really insist on driving 4-cyl this fast for hours at a time, it will gradually overstress the head gasket and lead to coolant expulsion after a few years. Search VW forums, quite a few 1.9s end up this way. 2.5 has lower compression and hence gaskets not much of a problem. Though 1.9 gives much higher gains when chipped thanks to better air/exhaust flow and higher injection pressure.

Chipped 2.5 can leisurely cruise at 130mph without much stress, and push to 151mph, though it takes a moment to get there. When conditions allow, I usually do 130mph-140mph.

For the record, I like 1.9 engine for its fuel economy and reliability more than anything VW produced afterwards, incl the 2.5 and 1.6 that I currently own. However, 1.9 is not powerful enough for driving fast the car of Superb's size. Even 2.5 is marginal.

I think the current A6 3.0 240bhp is just right, and the bi-turbo 313bhp is a bit mad. Too bad Audi puts only auto boxes in the A6 quattros now, could've had me as a customer.

I agree with the speed and stress condition. I wouldn't drive my 1.9 at 130mph for a longer period of time.

Some interesting comments in the last few posts above - so, for someone who knows not a lot about brakes can you guys clarify a few of points for me?

• Am I right in understanding that when discs need changing, because of the small difference in cost a change to the larger disc makes sense and is economically viable?
  
• Larger discs use the same pads (told you I didn't know anything ) but the pads will last longer?
  
• Larger discs will give greater stopping power and help with resistance to fade?
  
• Would any change need to be made to the rear brakes if fronts are upgraded?
  
• For a sometimes push-on and 'enthusiastic' driving style rather than mad/flat out driving, the larger discs with EPC yellow and DOT4 fluid would be an appropriate combination?
  

All guidance very welcome

cheers

All correct points, except the brake fluid.. For any uprated / high friction pads, use either Super DOT4 fluid (Castrol React Performance DOT4, formerly Castrol Response Super DOT4), or a DOT5.1 fluid, otherwise you risk vapour lock in the braking system, which is even worse than brake fade due to overheated stock pads.

But if you choose DOT5.1 fluid, make sure you choose high viscosity one (so you need viscosity data and it gets more complicated). Most DOT5.1 fluids are quite thin and result in squeeky clutch after a while - I experienced that with my Superb and Motul 5.1 fluid.

Below is a selection of fluids likely to work well, based on viscosity (all have uprated wet/dry boiling points):

Shell Donax UB

Castrol React Performance DOT4

Gulf Super brake fluid DOT 4

Motul RBF600

No change to rear brake discs diameter is required, but it does make sense to have same type pads on all brakes, i.e. if you put kevlar pads on the front, put them on the rear too, so that ESP does not have a harder job balancing braking forces in the skid.

Due to increased front disc diameter, there will be marginal shift in braking effort towards front wheels (a few percent), but not large enough to affect stability control and actually good for reducing rear brake wear. Rear brakes are actually overloaded in the Superb.

Different pads front/rear will affect ESP much more, as there can be differences of 30%+ in pad friction between different type pads.

Edited 19 July, 201213 yr by dieselV6

regarding the carriers, are these the ones i need to fit if im going to fit 2.5L discs - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/AUDI-A4-2-5-V6-TDI-FRONT-BRAKE-CALIPER-CARRIER-DRIVERS-SIDE-/221054636736?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item3377e212c0

i just cant make my mind up on what pads to go for? ebc green or yellow!

Greens crack, Yellows do not. But to make your life even easier , how about low dust Reds?

FYI the current VAG brake fluid is good for high boiling temperatures both wet and dry, which is a good thing IMHO.

It actually rated above quite a few performance fluids.

The DOT5.1 point about clutch noise when hot is true.

If you go up to larger disks on an Octy at leat you use the same callipers and pads, but you need longer carriers to accommodate the 312mm discs and then the new discs.

The carriers are a one off cost, and after them the discs are almost the same price wise.

As above greens = not for me

Reds = Nicely low dust and great if you're not tracking it

Yellows = Take more abuse than reds but are dusty.

Edited 20 July, 201213 yr by cheezemonkhai

I must be driving like an old woman since i've never cracked a green pad.

FYI the current VAG brake fluid is good for high boiling temperatures both wet and dry, which is a good thing IMHO.

It actually rated above quite a few performance fluids.

I personally boiled VW (factory fill) fluid in summer 2007, and it was with green pads, has it changed/improved since then?

Edited 20 July, 201213 yr by dieselV6

I personally boiled VW (factory fill) fluid in summer 2007, and it was with green pads, has it changed/improved since then?

I believe so yes. I remember seeing a post on here and other forums mentioning improvements.

For the front Ive gone for ebc red stuff pads. and for the rear ive gone for ebc ultimax discs and pads.

now can i ask, is it necessary to bleed the clutch if im renewing the fluid (different fluid to whats in there at the moment) castrol react performance dot 4 as dieselV6 suggested. ive bought 2L, is this enough?

It's not neccessary to bleed the clutch though they share reservoir, but you get higher boiling point for longer time if you do bleed the clutch as there will be less water overall in the fluid. Reservoir is shared so fluids will migrate over time.

2l is enough to do a very thorough flush including the clutch, I start with the clutch, 300ml, first bleed just to flush reservoir, then use 300ml per wheel, and finish with the clutch, also 300ml,. That still leaves 200ml fluid in reserve.

Remember to either use pressure bleed kit or vacuum bleeder, and operate clutch and brake pedals several times during initial bleeds to replace old fluid in master cylinders.

Edited 2 August, 201213 yr by dieselV6