Hankook Kinergy Eco 2 K435, any informations?

[D.FYLAKTOS]

My dear Briskodians, i am interesting to buy for my Felicia a new set of tyres, now i am on 175/60/14 and i want to ask your opinion or your impressions (if you have use them) for the Hankook Kinergy Eco 2 K435.

 

 

Their index is: Fuel: C, Wet: B, Noise: 70dB and what i like is that they have 3 grooves (Toyo has 4) which may means something for contact with asphalt or pressure under successive turns (sometimes i drive in mountain roads a little bit Sport style).

 

 

[Carlston]

The Toyo may not have 4 grooves around the circumference, as sellers use generic photos.

 

For example, you can see that mytyres is using the same photo for the following four Toyo CF2 tyre sizes:

 

Toyo CF2 175/60R14

https://www.mytyres.co.uk/rshop/tyre/Toyo/Proxes-CF2/175-60-R14-79H/R-273326

 

Toyo CF2 175/65R14

https://www.mytyres.co.uk/rshop/tyre/Toyo/Proxes-CF2/175-65-R14-82H/R-252106

 

Toyo CF2 185/55R15

https://www.mytyres.co.uk/rshop/tyre/Toyo/Proxes-CF2/185-55-R15-82H/R-235623

 

Toyo CF2 195/45R16

https://www.mytyres.co.uk/rshop/tyre/Toyo/Proxes-CF2/195-45-R16-84V-XL/R-235657

 

175/60R14 is not a common tyre size. As you are buying a set, I suggest you use 175/65R14 instead. This will give you a lot more choice, lower prices, and a better ride.

 

175/65R14 has the same outside diameter as 185/55R15 and 195/45R16...which are two sizes that are sometimes used on the Felicia.

 

As you are driving on mountain roads, I suggest you use all-season tyres that have the 3PMSF symbol. These will grip better on loose surfaces. And if the temperature in Greece drops below 7 degrees Centigrade you will have more grip than summer tyres.

 

As you mentioned Hankook, here's the Hankook Kinergy H750 all-season tyre. It's a directional tyre which I'm not a fan of so I would be looking at the Vredestein Quatrac 5 or Dunlop Sport All Season in the 175/65R14 size.

 

 

https://www.mytyres.co.uk/rshop/tyre/Hankook/Kinergy-4S-H750/175-65-R14-82T-4PR-SBL/R-378203

 

Edited 1 December, 2021 by Carlston

[D.FYLAKTOS]

12 hours ago, Carlston said:

175/60R14 is not a common tyre size. As you are buying a set, I suggest you use 175/65R14 instead. This will give you a lot more choice, lower prices, and a better ride.

 

From the factory 1.3 i had 165/70R13 79T 4.5Jx13 and i thought that the next choice was 175/60R14 79T 5.5Jx14, in Greece you can find some options

https://www.skroutz.gr/c/578/lastixa-autokinitou.html?keyphrase=175%2F60%2F14&o=175%2F60%2F14

Unfortunately the Bridgestone RE88 and the Michelin Pilot Exalto (i have use both of them in 175/60/14) can not be found, now i have Toyo Proxes CF-2 175/60/14 (actually i have used 6 tyres) and i am on the search for something else.

 

In 175/65/14 in Greece the options are more

https://www.skroutz.gr/c/578/lastixa-autokinitou/f/560126/epivatiko.html?keyphrase=175%2F65%2F14&o=175%2F65%2F14&custom_range[718][min]=14&custom_range[718][max]=14

i am interesting for Fuel index mainly (we don't have too much rain here) and the price is not a problem.

 

As for the transformation i am hesitate a bit

https://tire-calc.com/comparison/175-65-r14-and-175-60-r14-inch/

because i don't know what's going to happen with fuel consumption and there will be a confuse with odometer, the oil change intervals etc.

I don't want to go to 185 for fuel consumption and braking factors.

 

[D.FYLAKTOS]

16 hours ago, Carlston said:

The Toyo may not have 4 grooves around the circumference, as sellers use generic photos.

 

Here are my Toyo today, i have them since 2016.

 

 

[Carlston]

175/60R14 has about the same outside diameter as 165/70R13. They both have the same load index. They both are standard Felicia tyre sizes.

 

175/60R14 has an outside diameter of 565.6mm

 

175/65R14 has an outside diameter of 583.1mm

 

So fitting 175/65R14 instead of 175/60R14 would raise the gearing by 3.1%

 

Speedos over-read by about 5% when on standard tyre sizes, so fitting 175/65R14 instead of 175/60R14 would make the speedo more accurate.

 

The odometer would under-read by about 3.1% but that's not really enough to justify changing your servicing pattern.

 

wheel-size.com has some information on standard tyre and rim sizes, although they often make mistakes

Skoda Felicia 2001 136i

– Generation: Type 791 [1994 .. 2001] 

– Power: 67 hp | 50 kW | 68 PS 

– Engine: 1.3L, I4, Petrol

– Center Bore: 57.1 mm 

– PCD: 4x100 

– Wheel Fasteners: Lug bolts 

– Wheel Tightening Torque: unknown

– Thread Size: M12 x 1.5 

– Trim Production: [1994 .. 2001]

Tire	Rim
165/70R13 79T	4.5Jx13 ET38	1.9 / 1.8
175/60R14 79T	5.5Jx14 ET40	2
195/50R15 77T	6Jx15 ET38	2.1

Skoda Felicia 2001 1.6MPI

– Generation: Type 791 [1994 .. 2001] 

– Power: 74 hp | 55 kW | 75 PS 

– Engine: 1.6L, I4, Petrol

– Center Bore: 57.1 mm 

– PCD: 4x100 

– Wheel Fasteners: Lug bolts 

– Wheel Tightening Torque: unknown

– Thread Size: M12 x 1.5 

– Trim Production: [1995 .. 2001]

Tire	Rim
175/60R14 79T	5Jx14 ET38	2
195/50R15 79H	6Jx15 ET38	2.1
195/45R16 77V	6.5Jx16 ET35	2.1

 

https://www.wheel-size.com/size/skoda/felicia/2001/

 

You could fit 5Jx14 ET35 4/100 57.1 steel rims from the Skoda Citigo/VW Up or any of the other rims from those cars.

 

Skoda Citigo Rims (from the Skoda online parts catalogue)

https://skoda.7zap.com/en/cz/citigo/cit/2016-727/6/

 

5Jx14 ET35 4/100 57.1 steel rims from the Citigo

https://www.oponeo.pl/wybierz-felgi-stalowe#&&/wEXCgUTcGNrX1RyTFNCb2x0UGF0dGVybgUFNHgxMDAFC3Bja19UckxTQ2FyBQEwBQxwY2tfVHJMU0RpYW0FAjE0BQdwY2tfQ1BnBQExBQdwY2tfSVBQBQIxMgUTcGNrX1RyTFNDZW50cmFsQm9yZQUFNTcsMTAFFXBja19Mc3RTU29ydFBhcmFtZXRlcgUFNjU1MzYFFXBja19UckxTU29ydERpcmVjdGlvbgUBMgUIcGNrX0lPRlAFAjMwBQ1wY2tfVHJMU1dpZHRoBQU1LDAwSktDCTsAUEv155zFMx2RGFGWernF

 

165/65R14

Another tyre size option is 165/65R14 which has an outside diameter of 570.1mm and the same load index as 165/70R13 and 175/60R14 tyres. If you're looking for maximum fuel economy then that could be the way to go.

 

165/65R14 is only 0.8% higher geared than 175/60R14, which means that after about 2mm of tread wear the 165/65R14 will have the same outside diameter as a new 175/60R14.

 

It's best to fit a 165/65R14 tyre to a 4.5J or 5J rim, rather than the wider 5.5J rim.

 

Edited 2 December, 2021 by Carlston

[D.FYLAKTOS]

2 hours ago, Carlston said:

 

Another tyre size option is 165/65R14

If you're looking for maximum fuel economy then that could be the way to go.

 

It's best to fit a 165/65R14 tyre to a 4.5J or 5J rim, rather than the wider 5.5J rim.

 

My Felicia has ECU-chip, BMC filter,custom exhaust manifold-pipes-muffler and tail pipe.

320mm new steering wheel, 3mm lowered springs, Koni shock absorbers, strut bar, anti-roll bar, new top-mount and 14 inch Tecnomagnesio rims.

I use my car for few Km daily route at city (work-house) ,for sport driving at mountain roads and when i am on the highway a speed of 100-120 Km is fine for me.

I hesitate to turn to 165 as i had when i bought my Trusty plus the expenses to buy new 13 inch rims.

[Thefeliciahacker]

Well I have bridgestone turanza t005 175/65/14 they fit perfectly make the ride smoother are silent grip well and are amazing in the wet. 

[Thefeliciahacker]

The also fill the arches well giving the car a nicer look in my eyes. 

 

[D.FYLAKTOS]

14 minutes ago, Thefeliciahacker said:

bridgestone turanza t005 175/65/14

 

They are not for sport driving, they are soft on the sides which means problem while parking in city (pavements).

Me previous Potenza were very good in rain but they needed some time to get warmed, more than Michelin.

[Carlston]

1 hour ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

I hesitate to turn to 165 as i had when i bought my Trusty plus the expenses to buy new 13 inch rims.

 

As you have a modified Felicia, maybe go for 185/60R14. This size is normally fitted to either a 5.5J or 6J wide rim.

 

This was one of the standard tyre sizes on the Fabia MK1.

 

Dunlop Sport BluResponse 185/60R14 82H

https://www.skroutz.gr/s/7319811/Dunlop-Sport-Bluresponse-185-60R14-82H.html

 

 

185/60R14 has a 2.1% bigger outside diameter than 175/60R14.

 

Edited 2 December, 2021 by Carlston

[Thefeliciahacker]

10 hours ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

They are not for sport driving, they are soft on the sides which means problem while parking in city (pavements).

Well yes they are a touring tire, but neither the felicia is meant for sport driving. 

Also me who is used to driving a 40 profile tyre, don't really get the point of people saying they are good for pavements. 

[D.FYLAKTOS]

13 hours ago, Carlston said:

As you have a modified Felicia, maybe go for 185/60R14. This size is normally fitted to either a 5.5J or 6J wide rim.

 

Is in my mind but according to my theory:

I will have better grip in the dry and better braking, i will have worse braking in the wet and greater hydrolysis, i will have better acceleration but a small lose in final speed, i will probably have more gasoline consumption.

Am i right or no? I would like to hear your opinion.

 

3 hours ago, Thefeliciahacker said:

me who is used to driving a 40 profile tyre, don't really get the point of people saying they are good for pavements. 

 

If you are living in a big city and you park your car outside then at least 2 times per day (house to work and work to house) you have to put your car close to pavement, except if you are a rich guy and you have a private parking.

Especially at night it's inevitable that your tyre will touch the pavement and when other cars are waiting behind you and you are in a hurry.

City drivers have scratched rims too for this reason.

[Thefeliciahacker]

2 hours ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

Am i right or no

Dry grip same wet grip less. 

Acceleration less top speed more. 

Lower rpm lower fuel consumption 

[Thefeliciahacker]

2 hours ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

f you are living in a big city and you park your car outside then at least 2 times per day (house to work and work to house) you have to put your car close to pavement, except if you are a rich guy and you have a private parking.

Especially at night it's inevitable that your tyre will touch the pavement and when other cars are waiting behind you and you are in a hurry.

I live in the 3rd biggest city in Greece. 

I don't like city driving. 

But yet when I do it I take care of my cars. 

[D.FYLAKTOS]

6 hours ago, Thefeliciahacker said:

I live in the 3rd biggest city in Greece. 

 

But yet when I do it I take care of my cars. 

 

Things in Athens especially close to the centre are far more difficult than other cities.

Finding a parking space is from difficult to impossible.If you find it, it will be just enough to fit your car.If you put it near the sidewalk you will scratch the rims, if you put it outside then a truck-jeep-bus will break your mirror or will scratch your door.  Other times the place is so narrow that you have to ride on the sidewalk.

At night things are even more difficult because you can not see well through the mirrors but also because the drivers behind you honk if you are late. Everything is under pressure, traffic, frequent touching of bumpers, very often repairs on the roads (so then there are patches that protrude), many potholes etc.

Things like in the movies with shiny cars and chrome rims parked comfortable in the side of a wide road are just fantasies in Athens that's why it's very often to see scratched rims (some guys paint them often with spary or Plasti Dip) or see talking of ''how are the sides of your tyre, soft or hard?'' in auto-forums.

[Thefeliciahacker]

Well in Athens that may be a problem.

The t005 have very soft sidewalls, and that is what makes them comfortable silent and economical.

[D.FYLAKTOS]

Bad news for  the Hankook Kinergy Eco 2 K435, in the beginning they told me to wait about 10 days then at least a month due to the delay from Covid and Holidays.

I can not wait so much time, rainy days are coming and my 5+ years old Toyo are not in good shape to face that.

[nta16]

D.FYLAKTOS what size wheels are fitted to your car?  Which Toyo tyres?  (Toyo UK used to be just up the road from us.)

 

4.5Jx13 is a narrow wheel, 4.5" rim width, that was the factory size wheel on my 1973 car, the earlier model I had was factory standard 3.5"! rim width with 145/80/13 tyres fabulous steering feel and handling but that's on a lower and lighter car than yours.

 

165/70/13 was the low profile tyre to 145/80/13, the 70 and 80 profile contribute to the suspension and ride quality, the modern oversized wheels and very and ultra low profile tyre are more about fashion than grip, a tyres construction and composition compounds provide the grip and performance.  Tyre tread too is as much about fashion as is bigger and wider wheels to fill the wheel arch and wider and lower profile tyres to look more butch.

 

I used to give tyres 1,000 miles for performance and if I did not like them I would give them away and buy a new different set, sadly those days are long passed.

 

On my factory stand 1987 Estelle 2 130 LS when It was new I put on a set Goodyear Eagle NCT (2?) and a BMW could not loose me on the back roads but I was doing to much mileage then to justify the wear, when I changed them worn a bit I went back to more usual tyres and boy what a difference, what a come down.

 

Take the EU Tyre labels with a pinch of salt, when they first came in some good tyres were rated low and some not so good tyres rated higher than they deserved, as VW have proven you can rig things to look good in tests but it's a different matter in the real world.

 

Tyres now more than previously 'dry rot' and go hard from lack of use and/or mileage often well before the thread has worn a lot so if you are not doing high mileage you might as well get grippy tyres for dry and wet, particularly wet obviously.

 

Current tyres, at least in these sort of sizes, seem to have soft sidewalls and tread block now, nice for comfort but less so for spirited driving.

 

There used to be a fabulous site about wheels and tyres with great comparison tools on it and explanations sadly the chap went commercial and all the information and tools taken off line but some sites have some good bits of information and (not so good) comparison tools.

 

 

 

[D.FYLAKTOS]

I have 14 inch rims 5.5j with 175/60 tyre, in the past i had factory 13 inch rims with 165/70 Matador tyres.

My Toyo are the CF22.

[nta16]

You must bear in mind you do have a fat heavy VW or fat heavy modern car so don't need big wide wheels.  Is your car lowered and with  uprated suspension and bigger brakes then or factory standard?

 

Also if you worry about unsprung weight 5.5" x 14" wheels with 175/60/14 tyres might weight about the same as 4.5" x 13" wheels with 165/70/13 tyres.

 

If you are concerned about fuel (and ride comfort) you would go back to the 13" wheels with their narrower tyres if possible.

 

The Toyo Proxes CF2 generally seem to get very good reviews but I've not seen reports for your size and on your model.

 

The Hankook Kinergy Eco 2 generally seem to get good reviews, not quite as good as the CF2  but again I've not seen reports for your size and on your model.

 

Your rim width of 5.5" and your tyre size restrict your choice so why not stick with the CF2s.

 

I have the same problem getting 145 or 155 13" tyres that are not for modern (heavy in comparison to my car) city cars and with Covid I was on my forth choice of tyre because I wanted them before finally going on a weekend car club tour.  You know better than I what is available to Greece but perhaps  you could have the tyres sent to you from another country and fitted locally.

 

Edited 13 December, 2021 by nta16

[D.FYLAKTOS]

1 hour ago, nta16 said:

Is your car lowered and with  uprated suspension and bigger brakes then or factory standard?

 

The Toyo Proxes CF2 generally seem to get very good reviews but I've not seen reports for your size and on your model.

 

You know better than I what is available to Greece but perhaps  you could have the tyres sent to you from another country and fitted locally.

 

 

I have Koni orange shock absorber with Apex lowering spings

Strut brace and lower Arm bar

Brembo brakes and brake pads (factory dimensions) with metal brake hoses.

 

Felicia is an old model.

 

Yes but this has 2 problems, 1st is the cost of shipping and second there is no quarantee that you will recieve a ''fresh'' (with recent DOT) tyre and not one which was in the shelf for years.

[nta16]

2 hours ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

second there is no quarantee that you will recieve a ''fresh'' (with recent DOT) tyre and not one which was in the shelf for years

Provided the tyres are stored correctly they do have a "shelf-life" and you can ask for the date of manufacture before you order but I understand why you may not want to.

 

I would not necessarily rely om Brembo brakes being as good as they used to be but yours may still be good, I was told their quality was up and down a few years ago when I was looking for new pads.  And the Pagid discs I fitted recently to the front of my wife's Fabia Mk3 showed a lot of rust after a night of heavy rain this weekend.

 

You are concerned about MPG and then set your car up for spirited driving which are at opposite ends so you will always have compromises.

 

The tyres now are called 'Summer' tyres, whereas they used to be called tyres, and in the UK used all year round, and still are, but they used to put that the tyres performance would start to determinate at ambient  temperature of 10c, that can sometimes be a summer's day in the UK. 🙂

 

The extra half an inch in the wheel rim width does also restrict tyre size choices.

 

Toyo PROXES CF2  note the variances in actual dimensions against nominal sizes. - https://toyotires.eu/tire/pattern/proxes-cf2

 

What about looking at tyres in 165/65 R14 (only 3mm taller and differences in real rather than nominal sizes and tread depth in tread could may them the same height) ? - https://tiresize.com/calculator/

 

Edited 13 December, 2021 by nta16

[KenONeill]

1 hour ago, nta16 said:

The tyres now are called 'Summer' tyres, whereas they used to be called tyres, and in the UK used all year round, and still are, but they used to put that the tyres performance would start to determinate at ambient  temperature of 10c, that can sometimes be a summer's day in the UK.

OTOH last Saturday ( Dec 11th) the air temperature was ~13C at 19:00 hours.

[D.FYLAKTOS]

I am on the smartphone now, tomorrow noon i wiil be on pc and i will answer.

[D.FYLAKTOS]

14 hours ago, nta16 said:

Provided the tyres are stored correctly they do have a "shelf-life" and you can ask for the date of manufacture before you order but I understand why you may not want to.

 

I would not necessarily rely om Brembo brakes being as good as they used to be but yours may still be good, I was told their quality was up and down a few years ago when I was looking for new pads.  And the Pagid discs I fitted recently to the front of my wife's Fabia Mk3 showed a lot of rust after a night of heavy rain this weekend.

 

You are concerned about MPG and then set your car up for spirited driving which are at opposite ends so you will always have compromises.

 

The tyres now are called 'Summer' tyres, whereas they used to be called tyres, and in the UK used all year round, and still are, but they used to put that the tyres performance would start to determinate at ambient  temperature of 10c, that can sometimes be a summer's day in the UK. 🙂

 

Toyo PROXES CF2  note the variances in actual dimensions against nominal sizes. -

 

What about looking at tyres in 165/65 R14 (only 3mm taller and differences in real rather than nominal sizes and tread depth in tread could may them the same height) ?

 

 

The tyres will come with courier's truck which means tremendous cost for shipping plus they will leave it to your door, then you have to carry those tyres to your car and then to a local tyre-shop.

You will pay 25 euro for installation and of course the owner will stare at you, if something goes wrong you are alone, everybody will say ''you take them, your responsibility".

If the DOT is not recent what happens? You will return them back to Germany? Nah..

 

I installed Brembo disks about 17 years ago, had for many years Ferodo brake pads and recent i turned to Brembo after an incident.

Many cars here after a rain and if the owner don't move them for few days got some light ''rust" but after 2 brakes this disappeared.

 

Having fuel consumption ONLY in city about 12.4-14 ltr/100 Km is unacceptable, for that kind of MPG i am concern, this means that something is wrong and i waist money in gasoline plus this ruins my motor.

 

We use mainly Summer tyres here, very few use All Weather.

 

Toyo Proxes are given as ''premium" and Hankook Kinergy Eco as ''factory installed", Toyo are a liitle bit on the ''Sport side".

 

After about 17 years in 175/60 it's difficult to turn to 165/65, it may be more comfortable in the city but for Sport driving i doubt.