England/Scotland Football, no poppys...............

[Auric Goldfinger]

FiFA says no poppys are to be worn on Shirts or armbands when the teams meet on Armistice day

 

 

Uttery, utterly disgusting desicion..

 

Your thoughts please, 

Edited 2 November, 2016 by Auric Goldfinger

[Rustynuts]

I wouldn't have asked for their permission. No bugger else would, they'd just have worn what they thought was appropriate.

Now the question's been asked then they're in contravention of a Fifa ruling, whereas before they wouldn't have been.

[Gaz]

FiFA says no poppys are to be worn on Shirts or armbands......

 

 

Buy a poppy, wear it on your socks!

 

Poor decision IMO  :no:

 

Gaz

Edited 2 November, 2016 by V6TDI

[Ootohere]

There really is no need for the Poppies to be displayed on their kit during the match IMO, it is not as though the emblem on an armband or strip will benefit the charity.

No need then to allow other countries players to wear or display emblems that are going to offend people in other countries.

 

The Poppy emblems can be displayed around the pitch in an obvious way if the FA are wanting to do that.

The players and the FA can all give generously to the charity, and also the Politicians can make a generous donation, 

maybe to the value of the tickets they are getting for free to attend the match.

Edited 2 November, 2016 by Offski

[gadgetman]

There really is no need for the Poppies to be displayed on their kit during the match IMO, it is not as though the emblem on an armband or strip will benefit the charity.

No need then to allow other countries players to wear or display emblems that are going to offend people in other countries.

The Poppy emblems can be displayed around the pitch in an obvious way if the FA are wanting to do that.

The players and the FA can all give generously to the charity, and also the Politicians can make a generous donation,

maybe to the value of the tickets they are getting for free to attend the match.

This.

As unpopular as it is it's an issue that's always been around and only got everyone foaming at the mouth when the Sun stirred it up.

What if an Islamic country wanted to have a similar 'symbol' honouring their fallen soldiers? There would be outrage especially from many who are foaming at the mouth over this.

There's nothing stopping events or charity support, merely the wearing of the poppy symbol during the game which fifa disallows.

[Ootohere]

The Royal British Legion are there to support Veterans and Family's not only of the fallen. All good and worth while obviously.

Remembrance of those that have fallen has now been taken over that the commercial aspect of Poppies and the selling of some pretty fancy creations and not just those 

made by Disabled Veterans and others with all proceeds going to the British Legion.

 

When i was young & at school we used to get the parts delivered and we put the Poppy together and buy ours and sell ones,

that was when it was a metal pin before it because a snap together plastic part.

Edited 2 November, 2016 by Offski

[moley]

The reason FIFA oppose the wearing of the poppy is that they can't make any money out of it.

[fabdavrav]

FIFA have not banned it just stated that the clubs will face disiplinary action/fines.

 

Also it applies even if they wear the black armband with the poppy symbol on the arm band.

 

Political symbol,?? really WTF are they thinking...sorry NOT thinking!!

 

One thing which got right up my nose was that woman who was interviewed getting out of that Jag (ex UN person now in football) who was talking about not making exceptions & wars in places like Syria.

 

I'm sorry but a lot of the refugees in those counties want to come over here to this country because it is the way it is. However this country is that way because of the sacrifice that our people/forces have made over the past few hundred years....& they have a go at us wanting to honour/remember them on our national remembrance day!??

 

Really go to F*** ing hell!!

[gadgetman]

Political symbol,?? really WTF are they thinking...sorry NOT thinking!!

It doesn't just represent the brave sacrifice made by people in both world wars which mean we can enjoy our freedom, but all fallen service personnel.

Given the highly political wars of the last few decades, including those who have fallen since 1945 will include some conflicts which fall into the political bracket.

I think it's on this point FIFA have issue, not those who gave their lives in both world wars.

[Auric Goldfinger]

F**k FIFA, wear the poppy with pride

[swedishskoda]

It doesn't just represent the brave sacrifice made by people in both world wars which mean we can enjoy our freedom, but all fallen service personnel.

Given the highly political wars of the last few decades, including those who have fallen since 1945 will include some conflicts which fall into the political bracket.

I think it's on this point FIFA have issue, not those who gave their lives in both world wars.

 

Yup, rules against messages with a possible political content are understandable.

 

It's a tricky business, this. For me it makes reason to, on the one hand, question servicemen's participation in certain actions (Kenya? Northern Ireland? Iraq?) while at the same time respect the individuals fallen during these actions - and the burdens carried by their surviving families. And the Legion's undoubtedly doing a lot of good things supporting veterans. Therefore, wearing the poppy is understandable (although the white one is an interesting alternative). As long as the poppy is about paying respect to sacrifices made, no problems. If it also signifies acceptance or support for the political decisions behind the sacrifices it's another matter.

 

What really makes me sick is when politicians and other public figures follow advice from spin doctors and PR agents, wearing the poppy at the most incongruous situations. E.g. Ed Miliband and Justine Thornton at the maternity ward with theiir newborn son a few years ago (bet Ed was criticised for not fastening a poppy on his son, too). Or David Cameron sporting a poppy visiting China, apparently ignorant of the fact that the poppy has other connotations there...

Edited 4 November, 2016 by swedishskoda

[moley]

The Republic of Ireland wore a logo commemorating the Easter uprising of 1916 in a match this year and I don't think FIFA took any action.

In the case of the poppy both countries want to wear it, so I can't see what the problem is. The problem is that the teams are playing in a match to try to qualify to play in the finals held in Russia. Russia, a country that oozes political correctness and tolerance.

[swedishskoda]

The Republic of Ireland wore a logo commemorating the Easter uprising of 1916 in a match this year and I don't think FIFA took any action.

In the case of the poppy both countries want to wear it, so I can't see what the problem is. The problem is that the teams are playing in a match to try to qualify to play in the finals held in Russia. Russia, a country that oozes political correctness and tolerance.

 

While Putin's Russia can rightly be blamed for a lot of things, I don't think they're behind this one. Not sure about details of FIFA regulations, but maybe friendlies (if that was what Ireland's game was) are wieved differently from tournaments (including qualifications)?

Or maybe the Irish FA was fined and paid without fuzz?

[Clunkclick]

Evonik, Krupps, Thyssens, Bosch, Siemens, AEG. . . . . . 

 

The beautiful game . . . 

 

 

N.

Edited 4 November, 2016 by Clunkclick

[Ootohere]

1916 was so last century.

 

So the teams are doing what they want and wearing poppy's, so nothing to see, job done.

[moley]

FIFA are now taking action against Ireland for the Easter uprising logo.

[swedishskoda]

While the Tudor rose clearly has its place in the English FA logo I'm not sure if it has to be 10 of them. Replace (temporarily?) one of them with a poppy - problem sorted.

[Aspman]

Why not get one painted on the centre spot. It's shown and the players aren't wearing it.

 

But Fifa are in the wrong, it's not political. it's patriotic if you want to put a name on it but it's not even that.

[FUBAR]

The responsibility for vetting of what is and isn't acceptable on this topic should remain with the appropriate FA's of the home nations. The FA's have made it clear that they will defy FIFA on this ruling. I understand the need for a level of control over the listed 'religious, political and commercial' symbols and emblems, but this one has never been intended as one. If people choose to consider it to be it doesn't make it so and quite abruptly, that is their problem/ignorance. National flags can cause offence all over the UK apparently these days, let alone the world, perhaps they should be banned also?

 

Fatma's statement on the matter speaking as FIFA "Britain is not the only country that has been suffering from the result of war" is in itself quite ignorant and completely undiplomatic and certainly not befitting of his office. I am sure offensive to many and only sounds like he has a personal axe to grind. By his statement doesn't even understand that the symbol is not only one for 'Britain' within the RBL. All he had to say is that in their view after considering blah blah blah, not throw out a comment like that intensifying the whole thing.

 

And only NOW after it was pointed out in response to this that they had no problem with FAI and the Easter Rising commemoration 8 months ago (against Switzerland of all teams!!!) which they didn't at the time, they turn on them too in a bid to try make a point. Utterly pathetic! Best let the Americans know the 4th of July is banned now too in football terms, good luck with that one Fatma!   :peek:

[mac11irl]

The Republic of Ireland wore a logo commemorating the Easter uprising of 1916 in a match this year and I don't think FIFA took any action.

In the case of the poppy both countries want to wear it, so I can't see what the problem is. The problem is that the teams are playing in a match to try to qualify to play in the finals held in Russia. Russia, a country that oozes political correctness and tolerance.

Think youll find FAI has been taken to task over that...

[gadgetman]

Best let the Americans know the 4th of July is banned now too in football terms, good luck with that one Fatma! :peek:

It's a holiday to celebrate a pivotal point in their history. It's very different from the poppy issue.

There seems to be a clear issue with the public as to what a poppy should/does symbolise.

Is it solely about the brave sacrifice given by so many for all our freedoms in both world wars

Or

Is it for all service personnel lost regardless.

The former I doubt even fifa would have issues, but because of the latter (which is actually what it is for) I can see why fifa has an issue.

Given that we sent men & women to die in contentious and politically motivated 'wars' in Iraq, Afghanistan etc etc it crosses a boundary which fifa don't want to allow to avoid a free for all from other countries on similar issues.

Perhaps it's proving that there needs to be another symbol to remember all fallen UK military personnel, and leave the poppy solely for remembering those in Ww1 & ww2???

[FUBAR]

It's a holiday to celebrate a pivotal point in their history. It's very different from the poppy issue.

 

I didn't compare it to the remembrance poppy, but to a comparable pivotal point in history for another nations similar fight for independence from Britain, in a separate paragraph referring to only that.

 

There seems to be a clear issue with the public as to what a poppy should/does symbolise.

Is it solely about the brave sacrifice given by so many for all our freedoms in both world wars

Or

Is it for all service personnel lost regardless.

The former I doubt even fifa would have issues, but because of the latter (which is actually what it is for) I can see why fifa has an issue.

Given that we sent men & women to die in contentious and politically motivated 'wars' in Iraq, Afghanistan etc etc it crosses a boundary which fifa don't want to allow to avoid a free for all from other countries on similar issues.

Perhaps it's proving that there needs to be another symbol to remember all fallen UK military personnel, and leave the poppy solely for remembering those in Ww1 & ww2???

As I mentioned above, the symbolisation is determined and set by in our case the RBL and what people then decide to think it means otherwise does not change what it is for. With regards to war, all are politically motivated and the RBL does not have any support for any government, political party or even war itself, quite the opposite which they stress continually more and more these days where people try to tell them they mean or stand for something else. Their only concern and focus is for the welfare and support for those who have served their country with no political control over what they are required to do and it does not support those who send them, rather it tends to condemn them. The symbol of the remembrance poppy itself is in condemnation of the futility of war and the funds raised ultimately support those who the government utterly fails to do so.

 

For separating the conflicts / wars for which the remembrance poppy should be for changes the very reasoning behind it as it is not for those periods of conflict, but only or the support of those who were sent by whichever good/bad government of the day.

 

Ultimately though again as mentioned the RBL adopted a symbol and have always made it clear what their intentions are and what it stands for, it's unfair and incorrect for people to tell them it stands for something it doesn't. It never has nor never will condone or celebrate any act of conflict our government of the day chooses to subject it's armed forces to, only attempt to help in the devastation it causes for them and their families no matter where in the world they come from to serve. Using it as a forum for political debate on the justification of individual wars has nothing to do with the specific symbol or the organisation behind it.

[Clunkclick]

1916 was so last century.

 

So the teams are doing what they want and wearing poppy's, so nothing to see, job done.

No. Think 1939 -1945.  "So last year" - I wouldn't repeat that up Golders Green High street, particularly in relation to the first company in the list.

 

N

[Ootohere]

Think what ever date you want of wars and killing and maiming. Wear a Poppy near Remembrance Day and put your hand in your pocket and help the charities.

But maybe remember those often, and give generously but dont make some big deal of it that makes the wearing of a Poppy important and an issue that upsets other.

 

The Poppy is like Flags. There to glory in as much as a symbol, a cause of arqument.  

Wars are fought over Flags, then people remember the dead and injured with more symbols.

[swedishskoda]

Symbols change their meaning over time and are interpreted differently by different groups - and, sadly, often in a way that has nothing to do with the original intentions. Having said that, I suggest that we all in proper spirit can appreciate that the Briskoda forum sports the poppy today