Lane assist is dangerous

[KenONeill]

5 hours ago, Exkiwi said:

We do have long straight roads though, like this one and some very big truck rigs like this

Thanks for the videos; well worth 10 minutes of my time to watch them, but they didn't actually prove your argument that "lane enforce" is anything more than an unnecessary technology provided the driver is actually a driver and not just a wheel holder. They did prove my argument (way off topic) that road train drivers are very much more than just wheel holders; they actually drive those wagons. BTW I have taken and passed a driving assessment for a PSV licence, although I failed the medical on eyesight grounds.

[Exkiwi]

19 minutes ago, KenONeill said:

Thanks for the videos; well worth 10 minutes of my time to watch them, but they didn't actually prove your argument that "lane enforce" is anything more than an unnecessary technology provided the driver is actually a driver and not just a wheel holder. They did prove my argument (way off topic) that road train drivers are very much more than just wheel holders; they actually drive those wagons. BTW I have taken and passed a driving assessment for a PSV licence, although I failed the medical on eyesight grounds.

I wasnt trying to prove anything. I was merely posting the photos of my settings to prove that it CAN BE TURNED OFF with the touch of your finger and the settings changed to make it less intrusive.

 

It wasnt till I got a car with it I realised how much I did wander a bit in the lane and that with it set to "gently remind me Im sure Im staying straighter on the road".  Its like ACC I wouldnt be without it.

[KenONeill]

1 minute ago, Exkiwi said:

I realised how much I did wander a bit in the lane

OK worked example.

 

You're driving down a lane of road with wheel ruts worn in it on a wet day. The ruts are filled with water? Do you do what lane enforce wants and drive in said ruts, or drive outside them but still between the white lines, and fighting lane enforce's insistence that you're trying to depart from your lane?

[Exkiwi]

40 minutes ago, KenONeill said:

OK worked example.

 

You're driving down a lane of road with wheel ruts worn in it on a wet day. The ruts are filled with water? Do you do what lane enforce wants and drive in said ruts, or drive outside them but still between the white lines, and fighting lane enforce's insistence that you're trying to depart from your lane?

As I havent seen a road like that since I did a 50,000km round Australia vanning trip 11 years ago I wouldnt know.   I was driving a TD Landcruiser with a 3T 25ft caravan on the back in those days.

Also if you are driving down your road fast enough  to enable lane assist you are going too fast.. We have learnt in this country that if you cant see the road surface you slow down as it could be washed away after heavy rain. There is quite a difference between just driving and driving prudently.

 

Also to the poster that says it has to be reset each trip, that is total rubbish as you cna see from my pics if its ticked its working as that was set over 100km ago and never touched from then till now.

 

If Lane assist is set properly you mostly hardly notice it anyway. If its obtrusive, it set too aggressively

 

Any way the roads and conditions are totally different in each country.

I live 100km from the city and using ACC i can drive there without my feet on the pedals, including about 20km of extensive roadworks , limited to between 40and 80kph.  Have been driving all sorts of vehicles since 1956 from a Mini to a 15 m bus in heavy traffic. Also have a marine licence and have about 400 hours in Jetboats on shallow rivers.

Edited 28 August, 2021 by Exkiwi

[Exkiwi]

14 minutes ago, Exkiwi said:

. There is quite a difference between just driving and driving prudently.

  Also it says in the KAMIQ manual that LANE ASSIST STARTS to operate at 60kph  so why are you driving in ruts full of water at more than that

If Lane assist is set properly you mostly hardly notice it anyway. If its obtrusive, it set too aggressively

 

 

 

Edited 28 August, 2021 by Exkiwi

[Phutters]

4 minutes ago, Exkiwi said:

I live 100km from the city and using ACC i can drive there without my feet on the pedals, including about 20km of extensive roadworks 

.

I hope you don't mind me asking - and this isn't meant unkindly - but do you actually enjoy driving?

 

If you do, why would you want the car to do it for you instead of doing it yourself?

 

Do you think the car can do a better job of it than you can?

 

I must admit that if I ever got to the point where I felt the need to delegate decision-making to an inanimate object, I'd probably pack it in altogether.

 

It's only an opinion. It's nothing personal.

 

.

[Exkiwi]

15 minutes ago, Phutters said:

.

I hope you don't mind me asking - and this isn't meant unkindly - but do you actually enjoy driving?

 

If you do, why would you want the car to do it for you instead of doing it yourself?

 

Do you think the car can do a better job of it than you can?

 

I must admit that if I ever got to the point where I felt the need to delegate decision-making to an inanimate object, I'd probably pack it in altogether.

 

It's only an opinion. It's nothing personal.

 

.

I still drive it but in highway traffic its nice to just sit in the line on a single lane road and go with the flow and let what I paid for do the work.  As all these things are considered "Drivers Aids" one still should keep their mind on the job. Just in case.

 

Yes I enjoy driving but why wear your ankle out pushing on the loud pedal when car can do it as smooth if not smoother than the human.  I can intervene if and when I want to and technology is there to be used IF YOU WANT TO.

 

Perhaps youve never tried it if you say you havent got to the point of using it so how would you know if its good or bad.

 

Always a nay sayer without experience who wont embrace progress.   What do you drive   a 1961 Anglia manual.

 

I have owned 38 cars in my lifetime and driven a lot more different ones and these two are by far the most advanced and pleasurable to drive.

 

Perhaps if you have 600km between cities or in some places over 400km between service stations you would also come to appreciate making the job easier

 

What do I like about my two VAG cars.

1 the driving aids

2 The styling

3 engineering progress.

4 the economy

What dont I like.

Service costs.

Parts prices in AUS

Can import from Czech shops for 1/3 of our prices plus postage of course and still be at 60% of local price

 

Edited 28 August, 2021 by Exkiwi

[KenONeill]

40 minutes ago, Exkiwi said:

LANE ASSIST STARTS to operate at 60kph  so why are you driving in ruts full of water at more than that

Are you having a reading FAIL? I said that I have the choice of driving in ruts of water like lane enforce wants, or on dry tarmac to the side of the lane!

 

And I never once mentioned cruise control, whether simple constant throttle, constant road speed or full ACC.

[longedge]

1 hour ago, Exkiwi said:

Also to the poster that says it has to be reset each trip, that is total rubbish as you cna see from my pics if its ticked its working as that was set over 100km ago and never touched from then till now.

If that comment is a reply to my post then I can assure you that it is not rubbish. Deactivation of lane assist on my car takes effect only until such time as the engine is switched off. It is active again at the start of the next journey.

 

Obviously if it hasn't been switched off in the first place, it is going to remain active.

Edited 28 August, 2021 by longedge

[Phutters]

1 hour ago, Exkiwi said:

What do you drive   a 1961 Anglia manual.

 

 

.

Nope. I drive this. 

 

That's me behind the wheel.

 

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[KenONeill]

10 minutes ago, Phutters said:

.

Nope. I drive this. 

 

That's me behind the wheel.

 

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Mephistopheles!?  

[Exkiwi]

11 hours ago, Phutters said:

.

Nope. I drive this. 

 

That's me behind the wheel.

 

.

Yeah thats about right I would say but perhaps upgrade to one with bulbs in the headlights so your Dad can let you drive at night  LOL

[Exkiwi]

12 hours ago, longedge said:

If that comment is a reply to my post then I can assure you that it is not rubbish. Deactivation of lane assist on my car takes effect only until such time as the engine is switched off. It is active again at the start of the next journey.

 

Obviously if it hasn't been switched off in the first place, it is going to remain active.

What I took from your remark of   " Driver assistance' settings are per journey." is that it turns off each time and has to be renegaged.

 

If its set as mine is of course it will automatically restart. However as you dont seem to want to use it why  not just untick it and turn it off.

 

Writings do not always convey what one is thinking at the time

[Exkiwi]

12 hours ago, KenONeill said:

Are you having a reading FAIL? I said that I have the choice of driving in ruts of water like lane enforce wants, or on dry tarmac to the side of the lane!

 

And I never once mentioned cruise control, whether simple constant throttle, constant road speed or full ACC.

No you actually didnt   You said  "The ruts are filled with water? Do you do what lane enforce wants and drive in said ruts, or drive outside them but still between the white lines,"

 

Nothing about dry anything  I took perhaps incorrectly a poorly formed road on a wet day with ruts full of water or  smoother on the side. .

 

We get quite a lot of rain here in short sharp falls that cause localised flooding and nothing worse than idiots driving through it far too fast throwing bow waves and water off the road into peoples properties,  "Because it looks good and  like being dicks to show off"

 

Lane assist wont help here    LOL   and that is an actual road.

[Ootohere]

@KenONeill

It really would be simply clever if you tried cars with some of the latest features before decrying them. 

 

Manufacturers for cars in the EU / Europe have to fit it as standard to new type approved cars from next year, it does not have to be left on though.

Lots of other mandatory stuff coming in from next year that might want people to drive keepers that did not get these 'safety features'.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited 29 August, 2021 by e-Roottoot

[Exkiwi]

22 hours ago, KenONeill said:

BTW I have taken and passed a driving assessment for a PSV licence, although I failed the medical on eyesight grounds.

Whats a PSV     I  have had a police checked Passenger Service Endorsement   in two countries since 1971

 

You must be nearly  blind both figuratively and literally if glasses dont allow you to pass a driving test or see the benefits of technology

Edited 29 August, 2021 by Exkiwi

[Exkiwi]

42 minutes ago, e-Roottoot said:

@KenONeill

It really would be simply clever if you tried cars with some of the latest features before decrying them

 Hes not the only one as per here

 

"I must admit that if I ever got to the point where I felt the need to delegate decision-making to an inanimate object, I'd probably pack it in altogether."

 

I second what youve said.  That and the videos highlight what I see every day in both my cars and are a big help in traffic as the blind spot monitoring is good but stays on a bit long after you have passed someone. Handy though for dicks on scooters or bikes who sit where you cant see them.

Lane assist doesnt work  under 60kph so dont know what the fuss is about.

 

Next someone will moan that ABS braking wakes the baby or something equally stupid

 

Quotes from other posters

"Now It can't be perminantly turned off.  You can turn it off but resets when the ignition is turned off/on again." 

 

NO IT DOESN'T as witnessed by me when I got car back from service and tech had turned it off

 

If its unticked its OFF till its reticked

 

 

 

 

 

Edited 29 August, 2021 by Exkiwi

[Ootohere]

It is much easier to put off / inactivate in other manufacturers cars as in one press of a button.

VW Group are making a song and dance about the legislation saying it can not be done with just one action.

Maybe that is true when they actually are required by the EU to have it fitted.

 

Mk4 Fabia takes 2 actions.

 

 

Review by a Briskoda member.

 

 

[longedge]

8 hours ago, Exkiwi said:

 However as you dont seem to want to use it why  not just untick it and turn it off.

Simply put, because it is not possible. I switch it off, it switches itself back on at the start of the next journey.

 

The present implementation of lane assist in my car is at best irritating and potentially dangerous. It manages to detect lanes on roads where none exist i.e. where there are no road markings whatsoever.

 

I'm a great protagonist of safety devices that work, lane assist doesn't in the road conditions that I often encounter.

Edited 29 August, 2021 by longedge

[Ootohere]

@longedgeThe potential danger will now be on tens of thousands of VW Group cars in the UK and globally.

 

The Insurers / underwriters must know how many accidents the system has caused and there will be countries where lawyers will be taking legal actions against the manufacturers or the Government Agencies will be taking action against them.

 

I wonder how many here have had the potentially dangerous system cause them to crash / accident or have had them not being in an accident.

 

Saved me yesterday just before getting on the Kingston Bridge in Glasgow where there were 5 lanes and i was entering from the left to go to the 2 on the right.

I really missed the car coming up in the outside lane really quick in the outside lane in the 50 mph area.

it was not the lane assist though it was departure warning as i had indicated in plenty time.

I was watching all around as everyone coming on from the A77 / M77 were changing lanes and nobody was going as slow as 50 mph.

 

Never once had a bad Lane Assist System in any car i have driven other than in an ID.3, it was dire but i never tried any setting as just borrowed in for a short while.

Edited 29 August, 2021 by e-Roottoot

[longedge]

My early experience of lane assist whilst driving home after picking the car up from the dealership had a profound and lasting effect on me. It was my first experience in just over 55 years of driving of the car taking over control and making a totally incorrect decision. Since that first time, I've felt the steering wheel being tugged in my hands but nothing to match that first heart stopping moment.

 

If I still drove on a daily basis, I would have got rid of the car long ago.

[KenONeill]

On 29/08/2021 at 00:08, Exkiwi said:

Lane assist wont help here    LOL   and that is an actual road.

That's a river ford, not a rut.

Edited 1 September, 2021 by john999boy
Needless bits removed.

[Exkiwi]

1 hour ago, longedge said:

Simply put, because it is not possible. I switch it off, it switches itself back on at the start of the next journey.

 

The present implementation of lane assist in my car is at best irritating and potentially dangerous. It manages to detect lanes on roads where none exist i.e. where there are no road markings whatsoever.

 

I'm a great protagonist of safety devices that work, lane assist doesn't in the road conditions that I often encounter.

How do you switch it off because in both the VW and the Skoda if I untick it in the MMI settings it stays as its set or unset as the case maybe.

 

Also in your first experience what exactly did it do to scare you. Possibly it was set to "Early"and wheel to "Strong" as that will get your attention if you arent aware of it

 

I have  never EVER had it try to direct me off road into a ditch and find that hard to believe

[Exkiwi]

On 29/08/2021 at 10:05, KenONeill said:

That's a river ford, not a rut.

 

 

Geez I dont know  there is nothing wrong with what i said and yes its a ford ON A ROAD in the Kimberly in West Australia.

 

I was trying to make a light hearted comment but going by  the Scotsmen in my area its obvious as a nation you lack a sense of humour.

 

Edited 1 September, 2021 by john999boy
Bits removed due to editing of quoted post.

[olderman1]

Quote

How do you switch it off because in both the VW and the Skoda if I untick it in the MMI settings it stays as its set or unset as the case maybe.

Just to affirm what longedge says, in the UK if side assist is switched off at the start of a journey, next time the ignition is switched off, side assist will revert to being on. This also works the same with other functions as well, as it did in my previous Kodiaq.

I've had experience with a previous Kia, that there are different settings within the ECU for different functions that are programmed in the factory for the part of the world that the car is going to. These can be changed by a dealer who has the correct equipment. That scenario makes me wonder if the way driver assist settings can be controlled differently in Australia than they way we're allowed to control them here in the UK. Each country has it's own legislation that has to be adhered to by car manufacturers, so maybe that legislation isn't as strict in OZ as it is here. Just a thought that might explain the differences that are being experienced.