Hi Folks

 

Car a 2006 1.9 TDi. After a very recent nightmare cross threading a front caliper bolt into the bearing carrier/hub (which I now see in fairness to me can happen pretty easily..)a back brake started grinding and needs attention. Totally worn pad at one side.  Not entirely sure why worn so much at one side when other side looks ok but pretty sure both sides feel as though braking is even, handbrake feels even too, so I imagine new pads or pads/discs will fix things ok. 

 

Can I ask the following

 

-How well/easily do the rear caliper pistons push back in? I've not got any of the press type tools for it. Might I get away with not disturbing the bleed nipple? I think I'm right in saying just take off the fluid resevoir cap

-The disc isn't actually worn looking as such but has a bit of a rusty outer edge. I know they're not expensive so should I be just changing them too or a waste of money? 

 

Any input appreciated, thanks

You need a wind back tool for the rear caliper, no question.

The rear calipers go back fairly easy as long as you've got the correct tools, they don't push back they wind back so make sure you get the correct tool. I picked a sealey one up from Euro car parts for about £15, spray a little duck oil or if you're a scrooge some fairy liquid around the rubber seal so it doesn't rip. Remove the cap and wind back, simples.

Make sure you check the inner side of the discs too.

if memory serves me well you'll need a 13 & 15mm spanner.

Edited 14 October, 20187 yr by LGM

Cheers v much

 

Glad I posted. Might've had the massive water pump pliers out for a push in

 

I'll decide tomorrow morning whether to fir them myself or not. 

Edited 14 October, 20187 yr by silver50

Sounds like one of these needed, is that right?

 

https://www.screwfix.com/p/hilka-pro-craft-brake-caliper-rewind-tool/4119R?tc=CT8&ds_kid=92700023753052809&ds_rl=1249481&ds_rl=1245250&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIu8iagLiG3gIVDpPtCh2oZAngEAQYAiABEgITlPD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

12 hours ago, silver50 said:

Sounds like one of these needed, is that right?

 

https://www.screwfix.com/p/hilka-pro-craft-brake-caliper-rewind-tool/4119R?tc=CT8&ds_kid=92700023753052809&ds_rl=1249481&ds_rl=1245250&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIu8iagLiG3gIVDpPtCh2oZAngEAQYAiABEgITlPD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

That's the one!

20 hours ago, silver50 said:

Not entirely sure why worn so much at one side when other side looks ok but pretty sure both sides feel as though braking is even, handbrake feels even too, so I imagine new pads or pads/discs will fix things ok

This sounds like the caliper is seized on its slides. You do need to fix that or you'll get rapid wear on the new pads too.

 

There's no definite need to replace the discs though; the pad swept area doesn't extend to the edge of the disc, so the lip outside does rust, and rust is thicker than cast iron, which is what causes your visible lip.

2 hours ago, KenONeill said:

This sounds like the caliper is seized on its slides. You do need to fix that or you'll get rapid wear on the new pads too.

 

What should I be doing to fix that? Thanks

 

They're not separate bolt type pins are they? Part of the caliper carrier.. Should they clean up?

Edited 15 October, 20187 yr by silver50

I have found on the Skoda rear discs,it’s usually the old pad rusted up where it slides on the caliper and wears oddly plus usually overheats and you can smell it when you stop.

        Maccy.

Thanks. I think I know what you mean. I’ll be taking my time and will try to clean everything up well.

Update on this. Not great success. For one thing the above rewind tool didn't really work. Turns out both pads were equally knackered so the piston was obviously well extended. There was no space for the rewind tool's collar to slip on inside the caliper. I did however still manage to get a reasonable bit of purchase by using it's 3/8" fitting with a 3/8" ratchet and extension. Cap off brake fluid resevoir it still didn't seem to want to turn/budge.

 

Problem 2. I wasn't sure old disc would slip out without removing the caliper carrier/bracket, but it did. However the new disc wouldn't quite slip in. Disc thickness a little different. New disc thicker.I'm sure it would've gone in fine if I'd been able to loosen off the caliper carrier/bracket, but I wasn't able to. Ultimately didn't want to risk rounding the fairly rusty hex bolts.

 

So, unable to fit new pads because of caliper piston and unable to fit the new disc without loosening the caliper bracket. There's been better days for DIY car maintenence!

 

Think it'll need taken to a garage. Also think chance I'll need a new caliper. The brake is working though so the caliper can't be totally seized

 

 

 

 

Edited 16 October, 20187 yr by silver50

3 hours ago, silver50 said:

Update on this. Not great success. For one thing the above rewind tool didn't really work. Turns out both pads were equally knackered so the piston was obviously well extended. There was no space for the rewind tool's collar to slip on inside the caliper. I did however still manage to get a reasonable bit of purchase by using it's 3/8" fitting with a 3/8" ratchet and extension. Cap off brake fluid resevoir it still didn't seem to want to turn/budge.

 

Problem 2. I wasn't sure old disc would slip out without removing the caliper carrier/bracket, but it did. However the new disc wouldn't quite slip in. Disc thickness a little different. New disc thicker.I'm sure it would've gone in fine if I'd been able to loosen off the caliper carrier/bracket, but I wasn't able to. Ultimately didn't want to risk rounding the fairly rusty hex bolts.

 

So, unable to fit new pads because of caliper piston and unable to fit the new disc without loosening the caliper bracket. There's been better days for DIY car maintenence!

 

Think it'll need taken to a garage. Also think chance I'll need a new caliper. The brake is working though so the caliper can't be totally seized

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm surprised no one has mentioned the common problem of the piston seal going hard due to age/heat & thus the piston is stuck out..& can't be pushed back in..the seal is what pulls the piston back in to clear the pads...

 

 

as far as windback tools go I've never had any problems with the Laser one I bought 10yrs ago.....most of the specialist stuff I have is Laser..best OEM tools there is..IMHO...

 

BTW I stripped the whole of my Fabia calipers down (front & rear) & fitted new seals/dust skirts eyc...no problems...bit of work yes.....as I had a piston stick on me & it had greased/sliders etc....so it was infact the piston seal..

 

Also on all sliding fist type calipers...the inside/piston pad will always wear down more if the pads/caliper/piston is sticking.....

 

 

Just had the pads on my current car stick as they don't grease the pad to caliper contact points...so it rusted together...result = fubar pads & discs...with outside face not too bad..but inside face & pad total wreck...

Edited 16 October, 20187 yr by fabdavrav

My piston retractor is S-P as that was what was easy to buy when I bought mine many years ago, but I'd guess its dimensions are as near as damn it the same as the Laser equivalent or even the one you bought from Screwfix, and I would have thought that they would be sized to even fit when the pads were worn down to the backing material.

 

Once on at old Passat I needed to ease the handbrake on one click before I could rotate the piston on one side - a couple of years later that calliper had started to seize just at MOT time, so I bought a new calliper.

 

I also like Laser Tools, but they just keep bringing out new solutions and I seem to need to buy them, makes life easier though when messing with cars! Only Laser Tool I have been disappointed with is the ignition coil puller for later TSI engines, as they seem to have designed their own and stuffed a picture in their catalogue, then buggered off and bought in a shed load of the cheaper competitions ones - and I ended up buying one of them, not impressed and asked my tool supplier to pass my comments to Laser Tools.

Thanks for replies.

 

I am surprised the tool didn't work. There just wasn't the space inside the caliper (between the piston and the opposite end of the caliper) for the collar to locate into the groove on the tool. 

 

If the piston was stuck out due to the seal going hard would the brake still actually work ok? As in back together it is still braking and the handbrake holding fine. Albeit pretty much metal to metal!

 

I'm going to take the car to a garage and am hoping they might be able to get the piston to screw back. 

Edited 16 October, 20187 yr by silver50

AVW ?

The pistons are sometimes very stiff to start turning, its important to get the tool in square and engaged properly and sometimes some extra leverage on the twist bar if you haven't got gorilla hands. It will also be the internal self adjuster screw thats corroded and making it difficult to turn. Once its started its usually ok, though I usually pump out the piston (not too far) and screw it back a couple of times to free it up nicely. Make sure you bleed the old oil fluid out of the caliper as that probably be full of rust and crud.

Edited 17 October, 20187 yr by xman

@silver50 - P2 - Discs are wearing parts, so I'd expect a new one to be thicker than the swept area on an old one.

12 hours ago, rum4mo said:

 

I also like Laser Tools, but they just keep bringing out new solutions and I seem to need to buy them, makes life easier though when messing with cars! Only Laser Tool I have been disappointed with is the ignition coil puller for later TSI engines, as they seem to have designed their own and stuffed a picture in their catalogue, then buggered off and bought in a shed load of the cheaper competitions ones - and I ended up buying one of them, not impressed and asked my tool supplier to pass my comments to Laser Tools.

 

Glad I'm not the only one who has had this happen....trouble is I had to special order mine as no one where I am stocks it off the shelf....thankfully I got it on a sale price..so was worth what I spent...

I seem to end up buying from Tool Academy via ebay, what annoyed me about that coil puller was, I deliberately choice the more expensive Laser Tools versions as the part that you grip in the palm of your hand was better shaped.  When my one arrived, the staple(s) were out of the packaging - so okay maybe it had been used by the price was good, then I noticed that it looked very roughly made so I incorrectly assumed that some bandit, ie customer, had bought a cheapie, bought a Laser Tools version then swopped them over and returned the cheapie in the Laser Tools packaging for a refund!  Emailed Tool Academy and the owner replied immediately apologising and sent me out another one, it arrived quickly and while the packaging was intact, I could see that the tool inside looked roughly/crudely made like the cheapies on sale! So I contacted Tool Academy again saying that I'd keep the first one and return the second one and requested that they chatted to Laser Tools about this issue!

13 hours ago, rum4mo said:

AVW ?

 

Silver50, I was hinting that you could get AVW Garage to sort out your car, I don't know if you know this, but they are Audi VW etc specialists and seem to be very well equipped to carry out any work on these cars - Liberton Brae or Gilmerton Road, opposite an Aldi supermarket.  I went there to get "component protection" removed from a used DAB radio I bought for my Audi S4 - prior to this I knew nothing about them and the VW Group Indie garage at Bilston Business Park did not return my email when I asked them if they could remove "component protection" - which I took as "we can't and can't be bothered to tell you that!", also that garage in Bilston Business Park seem to favour working on RS Audis and might even be REV agents, so maybe not bothered about doing simple jobs and their hourly rate is quite high!

On 14/10/2018 at 18:26, silver50 said:

Sounds like one of these needed, is that right?

 

https://www.screwfix.com/p/hilka-pro-craft-brake-caliper-rewind-tool/4119R?tc=CT8&ds_kid=92700023753052809&ds_rl=1249481&ds_rl=1245250&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIu8iagLiG3gIVDpPtCh2oZAngEAQYAiABEgITlPD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

 

I have one of those. I find it quite tricky and I need to use spanners on it. One to control the tool body and a socket on the end to turn the piston. Usually what happens is the plate then falls out. Must figure out a trick using zip ties or similar or contract with the occult for a third hand.  The tool does work though. 

 

Last winter my NSR caliper seized and one of the pads broke down. Despite taking it to a good local garage, I needed a new caliper.

 

J.

I could fit a 3/8 ratchet or extension into the tool's circular part that (turns the piston) but not sure how you could use spanners on the tool body or to turn the piston in? I wish I'd taken a picture. but in my case, or in the case of the tool I used (it turned out my next door neighbour had one pretty much the same as the screwfix one) there was just no room for the collar the tool needs to slip in to the correct position on the tool. If the caliper piston had been 3-4mm back from what it was I would've been ok.

 

I am getting a new caliper too by the looks of it. I did end up getting decent purchase on the piston even without the tool working as it should. I did wonder if it was pretty well seized.

The only issue that I can see with that Hilka Pro piston rewind tool , and a few other newish ones is, that they have dowels sticking out from both sides, now that will be very handy as it means that this tool will fit more types of pistons than my old one with dowels sticking out of one side only, but, as you have discovered, it can make that tool too wide/deep to fit into a calliper that has had pads worn down to the metal. That is what I am guessing is why you are having an issue with fitting it into the calliper.

 

Edit:- by the way, some brands of that tool have a hex shape on the top end of the female threaded section that turns the piston, so that is what the previous poster would be referring to.

Edited 18 October, 20187 yr by rum4mo

On 18/10/2018 at 08:08, silver50 said:

I could fit a 3/8 ratchet or extension into the tool's circular part that (turns the piston) but not sure how you could use spanners on the tool body or to turn the piston in? I wish I'd taken a picture. but in my case, or in the case of the tool I used (it turned out my next door neighbour had one pretty much the same as the screwfix one) there was just no room for the collar the tool needs to slip in to the correct position on the tool. If the caliper piston had been 3-4mm back from what it was I would've been ok.

 

I am getting a new caliper too by the looks of it. I did end up getting decent purchase on the piston even without the tool working as it should. I did wonder if it was pretty well seized.

 

Large spanner on the tool body to hold it steady, socket on the end of the handle to apply pressure. if it goes loose then the plate falls out.

 

On 18/10/2018 at 10:19, rum4mo said:

The only issue that I can see with that Hilka Pro piston rewind tool , and a few other newish ones is, that they have dowels sticking out from both sides, now that will be very handy as it means that this tool will fit more types of pistons than my old one with dowels sticking out of one side only, but, as you have discovered, it can make that tool too wide/deep to fit into a calliper that has had pads worn down to the metal. That is what I am guessing is why you are having an issue with fitting it into the calliper.

 

Edit:- by the way, some brands of that tool have a hex shape on the top end of the female threaded section that turns the piston, so that is what the previous poster would be referring to.

 

Good spot. For the price of the tool, maybe grind or hacksaw the extra ones off?

This kit a better buy than the laser kit, it will cover all your rewind needs.

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/BRAKE-CALIPER-PISTON-REWIND-WIND-BACK-TOOL-KIT-FOR-VW-AUDI-FORD-BMW-21-PIECE-SET/332674540431?_trkparms=aid%3D555017%26algo%3DPL.CASSINI%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D54807%26meid%3Ddef345349b934573a9fcc2321d24ccaa%26pid%3D100505%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D1%26%26itm%3D332674540431&_trksid=p2045573.c100505.m3226