Vrs bored

[vRSy]

vRSy - £10-12k!! You coudl buy ALLSORTS for that. 

 

 

As you can see, i had predicted such a response, you might notice i said aged upto 3 years and all had low mileage.  ;-)

[logiclee]

Sven's uncle has a VW Touareg 3.0 TDI V6 with the ZF 8 speed box.

 

It really is a very nice gearbox. He did a couple of launches in it previously and I was very impressed. Then at Autobahn speed it's nicely geared.

 

Phil

 

It's rather wide spread now. The wiki list is incomplete but gives a good idea.

Audi[edit source | editbeta]

• Audi A4 North American version
• Audi A5 North American version
• Audi A6^[10]
• Audi A7^[11]
• Audi A8^[12]
• Audi Q5 8AT version^[13]

Bentley[edit source | editbeta]

• Bentley Mulsanne (2010)
• Bentley Continental GT V8
• Bentley Continental Flying Spur (2013)

BMW[edit source | editbeta]

• BMW 1 Series
• BMW 3 Series
• BMW 4 Series
• BMW 5 Series
• BMW 5 GT
• BMW 6 Series
• BMW 7 series
• BMW X1
• BMW X3
• BMW X5
• BMW X6
• BMW Z4

Chrysler[edit source | editbeta]

• Chrysler 300 V6^[14] (2012+ MY)

Dodge[edit source | editbeta]

• Charger V6^[15] (2012 MY+)
• Dodge Durango V6^[16][17](2014 MY+)

Jaguar[edit source | editbeta]

• F-Type
• XF
• XJ

Jeep[edit source | editbeta]

• Jeep Grand Cherokee (WK2) (2014 MY+)
  • 3.6 (845RE)
  • 3.0, 5.7, 6.4 (8HP70)

Lancia[edit source | editbeta]

• Thema V6

Land Rover[edit source | editbeta]

• Discovery 4/LR4
• Range Rover
• Range Rover Sport

Maserati[edit source | editbeta]

• Maserati Ghibli III
• Maserati Quattroporte^[18]

Ram[edit source | editbeta]

• Ram 1500 3.6 L V6, 5.7L V8^[19][20][21] (2013 MY-)
• Ram 1500 3.0 L V6 (2014 MY-)

Rolls-Royce[edit source | editbeta]

• Rolls-Royce Ghost
• Rolls-Royce Phantom (2013)
• Rolls-Royce Wraith (2013)

Volkswagen[edit source | editbeta]

• Volkswagen Amarok^[22]
• ^Touareg

 

 

^{There are a few missing off that list such as the Porsche models.  Cayenne and Panamera.}

 

^{Couple of features being added this year are coast disconnect and launch control.}

 

^{The Audi A8 and Rolls Royce Wraith are using S.A.T Satellite Aided Transmission which uses GPS to ensure you are in the right gear for the corner or hill you are approaching. This will filter down to the other models.}

 

All models get the same ratios 1 to 8 but obviously manufacturers can choose their own final drive ratio.

 

^Cheers

^Lee

Edited 2 September, 2013 by logiclee

[LewJo]

I got fed up with my VRS after about 18 months, I bought a Yeti... Biggest car buying mistake I've ever made, it's soooooo slow! I decided to wait until the new Octy VRS was launched (8months after taking delivery if my Yeti)

So now I have an Octy III VRS TSI DSG on order

[Ootohere]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gk8r2YPn7mo

[sharkrider]

I enjoyed that vid, thanks George

[lol-lol]

All these naturally aspirated engines have just about had their day, shame because the make beautifual noises but are not fuel effecient, too heavy etc.

Even BMW, who have been slow to adopt turbo petrols, have gone this way on the M3 and M5. Result 10% more power from a 20% smaller engine and 15% or so better fuel consumption.

I love the Audi R8 advent which just has the R8 revving up and then down but it is probably something that we will be consigned to the history books soon.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0gvqLZIQss

[logiclee]

All these naturally aspirated engines have just about had their day, shame because the make beautifual noises but are not fuel effecient, too heavy etc. Even BMW, who have been slow to adopt turbo petrols, have gone this way on the M3 and M5. Result 10% more power from a 20% smaller engine and 15% or so better fuel consumption. I love the Audi R8 advent which just has the R8 revving up and then down but it is probably something that we will be consigned to the history books soon. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e0gvqLZIQss

 

Remember BMW was selling turbo petrols 40 years ago. , They've had turbo petrols in the current line up for over 7 years and currently in their most popular line ups 1 Series, 3 Series and 5 Series all the petrol and diesel models are turbo charged. Petrol models feature twin scroll turbos, direct injection and valvetronic variable valve timing with no throttle.

 

I'd say they are pretty much at the front edge of turbo technology, they've pretty much dropped Normally Aspirated engines totally. I don't know of any other mainstream manufacturer that has turbo only line ups.

 

M Models have been Normally Aspirated because of the throttle response and turbo lag concerns, I wouldn't say that has been totally sorted but we are in a very different place than we were even 5 years ago. Probably reached the right time to switch over though.

 

Cheers

Lee

[Ootohere]

After 40 years and all that experience you would expect that they have it down to a T, Total Reliability. Best you can buy.

Ok still after 3 year, even 5 years hopefully.

http://www.motorbeam.com/news/german-engines-among-the-least-reliable.

http://autoexpress.co.uk/car-news/consumer-news/62383/german-cars-among-worst-engine-failures

 

We love the BMW's that you love.

but we must keep coming back to why Manufacturers are moving on from Turbos to using Turbos and Super chargers.

 

BMW's have the 1 or 3 Series and 1.6 Turbo Diesel or a 1.8 Turbo Petrol just putting out similar Power or Torque to a 1390cc Twincharger. The Same with Audi/VW 1.8 Turbo to have the same output as a 1.4 Twincharger.

 

Mostly it is less power from the BMW 1.6 Petrol engines.

& with quite a weight premium using those heavy engines.

So producing power just to combat the extra weight of the engines, that is not efficient really.

BMW is being forced into weight saving not only in the Performance models but in the bread and butter cars now.

 

http://www.carpages.co.uk/guide/bmw/bmw-1-series-guide.asp

http://www.carpages.co.uk/guide/bmw/bmw-3-series-guide.asp

 

george

[logiclee]

The majority of VAG and BMW issues have been on diesels, VAG 2.0 PD diesels and BMW N47 diesel timing chain issues. Mini had an issue with the Supercharged cooper engines upto 2007

The info is from Warranty direct so these are older generation cars we are looking at so usually 3 to 10 years old.

 

Saying that the N47 diesel still has timing chain issues and VAG have been forced by VOSA into paying for expensive injector failures on the 2.0PD. We all now about the issues with the VAG high powered 1.4 Twin charger engines.

 

The 1.6T in the BMW line up has it's power capped in software depending on model. In it's uncapped variant it produces 200bhp and with a few tweeks produces 208bhp in the JCW.

 

For the BMW line up it's available is 75kw, 100kw and 125kw. That's purely a marketing decision so they can have three models sat below the 2.0T. There's very little difference between them, in fact the 100kW and 125kW version are mechanically the same apart from one exhaust section and software.  AC Shnitzer offer 200bhp software upgrades for both the 100kW and 125kW engines. The biggest gain over the normally aspirated engines is the torque curve, although the power is capped maximum torque is still available at 1350rpm on most models with 90% torque at 1000rpm.

 

Every manufacturer is cutting weight, it cuts emissions, but the weight difference between a 1.4 and a 1.6? just 200cc. Then having to had the superchager on the 1.4. Is that saving weight? Not sure, not seen any figures. 

 

What is telling though is VAG are dropping the twin charger engine from new model line ups, they rumoured this would happen over 18 months ago. Modern turbo engines can now produce torque from just above tickover so really no need for a supercharger and you don't get the mechanical losses or reliability issues. A straight TSi is less complex and cheaper.

The 1.4TSi (Single Turbo) with cylinder deactivation will soon be available with 160PS so that will make the lower powered 1.4TSi twin charger and old 1.8TSi obsolete in one go. To be honest that's still pretty tame output from a 1.4 Turbo seeing as most 1.6 Turbo's now push out 200bhp in their higher output forms.

 

Cheers

Lee

Edited 4 September, 2013 by logiclee

[Ootohere]

Interested to see what the Audi S1 will get as an engine.

& what Volvo do.

& BMW, the future is full of little doubts.

Que sera sera as the song went.

 

Small, light & running cool efficient engines, petrol or diesel charging batteries to power efficient electric motors.

For me i think i will try to stick Euro 5 or Euro 6 if VAG can get the Cylinder Deactivation Reliable.

 

george

[logiclee]

Interested to see what the Audi S1 will get as an engine.

& what Volvo do.

& BMW, the future is full of little doubts.

Que sera sera as the song went.

 

Small, light & running cool efficient engines, petrol or diesel charging batteries to power efficient electric motors.

For me i think i will try to stick Euro 5 or Euro 6 if VAG can get the Cylinder Deactivation Reliable.

 

george

 

The next few years will be very interesting as down sizing continues and bhp/litre increases.

 

Ford have their 1.0litre 3 cylinder ecoboost running at 205bhp in a single seater and they have said 170bhp in road trim is a real possibility.

 

BMW will have their 1.5litre 3 cylinder engine soon running at least 170bhp and have hinted at a 1.0litre twin.

 

VAG have made no secret they are looking at 3 cylinder and twin cylinder TSi engines at well under 1 litre and modular diesels with 134bhp per litre with the possibility of a 10 speed DSG.

 

Cheers

Lee

[PulsarET]

We went to Germany the other week for a long weekend. We got a new C-Max (as our hire car) with th 1.0 three pot turbo,WOW what a sweet little engine,had to look under the bonnet to see what engine it had. Both my wife and i where blown away with how well it went, not under powerd at all.

The new engine and turbo tech is coming on hard and fast.

[stu_mcl]

I got bored of mine... so i done the "sensible" thing and replaced it with a 19year old jap car that has alot more power and 4wd, never looked back

[logiclee]

We went to Germany the other week for a long weekend. We got a new C-Max (as our hire car) with th 1.0 three pot turbo,WOW what a sweet little engine,had to look under the bonnet to see what engine it had. Both my wife and i where blown away with how well it went, not under powerd at all.

The new engine and turbo tech is coming on hard and fast.

 

The engine block fits within a sheet of A4 paper. 

[Bullyboy]

Interesting thread.  I came from an RX8 had 2 1/2 good years with it but 2nd kid came along and time to go back to GTI type roots.  Fabia vRS was something a bit left field from the norm and keenly priced so gave it a go.   I only do 4,000 per year as wife has the main car - so really wanted a zippy 2nd car.

 

I am not bored with my fabia like the first poster, but mine comes up in February 2014 at the 3 year old Mark and if finances allow I try to change at this area of time.

 

Not sure if to go with a Fiesta ST type car (although do like the 5 doors with the kids) or go to an new Octy vRS which looks good, although its a bit lumpy with the extras I want.

 

Intreresting comments on what people like and would pick.  

 

Although I might not like or buy the car, I would be interested in trying the Subaru/Toyota GT86 and the new Fiesta ST. 

 

Watch this space towards the end of the year when I take some test drives etc.

 

But got to say still love the Fabia, the DSG is a great gearbox (from never having owned an auto before) and it is still something slighlty left field when compared to other offerings.

[Panther_uk]

I've been looking at the Octy vRS but unless they do some no VAT deals £23k is just too much, you can get a Focus ST with more power for £2k less !!

[RikSlaty]

I've been looking at the Octy vRS but unless they do some no VAT deals £23k is just too much, you can get a Focus ST with more power for £2k less !!

 

Yep I couldn't find much more bang for buck when i orderd my Focus ST. But I do think the new Octavia VRS is a nice looking car.

[Ootohere]

Sadly the Octavia III vRS is getting the likes of IMO, naff cheap plastic infills (fake honeycomb with no holes) at the front,

like you used to get lots of on Seat cars.

but that actually is now common on VWs and quite expensive Audis, and many other Manufactures cars.

(Lovely Interior though for the money  IMO)

 

george

[vRSy]

Had a look at the Mk3 vRS today, lovely interior and great looking car.  I was offered the 0% finance package, but they would not budge on price so it was still still around £24-25k.  What put me off was the buy back price after 3 years of only £9500, so realistically a private sale value of around £10500-11000.  Thats alot of depreciation.  I didnt get to drive it but i think ill be giving it a miss anyhow.

 

My missus wasnt happy about that amount of money lost, and mentioned looking at a Focus RS again, which got us walking around some dealerships looking at S3's and FRS's this afternoon.  I can spend 16-18k on one of these and after 3 years of ownership they will easily be worth over £10k still so its a much better value investment, and of course they handle better and have much more oompf!! I tried persuading her to have another look at the Meganne RS250/265 but she really doesnt like them.

 

So this is the route im going down i think.

[logiclee]

The Mk3 Octy vRS is incredibly expensive for what is a Golf based hatchback.

 

Far enough the Octavia is a new VAG model but for just over £25k you can get a top of the range VW Passat Sport with 177bhp 2.0TDi. Infact £22k is more realistic with discount.

 

Cheers

Lee

[Ootohere]

 Golf based hatchback is misleading.

It is the VW Group MQB Modular Platform as being used on the Audi A3, VW Golf , Seat Leon and Octavia III

So we could say the Golf is based on the Leon.

The Leon is probably the best buy @ £4000 or so less than a Golf diesel manual.

 

The Octavia III Hatches are not £25,000 even with DSG.

 

The 2.0 TDi CR 184 ps manual Hatch is £23,260 & plenty of Dealers will discount that

the 2.0 TSI 220ps manual is £22,990 & again discounts are available.

An Estate with DSG Diesel or Petrol is over £25,000 but again will get discounted.

 

Plenty of used Audis in Aberdeen that the buyer paid over £35,000 a year ago and have lost over £10,000 in a year.

Not bad cars at around £25,000 or less.

 

Plenty of 3 year old VW Passat 2.0 TDI DSG Highline estates around and these have lower asking prices than a 3 year old Fabia vRS at Dealers,

so there is some amount of depreciation on the VW , which might be rather surprising to many,

but a good bargain for someone looking for a good car.

 

george

[logiclee]

People don't seem to be getting any substantial discounts at present, especially if taking the finance.

 

I priced up a diesel DSG hatch with a few options I'd want.

 

Blue, heated seats, cruise control, spare wheel, sunset glass, bluetooth+ that's just over £26k

 

A top of the range VW Passat Sport 2.0TDi DSG 177bhp with similar spec is just £2k more but 15% discount is easy and 20% is not impossible. I think at this stage you'd get the Passat for less money.

 

I think the Octy vRS is great and it's new but it still doesn't feel a premium product and I don't think it's worth more than VW's bigger models and from the reviews it isn't as sharp as the new Golf.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fd40J7ZgjaU

 

 

Cheers

Lee

Edited 7 September, 2013 by logiclee

[Ootohere]

Going and buying a car for 3 years or 4 years and handing it back or knowing you will hand back (Leasing) will cost money and you are right, you do not get good discounts.

 

Buying a car with your own money can get discounts though.

 

Agreed that the Skoda is certainly not a premium product, and might be a good Second Hand buy, just like many VAG vehicles.

Not everyone want bigger anymore, which really is why they often have such big losses in just a few years.

 

Reading reviews from others really does not seem the way to choose cars, but then its how many seem to assess them.

Easy enough to try and see for yourself.

Not sure what Sharp is on family cars, UK 60 mph limits on B roads, they are only cars & transport, they do all go around corners,

and its not like they are proper Sports or track cars. Playing Boy racer on corners that a people carrier travels around easily at the same speed does not seem to prove much.

The Estate vRS Handled fine IMO, & the Hatch & the Golf are only showing a difference in Unladen Weight of 15kg,

so i wonder where the handling or speed difference might come from.

 

george

[logiclee]

 

Not sure what Sharp is on family cars,they are only cars & transport, they do all go around corners

and its not like they are Sports or track cars.

 

george

 

We are back to feel, handling and enjoyment again. 

 

I think many will disagree that cars are only transport and although they all go around corners the way they do it can be very different even at legal speeds

 

Whatever car you own there will be a cost to that over the ownership period and usually the biggest cost is depreciation. That's also why leasing, contract hire and pcp deals have become popular as the major ownership cost is fixed.

I bought my Passat cash for £24k in 2010, I intended to keep it for three years but at three years old (July this year) I couldn't bring myself to swap it as it's never missed a beat, no dings or scratches and it drives like new with no creaks or rattles. Just couldn't justify adding £15k for a new one.

 

But depreciation can be a worry so when we bought the wifes BMW a fixed monthly payment was preferable to shelling out another £25k and wondering how much you will get back. Deal was (£1500+ 36x£300) fixed depreciation cost £12300 including interest.

It's why the premium brands especially Merc Audi and BMW do so well, the lease/pcp deals are so competitive as the depreciation isn't as steep.

The finance deal vRSy was quoted had the Octy vRS losing over £15k in 3 years, working that out on a pcp wouldn't be far off a 184bhp BMW 320d or similar Audi.

Edited 7 September, 2013 by logiclee

[vRSy]

The Octavia III Hatches are not £25,000 even with DSG.

 

george

 

Maybe not if you keep it on the base spec, but once you add what in my opinion are the bare basic required Mod Cons of any new car like cruise control, heated seats, the additional airbags, black pack and metallic paint, sunset glass and heated windscreen, all stuff which i tick on every car i have if its possible, its £26695 before any discount!!  I wouldnt say that was heavy on the options either.  Ive hadnt ticked hardly any of the optional extraslike leather, reverse sensors, bluetooth or multimedia!!

 

With all that they were not happy to drop below £24500.