looks like the vRS is v good value

[pipsyp]

Been having a squiz at Leon ST's. See Seat as a bit of a poor mans Audi nowadays, lower end VAG quality but the ST is a v handsome car and arguably they throw bits at them (on the options list anyway) to make them a bit moe of a dynamic option. Take price out of the equation I think id probably rather have one to my O3 Elegance estate, particularly a 180 TSi or 184 TDi.

.....but jesus dont they just get on the wrong side of pricey when you start ticking the options.

A 1.8 TSi with DSG, and just a few basic bits of kit the vRS more or less already has and youre at 26.5k.....mental in my opinion when 25k arguably buys a perfectly decent spec 2.0 TSi vRS hatch with nigh on the same boot space. The 184 diesel is considerably more. Seat are also not so hot I've found when it comes to finance deals.

I take it all back Skoda I think Seat is the one that should reign its prices in a bit (or at least throw a bit more standard spec at the FR in any case).

Am I also alone in thinking that Seat should stick the 220hp TSI motor in the FR (for old times sake) and offer a performance pack for it? The 1.8 as good as it is is a bit of a cop-out and leaves a huge gap between it and Cupra.

[Yogi-Bear]

nigh on the same boot space.

 

I was with you until that... the boot space on a Leon is nowhere near as big as on an Octavia!

 

And the interior quality on SEATs is terrible.

[Orville]

I own one so am bias, but £25k for a Skoda is is not v good value. Similar spec Audi A4's, 3-Series and C-Classes can be had for similar sums and all offer better quality. The Octy trumps them for space and practicality (which was my main reason for buying one) but if you are considering a Seat Leon space probably doesn't matter so much. In my opinion Audis and BMW's with easily available huge discounts offer better value.

The Octy is a very good car and I really do like mine, but I got what I paid for and nothing more. Not many will agree with me within this forum, but ths is my opinion.

[Zillio]

Original poster is talking about the Leon ST i.e. the estate version which I have seen in the flesh and it does look good with plenty of room in the back.

[neil_f]

I've been thinking I might replace my current mk2 with a leon st. I've not looked at one in the flesh yet but on paper the boot space is not much less than the octavia. Factor in the tech pack that is free just now (led headlights, nav, dab) and I think it's better value than the octavia. Seat dealers also seem more likely to do a deal and delivery times are a lot quicker. Admittedly interior does look inferior. Im waiting to see if they bring out a cupra as I'd definitely go for that over the octavia.

[Mr Grump]

Good value ....I mostly agree, I looked at options due to the build times on the vRS and was pretty hard pushed to find much that came close price wise that had the room (3 kids means space is a major point).

True, some finance deals on Audis did make it similar, but as I wasn't using finance (and had a decent discount agreed with the Skoda Dealer) it was a struggle.

 

I never looked at a Seat, as I am not confident of Spanish build quality (maybe wrongly, just my thoughts).

The A4 at the time was very tempting, but is an outgoing model as was the C class, BMW 3 series were way more expensive when I looked, and add a few options they were very pricey IMO.

In the end Audi couldn't come up with the right car and price for me, the Mazda 6 was considered, but would have cost a little more as discounts weren't as good.

 

TBH the strongest contender on paper was an Insignia SRi VX Line, space and performance similar, worse fuel consumption but my main bugbear was concern over  dealer network, not helped by a sales team at the local dealers more interested in selling the superfluous add-on packages than giving me a price on a car !

 

In the end, the Skoda dealer found me an in the system vRS, I compromised some spec from my original order, but swings and roundabouts, it was available and at the right price. 5 months on, no regrets here

 

I have to say though, if buying on finance, forget the list price, as that's not as important as the right finance package, in that area there might well be better options ...

[mannyo]

Seat delivery times are quicker because they are not selling any cars, so the queue at the factory is shorter, they are stuck between a rock and a hard place. The factory in Spain is losing money hand over fist, so they cannot sell the cars any cheaper because the losses will be even greater. They tried buying into the large car market, buy selling a lightly redesigned old model Audi A4 as the Exeo, which flopped big time to the point it was discontinued and never facelifted or anything.

 

Take the Citigo vs. Mii, the Citigo is selling reasonably well, wheras the Mii is selling very badly. They are having to add attractive options to try and get people to buy the cars and its just not working.

 

They have cost cut the most in the VAG range to try and increase margins on cars sold, the result shows in slightly worse build quality and some things being expensive extras.

 

My brother has just got on of the brand new Insignia SRIs in estate form, and to be fair its not a bad car but the loading area is very narrow because the wheel arches and side trim encroach a lot.

 

A lot have slated the price of the vRS, but its still good value compared to others in the same market sector. You cannot really compare it to the 3 series or C class because they are smaller cars compared to the MK3, perhaps it should be compared more to the 5 series and E class.

[themanwithnoaim]

I'd have to question some that say the Leon ST, Audi A4, Merc C class & BMW 3 series are comparative, boot space maybe but, the interior leg room just ain't where the Octy is.  My six year has trouble putting footprints on the back of the front seats don't get me wrong, she is determined and can manage it but for a family car the Octavia is huge.  Having recently had a friend drive when we went out for dinner (went there in the back and came back home in the front) in his Pug 508, I was just how small some cars are in comparsision to the O3.

 

Maybe try looking at both front & back legroom in addition to the boot space then try to tell me what is the same size as the O3, as a family car its internal space first and foremost then the rest but, that might just be me.

[pipsyp]

I'd have to question some that say the Leon ST, Audi A4, Merc C class & BMW 3 series are comparative, boot space maybe but, the interior leg room just ain't where the Octy is. My six year has trouble putting footprints on the back of the front seats don't get me wrong, she is determined and can manage it but for a family car the Octavia is huge. Having recently had a friend drive when we went out for dinner (went there in the back and came back home in the front) in his Pug 508, I was just how small some cars are in comparsision to the O3.

Maybe try looking at both front & back legroom in addition to the boot space then try to tell me what is the same size as the O3, as a family car its internal space first and foremost then the rest but, that might just be me.

Pretty sure the ST sits on the same stretched floorpan as the Octavia, due to its shape its boot just is not quite so commodious.

[Neily03]

Pretty sure the ST sits on the same stretched floorpan as the Octavia, due to its shape its boot just is not quite so commodious.

 

It's actually 124mm shorter than the Octaiva 3, so more like the Octavia 2 in size...

[themanwithnoaim]

I beg to diff but, just looking at the headlines, the HB Octavia is 127mm longer than the Seat Leon ST.  I can't seem to find the legroom figures in the Seat on-line brochures but, I don't see how its as big on the inside, yes I might be spliting hairs but, I looked long and hard as the SWMBO said "don't just pick another Skoda" when I was looking for a new car and nothing else qute measured up in the £20k range.  Yeah ok that was Q4 2013.

 

OK the vRS is a bit more money but its a bit more car, its only when you shop around and really crunch the numbers that you finally get to the point because nothing is really that different but, the O3 is slightly bigger, slightly cheaper, slightly better finished and all round slightly better than the rest.  True an outgoing model such as a old shape C class or the A4 when the revision comes and you might with a big discount on a 3 year PCP see a cheaper deal due to anover inflated GFV but, I wouldn't try to sell the last of an shape/model privately, just hand it back, far less trouble whatever the trade value tells you.

 

I think the 2014 price rises didn't help the O3 but, the difference is still there just a bit smaller.

[pipsyp]

It's actually 124mm shorter than the Octaiva 3, so more like the Octavia 2 in size...

Point taken, was only going by what I'd heard and hadnt looked at the stats.

[neiln]

Where the seat looks good I believe is the St fr.  With the 1.8 Tsi engine it fills a gap in the octy range.

[MidVRS]

Another point which needs to be considered is those of us on company car plans...When I am looking at the price of a car (under the BIK rules in Ireland) I have to look at the list price, take away 10% and then add in the cost of the options to get the OMV (Open Market Value)...From this the BIK liability is calculated (there are other factors but in basic terms thats how you start) ..So this means two things...Discounts that can be had at a dealership are irrelevant to me so even if say an c class or an A4 was being discounted by a dealer to the same price as an O3 it doesn't count for me...And secondly the less options I have to add the better...I have considered a lot of cars on my current search and none of them stack up as good as the O3...

 

Also, I looked at the ST...A few reasons I didn't bite...The boot is slightly smaller and a different shape which makes it appear even smaller...The interior space is smaller than the O3..The build quality is not as good...No DSG option with the 184 TDi...And lastly the dealer was really not good..

 

D: Best thing about the FR is its not as showy as the vRS..Take the badges off and its no diferent to the standard model

Me: Well apart from the different front grill

D: Well yes apart from the grill

Me: and the lower suspension

D: Yes the grill and the lower suspension

Me and the steering wheel gear knob and seats

D: Yes, apart from the grill, suspension, steering wheel gear knob and seats

Me: What did the Romans ever do for us

[pipsyp]

Another point which needs to be considered is those of us on company car plans...When I am looking at the price of a car (under the BIK rules in Ireland) I have to look at the list price, take away 10% and then add in the cost of the options to get the OMV (Open Market Value)...From this the BIK liability is calculated (there are other factors but in basic terms thats how you start) ..So this means two things...Discounts that can be had at a dealership are irrelevant to me so even if say an c class or an A4 was being discounted by a dealer to the same price as an O3 it doesn't count for me...And secondly the less options I have to add the better...I have considered a lot of cars on my current search and none of them stack up as good as the O3...

Also, I looked at the ST...A few reasons I didn't bite...The boot is slightly smaller and a different shape which makes it appear even smaller...The interior space is smaller than the O3..The build quality is not as good...No DSG option with the 184 TDi...And lastly the dealer was really not good..

D: Best thing about the FR is its not as showy as the vRS..Take the badges off and its no diferent to the standard model

Me: Well apart from the different front grill

D: Well yes apart from the grill

Me: and the lower suspension

D: Yes the grill and the lower suspension

Me and the steering wheel gear knob and seats

D: Yes, apart from the grill, suspension, steering wheel gear knob and seats

Me: What did the Romans ever do for us

They do DSG on the 184 TDi now BTW

[MidVRS]

They do DSG on the 184 TDi now BTW

So I'll add that to the list of the incorrect answers I got from the Dealer :clap:

 

In fairness to him maybe there are no plans to release it in Ireland but when I asked he said that Seat had no plans to build it!

[pipsyp]

So I'll add that to the list of the incorrect answers I got from the Dealer :clap:

In fairness to him maybe there are no plans to release it in Ireland but when I asked he said that Seat had no plans to build it!

Sorry they do in the UK at least, possibly restricted in Ireland. Seat do definitely do the FR in 184 DSG guise now though. Edited 15 August, 2014 by pipsyp

[neil_f]

Seat delivery times are quicker because they are not selling any cars, so the queue at the factory is shorter, they are stuck between a rock and a hard place. The factory in Spain is losing money hand over fist, so they cannot sell the cars any cheaper because the losses will be even greater. They tried buying into the large car market, buy selling a lightly redesigned old model Audi A4 as the Exeo, which flopped big time to the point it was discontinued

.

Seat are struggling to sell cars? Agree the exeo and previous toledo were a disaster but I see far more leons on the road than octavia 3 (yes I know they've been out longer). A lot of taxi drivers seem to have switched to toledo now instead of octavia as well.Also leon fr/cupra appears to get better reviews than octavia 3 in most press reviews. If they bring out a hotter version of the vrs then I would deffo go for it. Agree that octavia does offer fantastic space for the money but don't think the styling is really that radical over the previous model. In saying that the leon cupra is too subdued in comparison to the mk1 cupra r. Oh well not changing my mk2 just yet so will worry about it in a year or so. Hopefully by then they'll be a good selection of second hand vrs with the spec I want. Seems most folk on here have added quite a few options when ordering.

[fabdavrav]

VW are looking to regain some profit back after the failed takeover of fiat/Chrysler...................................Seat is making a loss they might sell.............

 

I chose a MK7 Golf estate over the Octavia as I didn't want the 2lt engine, but want the XDS & The multilink rear suspension. That only means the 1.8L&K which has leather (don't want), & high tax & fuel consumption.

 

Got a GT 1.4TSI 140PS which ABT do an ECU for 170PS 290NM, guaranteed to not affect the low co2 of the 1.4, & is still better than the 1.8 on fuel!!, plus have the lighter nose weight...win win........................plus I like the dash better......it looks 14yrs newer & 2 1/2 time more cost than my old Fabia.............the Octavia doesn't in my eyes

[kenny]

I think people are wearing some rose tinted glasses

The prices of Octavia's have shot up, cars aren't usually about one thing, it's the package.

So price rise isn't the whole story, nor is leg room lol

It's good value if you need exactly what the octavia has to offer, but then so are most cars in the normal price range

To me the octavia is fairly priced but that's as far as I'd go. 0% made it a better deal tho

[Zdenek Fibich]

There's an interesting 'Our Cars' first report on a Volvo V60 in this week's Autocar, where Hilton Holloway implies, reasonably enough, that it costs a lot less than a BMW 525d Touring.  He could also usefully have compared the £36,000 V60 with the £24,000 Octavia vRS estate like mine. 

 

The V60 looks like a good car but I'm struggling to see how it's worth £12,000 more than the Octavia.  And I don't think that the V60 could have done what my Octavia managed on two days this week: taken an old 6ft bed and mattress to the tip, and then swallowed a wheelbarrow, a lawnmower and seven crates of pictures to go to Dorset.

[fastestlouigie]

The Leon range (inc. the ST) has £1000 Seat deposit contribution, 0% PCP and free technology pack now. If this deal had been available last summer, I'd have probably chosen Seat over Skoda tbh.

Autoexpress seem to like it:

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/seat/leon/87821/new-car-awards-2014-best-estate-car

Edited 16 August, 2014 by fastestlouigie

[Orville]

The Octavia's trump card is space. If you need plenty of passenger and cargo space whilst wanting something a bit sporty also then for the price very little can compete. However if space is not a concern then there are better performing and higher quality feeling performance hatches/estates available for similar money. The Octavia's VRS fits a niche that nothing else quite matches.

[pipsyp]

The Leon range (inc. the ST) has £1000 Seat deposit contribution, 0% PCP and free technology pack now. If this deal had been available last summer, I'd have probably chosen Seat over Skoda tbh.

Autoexpress seem to like it:

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/seat/leon/87821/new-car-awards-2014-best-estate-car

Though I'm pretty sure their 0% finance requires you to put down quite a hefty deposit; something id never do with a PCP myself anymore.

[MidVRS]

The Octavia's trump card is space. If you need plenty of passenger and cargo space whilst wanting something a bit sporty also then for the price very little can compete. However if space is not a concern then there are better performing and higher quality feeling performance hatches/estates available for similar money. The Octavia's VRS fits a niche that nothing else quite matches.

Hit the nail on the head there Orville