Hi all,

 

I'm just in the process of purchasing a second Fabia estate to replace a written off Focus (not my fault!). It's a 1.2 TSI 90PS version which was probably the last of the 1.2s as the car was registered in June 2017 (?) I had looked at some 1.0 MPI models (75PS) but i had the feeling that, while mechanically simpler, with two adults, two children/car seats and other children-related stuff that it would be too slow. Anyway, I have put a deposit down now so it's probably too late for reflection.

 

Just wondered what I should know about this model compared to the 2014 Mk 2 1.2TSI 8V we also have. What I already think i know:

 

Mk2 1.2 TSI is 8V with chain driven cam.

MK3 1.2 TSI is 16V with belt driven cam (what is the replacement interval on this belt)? 

The car has been on a variable service (about 19,000 on it and it was done a few months ago) and I'm thinking of taking the service plan (2 services fo 159 quid). Car will have 12 months warranty on it and be MOT'd as well as serviced before collection.

 

Anything that I need to ensure has been done from a recall point of view and what is the view on fixed vs variable servicing especially with a turbo engine involved?

 

I was surprised to see that the 1.2 engine had changed from 8 to 16V prior to the 1.0 TSI engine being released - I thought they had gone from the 1.2 8V straight to the 1.0 3 pot. I imagine the 4 pot is probably a better option than the 3 (?) but are there any known issues with this engine?

 

Any help is appreciated.

 

Thanks

Bought one in June 2016 and the engine for me has exceeded expectations.

Went from a 1.4 Turbo Diesel to the smaller 1.2 TSI 90PS engine.

 

This engine is more responsive, faster, quieter and almost as good on fuel economy.

With petrol now cheaper than diesel as well.

 

I had my servicing changed from new, to fixed servicing, every 9400 miles or 12 months.

It has had 4 services and is now up to 40K miles and has not missed a beat.

If you intend to keep the car then for me fixed servicing is a must.

 

Spark plugs at 40K and air filter at 60K but you need to remove the air filter housing to replace the spark plugs so I did both at the 4th service at 37.5K miles.

 

 

4 hours ago, briscaF1 said:

MK3 1.2 TSI is 16V with belt driven cam (what is the replacement interval on this belt)? 

 

Anything from 60K miles / 5 years, to check at 120K miles / 10 years, to lifetime of engine?

 

Thanks AG Falco

On the cam belt, suprisingly it seems Skoda don't have an official guide on when it seems to need replacing unless you're in a dusty country. Even then, its 120,000 KM with no time period specified (this is based on erwin for from MY 2017, same for MY 2016 and before). If you call and ask a bunch of dealers, you'll probably get different numbers thrown at you 🤷‍♂️ So depends on how comfortable you are before you replace.

 

If I'm misreading the information, someone let me know... but seen a few discussions on here with the same outcome.

@briskaF1

If the car had it's first service @ 2 years / 19,000 miles a few months ago not much of a service is getting done before collection is it.

 

The Pollen Filter should have been changed, long life oil used and a new oil filter.

 

Maybe this time the Air Filter might get looked at and maybe changed, but what else will they do?

 

As to the 2 Services for £159.

Ask about that.

 

A service in another 2 years or 19,000 miles and again 2 years later / 19,000 miles for £159 is not what they are offering, or maybe what you want if keeping the car.

Depends obviously what miles you do..

 

Next year is the Brake Fluid due  change, is that included or will that be £60 extra..

The year after that would be another Major Service, so new plugs and airfilter.

Are you getting that 2 services for £159?

Edited 24 November, 20196 yr by Roottootemoot

2 hours ago, Roottootemoot said:

@briskaF1

If the car had it's first service @ 2 years / 19,000 miles a few months ago not much of a service is getting done before collection is it.

 

The Pollen Filter should have been changed, long life oil used and a new oil filter.

 

Maybe this time the Air Filter might get looked at and maybe changed, but what else will they do?

 

As to the 2 Services for £159.

Ask about that.

 

A service in another 2 years or 19,000 miles and again 2 years later / 19,000 miles for £159 is not what they are offering, or maybe what you want if keeping the car.

Depends obviously what miles you do..

 

Next year is the Brake Fluid due  change, is that included or will that be £60 extra..

The year after that would be another Major Service, so new plugs and airfilter.

Are you getting that 2 services for £159?

 

 

Thanks for all the replies so far. 

 

Interesting that there is no belt replacement schedule....

 

This is what I understand.

For fixed servicing, it involves a £169 service but, every two years, there is a "major" fixed service of £229.

For variable, it is £229 per service.

So, I believe that the £159 covers two years of servicing for fixed schedule (saving (169+229) - 159 = £239 saving OR four years of variable servicing and a saving of ((229 x 2) - 159 = £299 saving.

 

Since I wish to keep the car and run it, I think I'd go for the fixed service plan because I really don't like the idea of leaving oil in for 2 years.

 

Does this sound correct ? 

 

I'm not sure if the brake fluid is included or not.

 

 

 

 

That is crazy fixed price servicing at 'Participating Dealers' and was for cars 3-10 year old on fixed servicing intervals.

 

They might want to say that the next service is an Interim Service or a Minor Service when it is a Oil Service with Health Check really.

 

If they really are away to service it now months after being serviced what will the invoice show and are they re-setting the Service indicator to 9,400 miles / 372 days.

 

It is all Kidology.

The car might get a Full Workshop Inspection.

Check the tyre pressures and see what they hand the car over with the tyres set at...

?

What will your Annual Mileage be, and what checks do you do yourself should be what makes the difference to what servicing you have done.

Edited 24 November, 20196 yr by Roottootemoot

Hi,

 

I believe the "oil and filter" service is quoted at a different, lower price (£119).

 

I'm well aware of the kind of things these "services" involve to the point where my wife's car was serviced at the dealer for 3 years but the rear drums had never been off. However, I believe there is some value in getting a dealer stamp in case of an "outside of warranty" claim.

 

I know I can service the car myself at a cost of about £75 including 507 spec oil/filter/plugs and that's what I'd normally do. The car will be doing about 8-9000 miles a year with most of it being on B roads (about 22-40 miles per day in the week); it's unlikely to go onto the motorway much.

 

The £119 oil service was deleted.

But if they are just doing that and not changing the pollen filter or anything else and pretending they do more then it is just pretence.

 

There is no 'Stamp' just something added to the system like should be added to the system for your service pre delivery, that can never be trusted as anything having been done,

but if you get a Print Out with Part Numbers of parts used and ticked off items checked and it is faked then at least that is clearly fraud. There should be a someone that signs it off.

Edited 24 November, 20196 yr by Roottootemoot

Lack of firm guidance over the cambelt is not good, though I seem to remember on reading my Erwin sourced workshop manual for a Polo with that engine, that cambelt is NOT a service item! As said by others, only check along its entire length every so often after 5 years - so how lucky can we get to discover the exact start point of cambelt coming apart due to age, and get it changed in a timely manner, I've not worked that one out yet!

Edited 25 November, 20196 yr by rum4mo

As it happens because I only do about 4k miles per annum I decided to query the 5 year cam belt change and wrote directly to VW technical last year. After a few days a very nice man rang me up and we held a detailed discussion: "Well it's a recommendation and is not mandatory" he said (the 5 yr bit). Then he said that "it's a bit VW belt and braces because they know that some people absolutely insult their cars" (driving on sandy beaches and through deep puddles, etc.) so they (VW) like to play it safe. So am doing 4k miles a yr and never "insult my car" because I am not ignorant or stupid. Also, I know that other manufacturers commonly "recommend" 60-80k miles with no time limits. I retorted. "I can't put this in writing but in your case I would have an intelligent mechanic have a look at it at seven years and give his honest opinion then do the same every couple of years." he said "and cam belts are being improved all the time".  I am also now doing an oil change every two years - another techie told me that modern synthetic oils actually considerably exceed their written specs and a lot of techies know it. We just now need someone to come up with a brake fluid which does not need changing every two or three years. Oh and BTW I have loved my 1.2 90 from the word go and hope it will last me like for ever; now that it has pretty well run in, it seems to be going better than ever - particularly when pulling up hills.

Edited 25 November, 20196 yr by Eccles

Hum, I will not go as far as that, but, my brother in law is a CA and he is looking forward to when electric cars have really long ranges, because they never ever need any maintenance - if only!

 

I seem to remember that there was a "sealed for life" petrol engine used in America so no lub servicing required - I'd think that once brakes and tyres had worn out and caused crashes that plan was probably shelved.

 

I can see that that VW Group rep was needing to be quite creative to justify the way that VW Group is treating these newer cambelts which I agree are much tougher/durable than the same items from the past - hopefully the rest of the timing system has also been toughened up, I'll still stick with my original plan to get it changed at around the 7-8 year point which will be roughly 50K miles.

Edited 25 November, 20196 yr by rum4mo

Amazing that they expect someone to "inspect" the cam belt every 5 years and make some kind of judgement on whether it is OK or not. I mean, what criteria do you apply to the inspection? That it isn't stretched (you have to take it off to check and you may as well change it if you've done this?) or that it isn't cracked or de-laminating or whatever a cam belt reveals less than 2 years before it gives up. Also, I previously had a 1.6 zetec Ford Focus which has a 100,000 / 10 year cam belt life but I changed this at 50,000 / 7 years old; I was told that bearing/tensioner often fail before the belt does these days so does this not apply for these TSI engines?

 

With respect to oil, I have no doubt that oils are better than they ever have been but, even using modern synthetics, they always look somewhat grubby after spending 12 months in an engine when I've changed them. With the other car (the 1.2 8V TSI), the oil has been getting changed every 10 months even with VW507 spec because of short journey use and because we plan to keep the car until it falls apart and I wish to protect the turbo as much as possible (even to the point of idling the engine for 30s to 60s before turning it off after longer journeys). 

 

So, to summarise:

Oil and filter changes: Every 10k with VW 504 or VW507 spec oil.

Spark plugs: Every 40k miles (I guess these are the same iridium jobs that the 8V uses? Bosch or NGK are both OK?)

Air filter: Every 60k miles (this long? Used to be every 12 months in the old days!)

Cam belt: Possibly 5 years or 60k miles or longer depending upon attitude to risk and millionaire status.

 

Other items:

I've read elsewhere of TSI engine problems/valve failures caused by carbon deposits so it makes sense to use some higher octane premium fuel occasionally with an associated 'Italian tune up'/thrashing to follow. Is this an urban myth/anyone bothering to do this? I say this because our 8V generally drinks supermarket/Esso fuel and rarely gets revved past 2,500 as there doesn't seem much point with the amount of torque available at the low end.

 

Always looking for ways to ensure longevity / minimise running costs!

Well okay, in reality, I might bottle it at 6 years for a cambelt change, time will tell.

These later TSI engines don't use very expensive plugs, though NGK do tend still to be the maker of choice at factory and for me at replacement time. 

Plug changes came down from 6 years to 4 years along with the air filter.

Controlling or minimising the carbon build up behind the valves, I don't think that fuel quality influences that at all, someone once said that certain usage can make things worse though - maybe just 100% short journeys, I think that the general thinking is, the turbo should be negating some or the impression of power losses due to carbon build up - ie the worst cases of choking appear only on high performance NA TSI engines - like some of the Audi RS ones.

 

20 hours ago, briscaF1 said:

I've read elsewhere of TSI engine problems/valve failures caused by carbon deposits

 

This version of TSI engine is Direct Fuel Injection so no fuel goes down past the inlet port / valve.

So no fuel cleaning happens this way. 

But when the engine / oil is hot my car will occasionally get used very firmly.

 

Above 60 MPG on way home from work today, 12 mile trip.

 

More history on mine here:-

 

Thanks AG Falco

If not the 16V, is it the 8V that suffers from the valve problem or a different TSI?

 

 

Indirect injection engines where the petrol is injected in the the inlet pipe can have less carbon deposits.

This is because the flow of petrol hitting the inlet valves helps to clean it off.

 

Engines which are direct injection can have more build up of carbon on the inlet valves.

This is because there is no petrol hitting the inlet valves as the petrol is injected direct into the cylinder.

 

The Fabia Mk III TSI engines are EA211 with direct injection.

 

Some info here:-

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Volkswagen_Group_petrol_engines#EA111

 

Thanks AG Falco