Looking for a new lappy (gonna bite the bullet as it'll be pre-loaded with Win 10 but I have OE discs of 7 in 32 bit and 64 bit)

Question though is this. Does Win 10 see and utilise the extra RAM; I know XP, 7 etc need to be 64 bit to see and use RAM > ~ 3.5 Gb but does Win 10 do something different? I realise the X64/ 86 comes into play. If Win 10 doesn't see and use the extra RAM then what's the point of selling a new pooter with 8Gb of RAM if it's only going to use ~ 3.5 Gb?

 

Two on my list; http://www.pcworld.co.uk/gbuk/computing/laptops/laptops/toshiba-satellite-c55-c-184-15-6-laptop-black-10141828-pdt.html

                        http://www.pcworld.co.uk/gbuk/computing/laptops/laptops/lenovo-z50-15-6-laptop-white-10137500-pdt.html

 

Reason for new laptop; keyboards borked on the current one

Same applies to 10 as 7 regarding its ability to utilise RAM, difference is you'll struggle to buy a consumer laptop with 32bit Windows 10. The limit was due to the 32bit OS only being able to address ~4GB of RAM.

 

8GB should be considered standard on a new laptop with Windows 10 imho.

Same applies to 10 as 7 regarding its ability to utilise RAM, difference is you'll struggle to buy a consumer laptop with 32bit Windows 10. The limit was due to the 32bit OS only being able to address ~4GB of RAM.

 

8GB should be considered standard on a new laptop with Windows 10 imho.

Yeah, that's why the specs threw me; the Tosh one says Win 10 64 bit yet the Lenovo specs just say Win 10, same on other models.

Chances are it'll be 64 bit then?

Cheers, Dan.

32bit Windows 10 is rare on a new PC/laptop and you'd get blank looks in PCW if you asked for it I bet :P

Yes, it will be 64 bit

Yes, it will be 64 bit

Thanks Dr. Z. Farmville should be much better with 8Gb of RAM

Dont worry the sales person will try and up sell you as many extras as they can.

 

Was in pc-cooker&fridge-world  last week and was told the following...

 

AVG is not compatible with the pc I reserved and I need their offering.extra ££

My existing office is not transferable to new pc. so extra ££

The memory is not sufficient for my work and I need a cloud subscription, more ££

Also told the extended warranty is very useful for this laptop, more ££

 

Although I reserved the pc (acer) online,i was expecting it to be ready for collection but no,had to sit through a sales talk reminded me of timeshare.

 

Walked out and went across the road to check prices in staples and it was cheaper,so bought there and no up selling talk.

Dont worry the sales person will try and up sell you as many extras as they can.

Was in pc-cooker&fridge-world last week and was told the following...

AVG is not compatible with the pc I reserved and I need their offering.extra ££

My existing office is not transferable to new pc. so extra ££

The memory is not sufficient for my work and I need a cloud subscription, more ££

Also told the extended warranty is very useful for this laptop, more ££

Although I reserved the pc (acer) online,i was expecting it to be ready for collection but no,had to sit through a sales talk reminded me of timeshare.

Walked out and went across the road to check prices in staples and it was cheaper,so bought there and no up selling talk.

I'm no stranger to PC world and their up selling. I'll cut the 'tech guy' down rapidly and screw his commission lol

Actually, I might play along and tell him why he's wrong

I was in there last night and overheard a lady who wanted to buy a chromebook being told "all your stuff is stored on Google drive and they wipe that clean after 2 years '.

I interrupted and pointed out that's nonsense and that I now use a chromebook for work using office 365

Sent from my XT1562 using Tapatalk

I don't find it economic to change a laptop just because the keyboard dies. I fix rather than replace, shop around for the parts, keyboard, hd, ram, psu, screens, and google the how to video's.

It does annoy my kids though...they have the oldest ipods and laptops in the world

Edited 16 April, 201610 yr by camelspyyder

Back On Topic...

 

If you need a laptop, it is always suggested you buy the best spec you can afford (but check out if the RAM is accessible and upgradable). Unlike a desktop, it is very difficult (if not impossible) to upgrade the cpu on a lappy, so if you buy a low/mid range model, you will find it struggling to keep up with software bloat in only a year or so, especially if the on-board gfx wasnt that good.

 

DVD, HDD and RAM can usually be upgraded easily, so dont worry about them so much.

 

So, buy the best cpu/gfx board you can afford, and dont worry about small storage sizes or reduced RAM.

 

Or why not buy a top end tablet (no, I dont mean an ithing).

Are you definitely after new?

 

The things that matter the most are?

 

In the last 5 years processors have not really gotten much faster, instead we've seen better power usage, i.e. less. 

This class of 15" laptops is a wash with cheap components/mixed processors and odd storage.

 

DVD etc can be solved with an external plugin one, for the times you really need it. Want to watch a dvd away, rip it, put it on a memory stick.

 

Storage can be solved with crazy USB 3 storage, e.g. my usb caddy is faster than my local nas on a 1Gb network.

 

Screen - cannot be changed easily so this is the main thing you;re looking at, it has to be right. Glossy or matt?

 

Personally I can't stand glossy.

 

What I'd do for that budget is actually go for an older thinkpad T430 for example.

 

The model numbers briefly, a T is a type of laptop, like the Z in the z50. 

 

the 4 of the 430 is the size of the zcreen, so 4 = 14" and 5 = 15"

 

the 3 of the 430 is the processor generation, so a 420 is a 14" 2nd gen intel and the 430 is the 14" 3rd gen. we're on 6th gen atm. 

 

There is an extra s on some models, 420s this denotes a slim version. It does place some restrictions on replacement disks, but most are fine now.

 

I would avoid the 1st gen, e.g. a 410 or 510. Optimal would be 3rd or 4th, best value is still 3rd.

 

I use a x230, which is a x class, 12" 3rd gen i5. it's as fast in day to day stuff like browsing as a desktop i7, but it runs out of multitasking puff way before.

 

Almost all the thinkpads are i5, I would not advise any different choice for the next 5years computing.

 

I would advise either a 14 or a 15 with a resolution of 1920 or 1600, I would avoid the 'crappy' panels that offer 1376 res on a 15". I'd also try to pick the screens based on IPS, this is a better class of panel, better colours etc.

 

Almost all on this ebay list would be an equivalent performing machine to those two choices above. They can be upgraded, SSD, Ram, replacement parts a plenty. My x230 had her fan replaced in <20 mins by a field engineer. I had the remains of a 3yr onsite warranty.

Just watch out for the screen res, a lot of them are 1376!

 

If you get any with the old win 7/8 on, you can upgrade to 10... then reinstall for free. All the above is an avenue to explore and personally they'd be better than half the dros in pc world.

HTH.

On ram specifically, a modern os will use and hold ram for applications.

 

So lets say you open 50 chrome tabs, and use 7gb of ram. you then open email and use another 1.

 

I know the os needs some too!

 

Now you close email.

 

Hang on you forgot to send Jean a photo, open it up, should be quicker top open. The Os whilst the application has quit, will of kept some files in ram. This varies from os to os. If you're out of ram, then the os will unload and replace. So more ram is always good.

 

If you're out of ram then the os will use swap, this is space on your disk to literally swaps stuff out too while it's juggling your demands. At this point everything becomes a bit laggy if you're alt tabbing between say chrome and email as they will be trying to swap which accesses your slower disk.

 

This effect is reduced somewhat with modern SSD as it's alot faster... however doing it a lot will reduce the life of your ssd. So it's always better to have more ram than less. 8gb is a min I'd say for anyone who does web browsing multitasking and has more than 15 or 20 tabs open.

 

After that the amount of multitasking and type of work make the processor choice key. 

If you don't want to pay up front just make sure you have a ram slot free. Then it'll be trivial to add later.

 

I've an i5 lappy with 4G running W10 64bit. No ram related issues however it doesn't do any heavy work.

 

Both of your laptops have **** awful (but large) hard disks. they'll slow things down more than any issue with memory.

 

Budget an extra £70 and shove in a 500Gb SDD stick the supplied disk in an enclosure and use it for backups.

I'm no stranger to PC world and their up selling. I'll cut the 'tech guy' down rapidly and screw his commission lol

Actually, I might play along and tell him why he's wrong

 

I just tell them if they lie to me again, the sale's walking out the door.

 

I did quite a few years back while buying a biiiiiiiiiiig telly for mum and dad for Christmas. The guy was amendment I needed a £15 gold-plated aerial cable. Warned him once (it's going into ferrous sockets, so the difference in metal increases the chances of corrosion thank you), he tried it again and I let him carry on right until he carried the box to the checkout, then I told him why and left him standing there with it.

If you don't want to pay up front just make sure you have a ram slot free. Then it'll be trivial to add later.

I've an i5 lappy with 4G running W10 64bit. No ram related issues however it doesn't do any heavy work.

Both of your laptops have **** awful (but large) hard disks. they'll slow things down more than any issue with memory.

Budget an extra £70 and shove in a 500Gb SDD stick the supplied disk in an enclosure and use it for backups.

Chances are I'll still despise Win 10 so will probably do a clean install of 7 which would almost certainly go on an SSD. Looking at a few on the Novatech site; prices have dropped dramatically since I last looked into them over a year ago!

Chances are I'll still despise Win 10 so will probably do a clean install of 7 which would almost certainly go on an SSD. Looking at a few on the Novatech site; prices have dropped dramatically since I last looked into them over a year ago!

 

I've just put a Tb SSD in the desktop. after the cheap Sandisk popped it was frustrating to go back to spinning rust. Cost about £150 on some Amazon offer.

I've just put a Tb SSD in the desktop. after the cheap Sandisk popped it was frustrating to go back to spinning rust. Cost about £150 on some Amazon offer.

 

I dont trust SSDs for important data any longer; they are supposed to fail to "read only", but my experience is that they can die completely with no warning.

I dont trust SSDs for important data any longer; they are supposed to fail to "read only", but my experience is that they can die completely with no warning.

 

Mirrored to old spinning rust Tb disk.

 

+ Photos and docs sync'd to external USB disk.

 

+ docs sync'd to cloud storage

 

+ docs and photos monthly sync'd to offline disk.

 

 

already had one SSD pop after only a few weeks but I had a full cloned backup to fall over to.

 

Seen too many ransomware attacks now not to have offline backups of precious stuff.

 

I looked at getting a tape drive but the prices were getting silly.

I dont trust SSDs for important data any longer; they are supposed to fail to "read only", but my experience is that they can die completely with no warning.

 

 

We've got 200 laptops with SSD fitted and we've not had one fail to the point that we cannot get data off it. Actually, we've not lost one yet as there is no moving parts, if there are any problems we just back up, format the drive and re-image the machine. We use Kingsinton drives and swap them out with the OEM HDD upon building the laptop up.

 

I'm a big fan of them.

We've got 200 laptops with SSD fitted and we've not had one fail to the point that we cannot get data off it. Actually, we've not lost one yet as there is no moving parts, if there are any problems we just back up, format the drive and re-image the machine. We use Kingsinton drives and swap them out with the OEM HDD upon building the laptop up.

 

I'm a big fan of them.

 

Well done, I have had a total of five, fitted to four computers, one died with no warning only a few weeks after it was fitted, a total loss of all data.

 

To be fair, the oldest (Patriot) has been in use without any issues for more than six years; it was the failure mid-session with no warning that worries me, at least with spinning rust you usually get plenty of warnings and can recover most, if not all of your data before it finally dies.

 

They get used for OS partitions only, all data gets stored in rust format; when prices/sizes improve, I will look at SSD RAID's, but until then I remain wary.

Thtat's bad luck. Were they all the same make and model?

It was a SanDisk that went pop for me. Came up as an unrecognised disk one day and that was it.

 

As GG says with SSD you get no warning, and when they go they're gone.

 

I'm suggesting to the work that we should install SSDs in all our machines. The time they will save booting and in operation plus the reduced energy costs should mean they pay for themselves quite rapidly.

Dont worry the sales person will try and up sell you as many extras as they can.

 

Was in pc-cooker&fridge-world  last week and was told the following...

 

AVG is not compatible with the pc I reserved and I need their offering.extra ££

My existing office is not transferable to new pc. so extra ££

 

Cn't comment on AVG, as I use AVAST FREE and same version on XP Pro 32, W7/64 & W10 64. As expected, with only 2 GB ram W10 runs notchy  on some apps,but W7 is far faster on everything bar adding text to Adobe Photoshop elements docs scanned in . So for that I use XP. I suppose if I was to use W10 for more than trying it out, I'd add more memory,but as i can add downloads as I want on W7 ,I'll stick with 7. There's also the dreaded download limit- any more than 2GB/month and I pay. I could pay for another 1gb, but that expires at month end, whether you've used 100k or 999K.nothing carries over. So, untill Windows 10 changes to allow downloads ,I'll keep on using W7.

Office not transferable - I'm using my old 2003 on all versions and even PHOTODRAW 2000 with no problems.

Warranty claims- I suspect one of these days we'll have a PPI situation,with warranties over /mis sold. .

Sales persons- one of these days clothes shops will design the correct suite for sales persons, with two sets of trousers, and two openings, so that they can spout their garbage at both ends.

Anyone remember the music centre days of the late 70's, where sales persons reeled off facts and stats like a today TV bad driving program, when anyone above 50 would have problems with the frequency range of the kit.

These days, commission is not on the sale, but on the extras they can sell you. ( or rather persuade you that you need, by fair means or foul). Anyone had a breakdown service come out cure the problem, have the engine running, then switch off and suggest you might need oil( which they ,conveniently carry), at twice the shop price? I was with daughter one day when she had battery problems and called out one of the services. Simple jump start and car started. Engine ran for a few minutes, then switched off and oil checked. I was about to comment, when I got the "No dad " look, and she asked how much, and found out. little did our con man know but the sweet looking little lady is a biker nut, and her hubby mucks around with bikes, with her help, and she knows that you only check engine oil when you know that all has returned to the sump.

Thtat's bad luck. Were they all the same make and model?

 

All the new ones are Patriot now, I also have a 2 y/o KingSpec that I've relegated to my daughters PC, but works well, and when tested, exceeded the read/write specs by a fair margin. It was a KingDian that went pop; one of the new TLC 250GB models, bought from the makers own web shop.