Or you could just do it the correct way. Sooner or later, you'll have to remove the instrument panel anyway when some part of instruments or one of the switches inevitably fails. 

The Green arrow (1st pin) is for?

 

This is connection for electric window. Output switches polarity, that's not what you need. You need to do a different connection, which will disconnect the lock switch from ground for unlock, and bridge it for lock.

1 hour ago, Papez said:

You need to do a different connection, which will disconnect the lock switch from ground for unlock, and bridge it for lock.

 

Sorry but i can not do it by myself, i had to provide the guy a diagram or a photo like above to work otherwise he will abandon the try like the previous electrician.

I saw the Blue arrow and the ''central lock actuator'' and i thought that this was the way to do it.

Quick sketch from my phone.

You need to check that the switch really is connected like this internally.

 

The left side is unlock - you'll need to split the yellow cable that connects the original switch to ground. Pressing it will disconnect the switch from the ground.

 

Right side is locks - you need to tap into yellow wire without cutting it. Pressing it will bridge the original switch.

 

There's still risk that this will not work and you'll end up with messed up door wiring. I'm not taking any responsibility for that, you've been warned and still deliberately ignores advice for the proper installation. But I want to help and it's your decision.

Edited 23 September, 20241 yr by Papez

One pin is no use?

 

55 minutes ago, Papez said:

There's still risk that this will not work and you'll end up with messed up door wiring. I'm not taking any responsibility for that,

 

you've been warned and still deliberately ignores advice for the proper installation

 

I won't blame you for anything.

 

This means extra cost from the electrician and still no guarantee that it works, if not, then extra time to put back the dashboard and of course there would be no discound.

I am not a stubborn guy, the first electrician warned me from the beginning: "i need too much time and i can not guarantee to you that will work".

 

With the second way i will save money plus if the electrician won't manage to make it work then "no big deal", the panel goes  back and "good bye".

 

1 hour ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

the first electrician warned me from the beginning: "i need too much time and i can not guarantee to you that will work".

 

With the second way i will save money plus if the electrician won't manage to make it work then "no big deal", the panel goes  back and "good bye".

I don't see how going around various electricians, trying to figure out working connection and messing with wiring is less work and cheaper, than simply putting two extra pins into connector that's meant for that purpose. 

1 hour ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

and still no guarantee that it works,

 

The factory remote is connected like that. Why do you think there's no guarantee it will work? It's more likely to work than the other solution.

1 hour ago, Papez said:

I don't see how going around various electricians, trying to figure out working connection and messing with wiring is less work and cheaper, than simply putting two extra pins into connector that's meant for that purpose. 

 

The factory remote is connected like that. Why do you think there's no guarantee it will work? It's more likely to work than the other solution.

 

I have visited so far 3 electricians, the 1st said that there is no guarantee that he will manage to do it work plus it will take much time for him, i couldn't argue with that guy and say to him ''oh here is the diagram,read and follow it'' because here when the mechanics hear about Felicia they say ''Oh it's an old car, i don't mess with it''.

No Official Dealer or any othe ''famous'' Skoda mechanic here will accept to work with Felicia, IF you lucky to find an older mechanic which has the willing to help you then OK otherwise ''you are done''. 

 

Remember with the Flip Key what happened? Two locksmiths said ''No''.

I am lucky that after asking (again) the 1st will find time to work with the ''Yellow cable solution'' and let's pray that he can do his magic.

For you or some other Skoda mechanic following the diagram it's an easy task and can be done BUT when the only electrician says that need too much time, it would be very costlty and can not guarantee the result what's my options?

What i can say to him?

The second electrican opened the panel, search etc and then said ''No more'', i couldn't do anything, i lower my head and left the repair-shop.

The 3rd said ''No'' only when i explain to him what i wanted, what could i say to him that it's an incompetent?

 

On the other hand maybe i am the only Felicia owner who want to this, i can't follow the steps of another guy so ''i am walking in the dark'', i have no oprions and when they tell me multpiple times ''No'' then i just compromise.

 

PS: the next ''nightmare'' is buckets seats, i bet that (as in the past) the majority will say ''No'' so i would be extremely lucky IF i find someone who wants to take over.

 

3 hours ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

For you or some other Skoda mechanic following the diagram it's an easy task and can be done BUT when the only electrician says that need too much time, it would be very costlty and can not guarantee the result what's my options?

What i can say to him?

 

 

I'd say "follow the diagram on he locker unit DZ for lock, DO for unlock"

 

Edited 23 September, 20241 yr by Papez

15 hours ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

I have visited so far 3 electricians, the 1st said that there is no guarantee that he will manage to do it work plus it will take much time for him, i couldn't argue with that guy and say to him ''oh here is the diagram,read and follow it'' because here when the mechanics hear about Felicia they say ''Oh it's an old car, i don't mess with it''.

No Official Dealer or any othe ''famous'' Skoda mechanic here will accept to work with Felicia, IF you lucky to find an older mechanic which has the willing to help you then OK otherwise ''you are done''. 

You are wrong main dealer is obligated to service the vehicle, but they are also obliged to stay within factory specs, you are asking for something non-factory

15 hours ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

Remember with the Flip Key what happened? Two locksmiths said ''No''.

I am lucky that after asking (again) the 1st will find time to work with the ''Yellow cable solution'' and let's pray that he can do his magic.

For you or some other Skoda mechanic following the diagram it's an easy task and can be done BUT when the only electrician says that need too much time, it would be very costlty and can not guarantee the result what's my options?

The point here is your mindset and not the response of those people. The flip key requires immo programming and chip pre-programming, which they don't have the software and capability to work on such old cars.

Now on the locking unit, what you are asking is "for a working solution to be DEVELOPED and implemented based on the existing system" those technicians are applied craft technicians mostly working on experience and NOT actual education, you are asking them to go above and beyond, and that WILL COST YOU MONEY, don't you get it, IT WILL COST YOU, they cant give a guarantee it will work because they really don't understand the system, that's why their most common solution when something goes wrong is to "bypass it". 

If you really want to do these things a proper way go to an engineer ask for a solution to be developed, complete electrical drawings along with application drawings, PAY THEM THE HEFTY price, because you are buying their knowledge. Then, go to the electrician of your choice and ask for the solution to BE APPLIED.

15 hours ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

What i can say to him?

You can NOT say anything because that is not his job, he will be assuming liability for something he doesn't really understand.

 

15 hours ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

he second electrican opened the panel, search etc and then said ''No more'', i couldn't do anything, i lower my head and left the repair-shop.

The 3rd said ''No'' only when i explain to him what i wanted, what could i say to him that it's an incompetent?

First and foremost the second electrician knows a thing or 2 and doesn't like messing with factory wiring, so he told you the correct thing.

The third simply feels like he wont be able to get paid.
Because they know you expect a price tag of 50 euros, how much can they ask you for. If I was in their position I would ask for 350 euros, would you pay it? If so make that clear to them from the beginning. 

15 hours ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

On the other hand maybe i am the only Felicia owner who want to this, i can't follow the steps of another guy so ''i am walking in the dark'', i have no oprions and when they tell me multpiple times ''No'' then i just compromise.

Again for them its not worth the liability given what they are getting paid

 

15 hours ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

PS: the next ''nightmare'' is buckets seats, i bet that (as in the past) the majority will say ''No'' so i would be extremely lucky IF i find someone who wants to take over.

And for veryyyyyyyyyyyy good reason, in fact, seat mounting is a major crash behavior development area, slapping a couple of seats in a vehicle is a recipe for disaster, take a look at your current seat mounting and try to understand all the engineering decisions behind EVERYTHING, you won't nor will they. Heck, off the self-seat mountings for bucket seats have to have homologation marks to be legal on an MOT test, and if I was the tester and was shown a non-compliant seat mounting I would declare the vehicle as purple "επικινδυνη ελλειψη" so the vehicle be towed to the nearest shop. NOT EVEN DRIVEN

12 hours ago, Papez said:

DZ for lock, DO

are they pull to ground or pull to vcc ?

33 minutes ago, Thefeliciahacker said:

are they pull to ground or pull to vcc ?

To the ground, as shown on the diagram. Doors are also pulled to the ground, both on this and in car's wiring diagram.

Here is the plug beside the door panel and the yellow wire.

 

 

 

Take a look of what ''noise insulation" was before 23 years, no ebay or aliexpress.

Tar paper and tar spray (which means extra weight), i also found a broken clip but thankfully i have bought some extra.

 

The 4th pin must stay empty as is?

 

12 hours ago, Papez said:

 

I'd say "follow the diagram on he locker unit DZ for lock, DO for unlock"

 

I have printed in A3 size the diagrams, both Cz and Eng, i have printed all the photos and the comment in Eng plus translated in Romanian (the electrician is from Moldavia), i have show him the relay and relative comment.

The answer was ''i have to remove the dashboard, i don't have much time for this but even if i do it i can not guarantee to you that i can manage to work".

So come to my position for a minute, what could i say to him that is useless or lazy? I can not force him, i have to compromise.

 

 

 

When i asked for an insulation 23 years back the answer was this, carpet with petrol glue (beznina glue is called here) and black spay.

No ebay or Aliexpress, no insulation sheets that you can by today and guess what, i was the only Felicia driver of that time that asked for this, even when i go to an upholstery shop for leather in my door panels no one was accepted to work with my car ''because i don't know it" was the answer.

Thankfully i found one far away from home and he did it although not perfect work.

 

55 minutes ago, Thefeliciahacker said:

You can NOT say anything because that is not his job, he will be assuming liability for something he doesn't really understand.

 

If he can not read the original VW diagrams is my fault  or his?

 

58 minutes ago, Thefeliciahacker said:

Then, go to the electrician of your choice and ask for the solution to BE APPLIED.

 

Sadly but i have to repeat myself, every time i say ''i have a Skoda Felicia and i want to...' the answer is 99,9 % negative no matter if i want to put an extra Led Fog lights or

 

1 hour ago, Thefeliciahacker said:

You are wrong main dealer is obligated to service the vehicle, but they are also obliged to stay within factory specs,

 

Oh yeah? Make today a test, telephone to 4 electricians that you have the factory Skoda TC-6 on your hand plus completely directions-diagrams etc and tell me how many will say ''yes, i can do it, bring it"

99.9% will say ''it's an old car, i do not undertake this work" etc, i know it by first hand.

 

4 minutes ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

The answer was ''i have to remove the dashboard, i don't have much time for this but even if i do it i can not guarantee to you that i can manage to work".

So come to my position for a minute, what could i say to him that is useless or lazy? I can not force him, i have to compromise.

 

1) you should've told him that the dashboard doesn't need to be removed. Only the panel around the instruments.

 

2) When talking about compromise, why don't you remove the panel yourself? It's a 10 minute job and you are apparently comfortable to work around the interior. Or do you want to hear this every time when a lightbulb in the instrument panel fails and pay for extra work to someone who doesn't know what are they doing?

1 hour ago, Papez said:

why don't you remove the panel yourself?

 

The 4rth pin must be empty?

 

OK, i will go earlier to our appointment tomorrow so there will be time, if the first plan fails then i will remove it and he will do the second plan.

5 hours ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

The 4rth pin must be empty?

 

Yes. It disconnects switch in the motor from the ground, which will generate "unlock" state.

This newer unit uses only "pulled to the ground" as a lock signal, open circuit as unlock.

I have printed the last photo and all the comments (directions) to give them to electrician.

I hope this will work tomorrow morning.

 

 

 

 

Update:

I went to the repair shop with the panel removed, i show to the electrician the plug plus the diagrams and directions.

One touch in the yellow wire lock, one touch unlock, again and the result was the same, i was ready to smile but suddenly one touch and just a click again and click, touch for 3rd time and lock.

Touch and click, again and unlock etc, the electrician stopped and said it's not safe to proceed otherwise will going to burn the relay.

 

 

I gave him a new layer of nylon to install on the door, put the panel back and ''Game Over".

 

 

Edited 25 September, 20241 yr by D.FYLAKTOS

So there are two solutions, 1st to abandon the project and 2nd to remove the panel by my self and he will do the work on the relay.

 

 

 

Here is a picture as i found it in internet, the 5 pin switch is better of two separate buttons (as commands Lock-Unlock) ?

18 minutes ago, D.FYLAKTOS said:

One touch in the yellow wire lock, one touch unlock, again and the result was the same, i was ready to smile but suddenly one touch and just a click again and click, touch for 3rd time and lock.

What do you mean by "touch"? What did he touch it with?

 

I though that I explained it clearly - yellow pulled to the ground - lock. Yellow disconnected from the ground - unlock. It's a position sensor input for the lock, not  lock/unlock button input. 

Fact that it worked in the manner you describe at all is probably some debounce mechanism, which ignores disconnection that comes in short interval after the initial contact.

Edited 25 September, 20241 yr by Papez

20 minutes ago, Papez said:

What do you mean by "touch"? What did he touch it with?

 

 

With a tester, one end in the ground and the one in the contact.

I show him the diagram with the switch and said he can not do anything more from there (the plug), searched the cables toward the cabin and his final decision was ''from the relay'' or nothing.

I didn't want to ''push'' him more, he didn't charge me anything for the whole work.

If i put the 5 pin switch i have to cut a plastic to fit it, if the 2 buttons can do the job it's far more easy.

On 24/09/2024 at 09:44, D.FYLAKTOS said:

Take a look of what ''noise insulation" was before 23 years, no ebay or aliexpress.

Tar paper and tar spray (which means extra weight),

I held back as long as I could - you don't need all that, so much of it, to deduce the resonance off the door panel, you are carrying unnecessary extra weight - which means you are reducing your power-to-weight and increasing your mpg !!  How is that going to look on the TC-6 spreadsheet. 😉

 

@nta16 after so many years some things are unreversable in my car.

Here are some first photos from the project, they are not so good because i was in a hurry. I was outside the repair-shop and i had to remove the panel by myself to save time and money.

 

 

 

 

 

 

The relay says different than those that i was expected, 6U0 962 258 C and AEV 4012

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I didn't find anything suggesting that there is any difference. The wiring diagram appears to be identical