14 minutes ago, PetrolDave said:

Interesting on a global scale but of very little relevance to the UK, where the harsh reality is that generation and distribution of electricity simply will not be able to keep up with the demand IF the targets for switchover from ICE to EV are even close to being met.

Don't agree.

Technology will provide without massive Grid enhancement.

Australia, from being a fossil fuel luddite has become a renewable energy leading light. Yes they have s bit of advantage with more sunshine but their transition to renewables, home generation and storage, encourage by some grants to businesses and homes were seen as much cheaper than massive Grid upgrading.

Adoption of local solar and batteries to hundreds of thousands has taken pressure off the Grid. A lesson to other governments.

The technology improvements and lowering costs has made local electricity generation available to all. The National Grid rather than being stressed beyond breaking is actually being marginalised by the vast growth in local generation.

@lol-lol You should be in PR for some duff utilities companies. What a load of BS you seem to have sooked up. Next you will tell us about the Water Industries in England doing damn well.

Edited 14 February14 Feb by Evolution13

2 minutes ago, Evolution13 said:

@lol-lol You should be in PR for some duff utilities companies. What a load of BS you seem to have sooked up. Next you will tell us about the Water Industries in England doing damn well.

Oh God know. The Privization of the Water Industry has been an unmitigated disaster as it has been with rail franchises, 4th one just taken back in to public ownership.

Big fan of Octopus as a private company making a small profit compared to British gas and the oil companies taking Billions in profit whilst sending in bailiffs to people who cannot pay their exorbitant tariffs.

I watch the occasional YouTube on UK energy issues and from other countries but my core beliefs are from my experiences with various energy suppliers and my own use of technology ie EVs, batteries and solar panels.

Edited 14 February14 Feb by lol-lol

1 hour ago, lol-lol said:

Millions of people in Europe and in fact all over the world are using solar and batteries to get the electricity they need. These people are mainly poor people and those in places where politics and virtual sieges are meaning the people have to innovated to survive.

Whether its Palestine- Gaza, Cuba or many "Third" world countries they are using solar and batteries to survive, keep their phones running and devices that need electricity.

Like my installations these cost pounds and not thousands and make living with modern technology, but without hydrocarbon fuel for vehicles which is being withheld for political power ie Cuba and Gaza, or just prohibitively expensive where sunshine is free.

Google "Balcony solar" and see how solar and battery is helping poor actually every bit as much as those more well off.

All very interesting but totally irrelevant, you are either not reading and understanding the real issues that the UK has with electricity supply and also the population does not have equal positions in life that you do.

The point I'm trying to make is that with all the vehicles theoretically coming onto UK roads in by 2030, which includes all the vans, HGVs and buses that Ed Milliband is pushing for, there will not enough capacity to charge them all. There is no way on gods earth that you are going to able charge all of those from solar and storage batteries at the same time.

Yet, all you keep doing is stating how you do things and what you're thinking about doing. If that is how our politicians are thinking, then it's no wonder the UK is struggling to make any headway. We all need to stop thinking so much about ourselves and think about the problems that millions of other people are faced with. Others can also see it.

46 minutes ago, Graham Butcher said:

We all need to stop thinking so much about ourselves and think about the problems that millions of other people are faced with.

Totally agree, the limitations and needs of 100% of the population need to be taken into account not just those of 0.0000001% (excuse the rounding error!).

56 minutes ago, Graham Butcher said:

All very interesting but totally irrelevant, you are either not reading and understanding the real issues that the UK has with electricity supply and also the population does not have equal positions in life that you do.

The point I'm trying to make is that with all the vehicles theoretically coming onto UK roads in by 2030, which includes all the vans, HGVs and buses that Ed Milliband is pushing for, there will not enough capacity to charge them all. There is no way on gods earth that you are going to able charge all of those from solar and storage batteries at the same time.

Yet, all you keep doing is stating how you do things and what you're thinking about doing. If that is how our politicians are thinking, then it's no wonder the UK is struggling to make any headway. We all need to stop thinking so much about ourselves and think about the problems that millions of other people are faced with. Others can also see it.

You clearly do not understand what technology is out there and how it can be applied.

How companies, Gridserve, Tesla etc can provide EV charge capacity and make an absolute killing of profit is to install their Mega packs, 40 ft container sized battery packs, and plop them down by the EV charging banks.

Charge up the banks when lecky is cgeap and plentiful and the Grid is relatively quiet. Buy in lecky at 7p per kwh or less and sell at 70p per kwh, great business model and the cost of those battery banks are coming down and down. Grid not more stressed, zero emmissions mandate progressed.

I think many understand that those with money will be able to benefit from the transition from fossil fuel to a battery powered grid.

There will be times in the future when some will be paid to accept the excess from wind to store in their batteries for example. Then benefit from selling it back

Chinese looking like they may support Iran in various ways.

Oil go to $100 or $200 a barrel and LNG over $5 or $10 per MMBTU.

EVs and heat pumps might be the only game in town !

Edited 14 February14 Feb by lol-lol

4 hours ago, PetrolDave said:

Interesting on a global scale but of very little relevance to the UK, where the harsh reality is that generation and distribution of electricity simply will not be able to keep up with the demand IF the targets for switchover from ICE to EV are even close to being met.

To say nothing of the transition to heat pumps also.

@lol-lol You should be a Oil, Gas, minerals / commodities trader. Then the world will be your oyster. You know all the numbers & the global trends.

To anyone with logic, surely the bleeding way forwards is before you start planning and mandating things, you get the technology in place and working first to ensure the first basic promise that was made to UK public, make damned sure that the UK was 100% self-sufficient for energy, bring the cost down to enable the UK to become competitive again and give families some well-earned respite from crippling bills. Not force the things onto people which is so obviously currently not even remotely possible for vast masses of the population. Be that for physical, financial, or infrastructure reasons, so that practically everybody currently with a ICE car could also afford to switch over. And that does not also involve the other elephant in the room, and that is ensuring that the technology is perfectly safe, or at least as safe as current ICE vehicles are. Until we find methods of doing that, a fire in any car park or anywhere where cars are parked, gathered or stored together is a real major disaster just waiting to happen. We have all witnessed the terrific consequences that a few EV cars bring to car-transporting ships, where only a part of the cargo were EVs, resulting in the total loss of those ships. In a few years almost every car will be EV so that potential will be everywhere.

We need politicians to understand why their plans are not working, but that will never happen, I fear, as they lack the vision for the future and the possible consequences of getting it wrong. They only care about themselves and a 5-year plan. If it all goes tits up, they get removed at the next election, and the massive mess they leave behind is left for others.

3 minutes ago, Evolution13 said:

@lol-lol You should be a Oil, Gas, minerals / commodities trader. Then the world will be your oyster. You know all the numbers & the global trends.

The problem with that is the political influences that can massively effects things and with Putin, Trump and Xi in power to predict any commodity is very tough if not impossibly. So mitigating such elements, international trade nuiances, trade deals, origin, valuation had been my business, along with bonded warehouses and inward processing relief, airworthiness, End/ authorised use and outward processing relief to partially offset those geo-political elements.

Oil could well fall to twenty dollars if no political tension in the Middle East. That sadly makes it too expensive for North Sea Oil and that scenario is quite likely as China and other countries Oil demand plummets with their electrification. Not only my prediction but many as zan be seen on Bloomberg etc.

'UK energy prices around the highest in the world'. UK Industry energy prices 60% higher than elsewhere in Europe. Or such like. While many can fill their boots or save money on cheap tariff electric others are paying high tariffs and daily charges. That is where average prices mentioned often in the UK is a P1$$ take. The POTUS is brokering oil. Seizing tankers and the oil at sea and selling it on. This is the supposed oil rich North America. Niot really so oil rich, they want Heavy Oil that belongs to others.,..

Edited 14 February14 Feb by Evolution13

12 minutes ago, Graham Butcher said:

To anyone with logic, surely the bleeding way forwards is before you start planning and mandating things, you get the technology in place and working first to ensure the first basic promise that was made to UK public, make damned sure that the UK was 100% self-sufficient for energy, bring the cost down to enable the UK to become competitive again and give families some well-earned respite from crippling bills. Not force the things onto people which is so obviously currently not even remotely possible for vast masses of the population. Be that for physical, financial, or infrastructure reasons, so that practically everybody currently with a ICE car could also afford to switch over. And that does not also involve the other elephant in the room, and that is ensuring that the technology is perfectly safe, or at least as safe as current ICE vehicles are. Until we find methods of doing that, a fire in any car park or anywhere where cars are parked, gathered or stored together is a real major disaster just waiting to happen. We have all witnessed the terrific consequences that a few EV cars bring to car-transporting ships, where only a part of the cargo were EVs, resulting in the total loss of those ships. In a few years almost every car will be EV so that potential will be everywhere.

We need politicians to understand why their plans are not working, but that will never happen, I fear, as they lack the vision for the future and the possible consequences of getting it wrong. They only care about themselves and a 5-year plan. If it all goes tits up, they get removed at the next election, and the massive mess they leave behind is left for others.

The tech is already here.

That emotional vacuum Elon Musk said he could install a large grid battery in less 100 days to replace the expensive and dirty coal and gas Peaker plants in Australia.

He did it with time to spare.

It is a question of will and facilitation as tech already here and uk is doing it but at glacial pace as usual apparently bogged down in planning and procedures.

Micheal Gove / Boris Johnson / Jacob Rees Mogg & other Snouters & Rolls Royce. Small Modular Nuclear. We are waiting. The AI Data centres are coming semingly quicker than the Electricity. Well in the UK.

5 minutes ago, lol-lol said:

The tech is already here.

That emotional vacuum Elon Musk said he could install a large grid battery in less 100 days to replace the expensive and dirty coal and gas Peaker plants in Australia.

He did it with time to spare.

It is a question of will and facilitation as tech already here and uk is doing it but at glacial pace as usual apparently bogged down in planning and procedures.

You are still not seeing the larger picture, I large battery storage unit is not going to solve the UK issues is it?

2 days ago GB Energy finally announced the location of the Head Quarters. They are going to get on very well at the pace they do things. Investors obviously are flocking to be involved with this shower of whoevers,.

Just now, Graham Butcher said:

You are still not seeing the larger picture, I large battery storage unit is not going to solve the UK issues is it?

The roll out of new battery, solar and wind parks is moving at pace.

Wind has new records and 2026 is predicted to be.

2026 expected to see an increase in solar of around 50% .

Make electricity even cheaper at night time and business and home will download the power they need the night before and use it during the day and these device are from tens to hundreds of pounds for homes and from a couple of £k for business and will pay for themselves within 3 years.

Millions of business and home storage batteries. Australia did over 100k installs in 4 months so UK should be able to do more than a million locations with a year proportionally.

energygain.co.uk

Optimistic UK Solar Forecast to Grow 50% Year-on-Year Aga...

The UK’s solar energy sector is on the cusp of an unprecedented boom in 2026, driven by positive UK Solar Forecasts predicting a staggering 50% year-on-year (YoY) growth for the second consecutive yea

Wind growth expected......

https://www.renewableuk.com/energypulse/blog/uk-wind-energy-pipeline-in-2025-a-year-in-review/#:~:text=All%20of%20these%20projects%20have,by%20the%20summer%20of%202026.

1 minute ago, lol-lol said:

The roll out of new battery, solar and wind parks is moving at pace.

Wind has new records and 2026 is predicted to be.

2026 expected to see an increase in solar of around 50% .

Make electricity even cheaper at night time and business and home will download the power they need the night before and use it during the day and these device are from tens to hundreds of pounds for homes and from a couple of £k for business and will pay for themselves within 3 years.

Millions of business and home storage batteries. Australia did over 100k installs in 4 months so UK should be able to do more than a million locations with a year proportionally.

energygain.co.uk

Optimistic UK Solar Forecast to Grow 50% Year-on-Year Aga...

The UK’s solar energy sector is on the cusp of an unprecedented boom in 2026, driven by positive UK Solar Forecasts predicting a staggering 50% year-on-year (YoY) growth for the second consecutive yea

Do you believe all the BS that is out there from parties with a political agenda, in this case the BBC being a government mouthpiece? They are no better then many other sources often quoted who have vested interests in a certain outcome where they gain some benefit from. All of these people so many EV'ers claim are biased against them actually do not know the truth. All they want is the same as me, the freedom to make their own mind up. Like the other examples I have shown you. If the products are really genuinely far superior and the public can see that, then they will migrate towards them naturally, no pressure required. Look back in history and see how many things you used to have/use in your past but you have moved on along with the rest of the world, where are the cassettes, vinyal records, Betamax, VHS, Laser Discs CRT tvs and monitors, Incandescent and CFL lamps, Steam engines, etc., etc.? All gone and no legislation required to make the switch; the consumers did that globally.

So they will with EVs if they really are that good and they can prove themselves, but currently, they are not doing a good job of it are they?

Edited 14 February14 Feb by Graham Butcher

28 minutes ago, lol-lol said:

Make electricity even cheaper at night time and business and home will download the power they need the night before and use it during the day

IF they can afford the cost of home batteries, remember many people are NOT eligible for the available grants - and amongst them are those most in need of lower energy costs!

5 minutes ago, PetrolDave said:

IF they can afford the cost of home batteries, remember many people are NOT eligible for the available grants - and amongst them are those most in need of lower energy costs!

One of my "home batteries" was a £14 kit. Pictured below.

It actually contained only two led bulbs but did have the little solar panel.

This is what the renewable revolution looks like all over the world.

Small solar panel built on make shift trestles. Batteries might be old lead acid ones rather than L-ion.

Much of the revolution is not thousands of pounds spent on roof top solar and Tesla Powerwall battery setups.

There is a massive market in small and medium portable lithium, LFP and soon to be even cheaper sodium batteries in the half to two KWh size which enable people to use almost no expensive day time electricity.

What I think might shock people is, like already other places, there will be a new TOU tariff ie from 1600 to 1900 hours where people pay twice or more normal Day time Price. Or one can pay a Day time price of 40P or more perhaps and stay on single price tariff rather than a TOU tariff which actually gives users the opportunity to save hundreds of pounds a year.

1 hour ago, lol-lol said:

One of my "home batteries" was a £14 kit.

Not the same as you were talking about when running the whole house and/or charging an EV - so not relevant.

The Government has already agreed future payments for renewables per mw/h at nearly twice the price of current gas prices. So if the price of electricity is set by the highest cost provision how can they go down . The reduction promised this year is from reducing the add-ons to the cost we pay now not the cost per mw/h

1 hour ago, PetrolDave said:

Not the same as you were talking about when running the whole house and/or charging an EV - so not relevant.

Home batteries, with or without solar, is all about not pay the sucker Day time rate of Time Of Use, TOU, electricity.

Devices from the tiny one above or the range of batteries I have, 1.5 kwh, 1.8 kwh and even 0.5 kwh ones are there to minimise Day time lecky usage.

Us with batteries and EVs and solar use these devices to get us through the Day and then switch to consuming Grid power during the super cgeap Night Time Rate, typically about 50 kwhs for me. One of my cars can do V2L if needed.

This is how we typically are paying about 10p per kwh for what we take from the Grid. That was over 7 MWH and will be even higher in 2026 as we gave gone to 3 EVs. So looking forward to electricity prices dropping in April.

So home batteries, whether one has 5,10, 15 or 50 kwh capacity as I do, with the EV, is not about powering the whole house IMO but to use power from the Grid intelligently so it costs you the least without spending lots just to chase tgat last few watt hours, or Joules as I like to call them.

I don't bother to power my Router, or Internet phone or most house lights, not worth it. My house, modem detached, is using only a couple hundred watts during day time. Fridge Freezer being the biggie, that is powered by a battery during the day, it is also be charged at the same from solar. TV, laptops might also be charging via these portable batteries or be plugged in to solar at some time points.

All my equipment, including the solar tracking arrays can move with me when I move house solar not locked in to the house. Both car charging wallboxes will stay but they were free or subsidised and I expect they will ve a notable asset for the house when I sell.

There are several ways to remove the epiderus from the feline.

Edited 15 February15 Feb by lol-lol