Manufacturers make engines that have to 'survive' everywhere they sell the car, not just the UK or Europe. That means they have to have massively big tolerances to avoid huge numbers of failures in countries where the engines are fed on camel dung or whatever passes for fuel... not everywhere has 99RON or even 95RON fuel (or diesel that is as kind to the engine as Fairy washing up liquid is to your hands).

Also, I have no idea whether VAG do this, but it wouldn't surprise me... sometimes the same engine is used and tuned differently for different models - BMW in the 1 series (and this is as I've been told, so it could be slightly inaccurate) use the same engine in the 116d, 118d and 120d - it's just mapped differently. I think there are different hardware components as well, but it's still the same basic 2.0L turbo diesel engine.

Bang on ! Not just fuel types but other factors like temperature ranges as well , big difference between the winter in Iceland and the summer in Barcelona

Bang on ! Not just fuel types but other factors like temperature ranges as well , big difference between the winter in Iceland and the summer in Barcelona

Yeah, less pickpockets and annoying Spanish drug dealers for a start...

That just isn't true , it's very easy to map an engine incorrectly and for it to be damaged. Even more hit and miss with a tuning box in some ways , you are relying on the stock software to to make the right decision based on manipulated and therefore inaccurate data from the sensors

Ok I'll reword my statement and say if you use a reputable company it is very unlikely. I worked for a retailer for ten years remapping vehicles using well known software as well as selling tuning boxes. Never had any issues with reliability on any vehicle. The tuning boxes have certainly improved over the years to the point that I'm tempted to try one again. Only reason being I can't be bothered with the hassle of getting the remap put back on again after the car has been serviced as it is highly likely nowadays that the dealer will do a software update. When I had my octavia I told the dealer it was remapped and specifically asked them not to do any software updates but they still did it!

 BMW.....use the same engine in the 116d, 118d and 120d - it's just mapped differently.

 

How long before manufacturers offer to upgrade you? - Can't afford the 120d this year? Don't worry, you can still have your 1 series, take a 118d and then come back later and for another £x,xxx (fill in the blanks) BMW will upgrade your engine and change the badge on the back while you wait.

 

VCDS is gonna go way up in price when VAG start doing this!

How long before manufacturers offer to upgrade you?

 

Why would they do that?  They can make more money selling you a completely new car... not to mention the small profit they'll also turn buying the used one off you and selling it on again.

How long before manufacturers offer to upgrade you? - Can't afford the 120d this year? Don't worry, you can still have your 1 series, take a 118d and then come back later and for another £x,xxx (fill in the blanks) BMW will upgrade your engine and change the badge on the back while you wait.

 

VCDS is gonna go way up in price when VAG start doing this!

 

VAG do do this, the 2.0 TDI is the same basic engine for both the 150 and 184 version. The 1.4 TFSI is the same basic unit for the 122 and 150 versions... You only have to Wiki VAG engines to see loads of the engines with same capacity/different powers are the same bar a different map, and occasionally a slightly bigger turbo or heftier pistons.

 

By 'this' I mean same engine/different powers - not offer upgrades!

Why would they do that?  They can make more money selling you a completely new car... not to mention the small profit they'll also turn buying the used one off you and selling it on again.

 

I guess I'm in the minority in buying my cars outright (never new either) and then keeping them until something expensive happens, but I'm assuming that most people that buy new cars on PCP or whatever are keeping them for 2-3 years. I reckon this is habitual, and even if you could upgrade within this period you'd still want a new one when the PCP came to an end.

 

Servicing is one ongoing revenue generator, but this would be another way to make money out of you within that period. I suppose there's some difference here between the manufacturer, who just wants to shift cars, and the dealer, who is already trying to charge OTT for a coat of some protective polish and a plastic rubbing strip and would jump at the chance to add something else.

 

I dunno, maybe it doesn't work yet, but I can see a time when the car will have "in app purchases". No need to take it to the dealer even, just put your credit card into the infotainment system, punch in you PIN and dial up the extra 50bhp. £1,000 for an outright purchase or £5/hr for a temporary boost before it reverts to its original tune.

Edited 10 February, 201511 yr by Geek42

Folk are talking about more power, more torque, better 'drivability', even improved mpg! What's the down side? How come the manufacturers aren't able to optimise their engines as well as small scale 3rd party tuners?

Do tuned engines breach some emission limit? Are their lives shortened? Why aren't new cars shipped in this improved, tuned state?

Well, in Norway some manufacturers optimize the cars, but only to meet the taxsystem so the car will be abit less expencive.

Still considering this but I am leaning towards a Tuning Box for the following reasons:

 

1/ It is cheaper - get the elephant in the room out of the way first!

2/ It can be removed when the car goes into a dealer

3/ It can be removed when I have to hand the car back at the end of the PCP period 

 

Any more thoughts and comments? It all makes for fascinating reading.  

How long before manufacturers offer to upgrade you? - Can't afford the 120d this year? Don't worry, you can still have your 1 series, take a 118d and then come back later and for another £x,xxx (fill in the blanks) BMW will upgrade your engine and change the badge on the back while you wait.

VCDS is gonna go way up in price when VAG start doing this!

Vag already do, a friend of mine is a mapper in South Wales and he found a VW van , not sure if the model which shares the same engine, turbo and injectors with another much higher hp version. The customer had a remap and pretty much doubled his power

Still considering this but I am leaning towards a Tuning Box for the following reasons:

1/ It is cheaper - get the elephant in the room out of the way first!

2/ It can be removed when the car goes into a dealer

3/ It can be removed when I have to hand the car back at the end of the PCP period

Any more thoughts and comments? It all makes for fascinating reading.

Yes you are right those are all good reasons to fit a box over a remap , mind you the question should be why do anything ? At least considering points 2&3

In fact I wonder what the implications would be if a car on pcp was found to have a map on it and get TD1'd? I'm sure there would be something in the agreement about preserving warranty etc

If you were to be entirely sensible, then there is no point in doing it given it is on PCP, etc. 

 

But then again, if I were sensible I'd have bought a 1.6TDi S.... 

Tuning box is definitely the safest bet I reckon, they work well and are far less likely to bring about any warranty concerns for you mate.

Given I am now likely stuck with my car for a year or two I might well consider a DTUK box as and when its practical financially to get one (rarely is though nowadays!) and cook my 288mm brakes just a bit more haha

Edited 12 February, 201511 yr by pipsyp

Folk are talking about more power, more torque, better 'drivability', even improved mpg! What's the down side? How come the manufacturers aren't able to optimise their engines as well as small scale 3rd party tuners?

Do tuned engines breach some emission limit? Are their lives shortened? Why aren't new cars shipped in this improved, tuned state?

Aside from all that others have said, you WON'T get better mpg and I defy anyone to prove otherwise. Some people try to justify this as 'you drive it harder'. But actually the fact is you get a bit more power for a bit less economy.

I have a dtuk box and I'm happy with it. I am pretty anal about my mpg and I've documented about 44 average with the box vs around 48 without. Both of which are a disappointing to be honest compared with my mk1 and mk2 diesels which achieved 60 mpg and 55 mpg respectively (ok so they were not the same engines but they did at least give me the same as what skoda claimed, unlike the mk3.

Tuning box is definitely the safest bet I reckon, they work well and are far less likely to bring about any warranty concerns for you mate.

Given I am now likely stuck with my car for a year or two I might well consider a DTUK box as and when its practical financially to get one (rarely is though nowadays!) and cook my 288mm brakes just a bit more haha

 

I'm worried out my front tyres too! I wore through the first set in 12k! 

 

Aside from all that others have said, you WON'T get better mpg and I defy anyone to prove otherwise. Some people try to justify this as 'you drive it harder'. But actually the fact is you get a bit more power for a bit less economy.

I have a dtuk box and I'm happy with it. I am pretty anal about my mpg and I've documented about 44 average with the box vs around 48 without. Both of which are a disappointing to be honest compared with my mk1 and mk2 diesels which achieved 60 mpg and 55 mpg respectively (ok so they were not the same engines but they did at least give me the same as what skoda claimed, unlike the mk3.

 

Glad I'm not the only who has had only managed mid-40s MPG. I must admit it isn't as good as I was expecting it to be - though still better than the tfsi I was running before. 

If it genuinely is a 'worry' stay standard

Simples

Just for the nay sayers.... was running around 41mpg as standard, now passed 51 long term with the box fitted....

 

Having the extra performance means you can dawdle most of the time, knowing you have the performance in hand when you need / want it.

 

And to be honest, the tdi as standard is a pretty blunt weapon. I was disappointed if Im honest with the standard car. I bought the box because it turned the car into something I wanted to drive more. That's personal choice. The standard car never had enough performance for me and I bought it intended to improve it...

Just for the nay sayers.... was running around 41mpg as standard, now passed 51 long term with the box fitted....

 

Is this calculated from actual mileage vs. actual fill volumes, or taken from the vehicle computer? I've often wondered whether the computer is unable to calculate mpg with a tuning box, since some of the data is externally manipulated. I guess it depends on whether it's ECU inputs or outputs that are manipulated, and exactly what data the computer is using for the mpg calculation.

Is this calculated from actual mileage vs. actual fill volumes, or taken from the vehicle computer? I've often wondered whether the computer is unable to calculate mpg with a tuning box, since some of the data is externally manipulated. I guess it depends on whether it's ECU inputs or outputs that are manipulated, and exactly what data the computer is using for the mpg calculation.

The computer should remain as accurate (or inaccurate!) as without the tuning box as the fuel flow rate sensor is not manipulated. Only the boost pressure and fuel rail pressure on a TDI, and in addition the crank position sensor on a petrol.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The computer should remain as accurate (or inaccurate!) as without the tuning box as the fuel flow rate sensor is not manipulated. Only the boost pressure and fuel rail pressure on a TDI, and in addition the crank position sensor on a petrol.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What he said... I just drive it... (and read the mpg readout)

If computer readout remains the same, why some people have reported adjusting the values with vcd safter fitting TB?

Edited 13 February, 201511 yr by toni8b

As I inferred, it was probably inaccurate before the TB as well - most are. What a TB may do is show up any inaccuracies, so if if was 5% out before, it may become 8% say. But if it was calibrated correctly before it will remain so after (if you multiply 0% inaccuracy by X you still get 0%).

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

You can't trust the computer if a tuning box or remap is done but I gained about 10% better economy on my cr170 Superb* following a remap and dpf delete BUT only if driven very sensibly , try to exploit that extra power and fuel economy drops to much worse than stock , you can't make extra power with no trade off , you have to burn fuel to get it

*fill to fill