vRS to go diesel all the way?

[Dutch4x4]

This deserves a thread of its own, as I think it's been missed by most not paying careful attention to this thread, where I just posted a scan of this AutoExpress article.

After telling us of the choice of two FSI petrol engines (1.4 and 2.0, no 1.8T or 2.0T!) and three PD diesel engines (1.4, 1.9 and 2.0), the article has a small but very significant line at the end:

"However, a vRS-badged performance flagship, powered by 180bhp 2.0-litre diesel, is rumoured to be under development."

Is this only logical? Is Skoda taking the next step after the Fabia vRS? Will Skoda become the diesel performance brand of the two "cheap" VAG brands? Will there be a Superb 2.5 V6 TDI vRS? Will all the petrol turbos go to SEAT? And are us petrolheads prepared to become paella racers for that? Or will the 1.8T-engined old Octavias become rare, sought-after items in the future?

Just a couple of nice questions for the weekend...

[rich1068]

Actually I did notice straight away and I picked up on your mention of it in the other thread, its just that I didn't like to think about it so I've been hiding under a table since last Wednesday.

Apart from the fact that I hate them I have nothing against diesels and if the news in Auto Express is true then it is unlikely I will be buying a Skoda next.

(But that's over 2 years away. :drive: )

[usico]

Well... it could happen but I've got my head in the sand hoping it will all go away... :ignore:

[Kentish]

Nothing like trying first is there...

I dont understand why people are so anti quick diesels, unless its just that their blinkers have completely covered their eyes.

[Dr Zoidberg]

I don't see the problem either.

A 180hp diesel VRS would (fairly obviously) have the same power as a current petrol one with loads more torque and better fuel economy. Now I know the latter isn't why people buy a performance car , but if they get it as a bonus then its hardly the end of the world.

For quite a while now the reviews have been saying the 150bhp TDi Golf GTI is the best in the range so why is it so hard to think that a diesel octavia would be any good.

[usico]

Sorry guys, didn't mean to cause any offence, actually I like diesels but like my petrol too. A choice would be a good thing but it may not come to that.

BTW, how much heavier is the diesel lump than a 1.8T? I know diesel engines used to weigh the same as a bus load of Sumo wrestlers but are much lighter nowadays. Be interesting to know the difference. That would be of more concern to me than what pump I pull up to.

[spinndrift]

Just been talking to my dealership director about this.

2.0 TDI, 180bhp, good fuel econ wonder if it will put many people off the Furby vRS.

[Dmac1969vRS]

I think SEAT are getting these hot derv engines as well , but i reckon they will get the FSI T's as well , and Skoda wont , coz SEAT is in the 'Performance' VAG stable with Audi and Lambo. Would that mean that the 2001-2005(?) Octavia vRS would end up as the best car Skoda will ever make?...if so they should hold their value! (damn...why did i sell mine again?.... )

[rich1068]

Sorry guys, didn't mean to cause any offence, actually I like diesels but like my petrol too. A choice would be a good thing but it may not come to that.

I wasn't having a go at diesel drivers, I would just prefer to drive a petrol. I know diesels have come on leaps and bounds in the last few years especially the VAG units but they're just not for me.

[usico]

I think it would be a bold move if they produced a diesel only vRS - it would be a bit of a ground breaker in this segment. however, while the case for the Furby vRS to burn oil is strong - lower overall running costs coupled to a younger customer base - I'm not convinced about the Octy. The mid-size owners have a tendancy to be, shall we say more conservative. Look at the designs of all the cars in this sector - not exactly avant-garde! If it's produced it will sell but will it sell well enough? In this sector a two pronged attack would probably be safer.

The age of the perfomance diesel is well and truly upon us but petrol isn't going to disappear overnight? I vote for a peaceful co-existance! :cheers:

[DGW]

A 180bhp diesel 4X4 would suit me fine, but the thought of the same engine in a vRS leaves me cold. If I was looking for an Octavia-sized car with a Rally Sport image - the latter an ephemeral concept which resides purely in the imagination of the buyer - I for one would not be considering a diesel. Period.

[Kentish]

I have to disagree on the age thing.

Most of us here learnt to drive in a petrol, when diesel were in buses, tractors and lorries and were cack. Diesels now are quick, a lot lighter, quieter pack a real punch dont need constant servicing and more importantly are more common amongst the private nuyer, company car driver and more importantly the driving schools.

Now taking the line that what you grow up with will colour your life judgement do you not think that there will be a lot of young new drivers who have learnt in a diesel, will know of its ability and will not be coloured by a petrol bias?

Personally I think the diesel is becomming the engine of development, for economy, enviroment and performance requirements and will over the next few years be the major player on these fields, especially when you look at how its sales figures are growing, not only here but Europe as a whole.

I wonder how things would be if the first diesel race cars that did so well when they entered the Indy 500 all those years ago, and were banned because they did so well and werent petrol?

[usico]

Andy, perhaps I didn't put my point very well - what I mean is that it is the younger buyers are probably more receptive to a performance diesel at the moment. As you quite rightly say, lots of them are learning in punchy diesels and liking them. Convincing some people who hasn't driven one in 20 years is obviously going to be a little harder!

BTW - I have driven diesels and like 'em! Lurv my vRS though...

[Kentish]

Andy' date=' perhaps I didn't put my point very well - what I mean is that it is the younger buyers are probably more receptive to a performance diesel at the moment. As you quite rightly say, lots of them are learning in punchy diesels and liking them. Convincing some people who hasn't driven one in 20 years is obviously going to be a little harder!

BTW - I have driven diesels and like 'em! Lurv my vRS though...[/quote']

Yes I got the wrong end of the stick......Ok the older drivers are harder to persuade, but surely it will be the younger drivers who buy more cars, and if used to good diesels will actively look for them as new/used cars thus driving the demand for them even more.

[MonkeyHanger]

You'll never catch me spending my own money on a diesel.

Modern diesel cars are fine, but the fuel itself puts me off. Horrible slippy smelly stuff, petrol isnt much better, but at least it evaporates faster and doesnt just sit there waiting for a victim to slip over on it.

[Kentish]

You'll never catch me spending my own money on a diesel.

Modern diesel cars are fine' date=' but the fuel itself puts me off. Horrible slippy smelly stuff, petrol isnt much better, but at least it evaporates faster and doesnt just sit there waiting for a victim to slip over on it.[/quote']

I agree on the fuel thing, but the newer fuels are heaps better.....however I think I prefer that to the carconegic vapours of petrol.

[MonkeyHanger]

I agree on the fuel thing, but the newer fuels are heaps better.....however I think I prefer that to the carconegic vapours of petrol.

Umm, i think the "clean" diesel thing is a bit of a myth, its as bad as petrol.

[rich1068]

I don't keep up with these things so hold your horses with the flaming...

Don't diesels pollute more than modern petrols now? All that black smoke can't be good, if not for the environment then for our lungs. Aren't diesel fumes full of carcinogens? Fair enough petrol motors produce CO2 but aren't the particulates in diesel smoke harmful? I could be wrong but isn't a backlash against diesel in the offing?

Please form an orderly queue...

[FabiaTDi]

Hi Rich,

Modern diesels are usaully cleaner than petrols:

Diesels emit less Carbon dioxide, less carbon monoxide and less hydrocarbons and less nitrogen oxide over the lifespan of the car (NOx more than petrols when new).

Petrol engines produce particulates too, except you cant see them as they are a lot finer than with a diesel. Doesnt mean that either aren't potentially harmful in high concentrations though. :(

HTH

[Kentish]

The odour of diesel fuel is not carconegic, however petrol vapour is.

As regards particulates, yes diesel has a very obvious waste in the form of soot from the exhaust, however petrol particulates are finer and go deeper into the lungs.

As regards pollution wise, yes a petrol engine is cleaner for its first year of life, but after that the diesel is far cleaner.

[Dutch4x4]

To answer my own question - I think a diesel Octy vRS could be a huge hit as a company car, especially when chipped to, say, 220 hp, and what, 500 Nm of torque? Almost all Dutch company cars are diesels today, and a diesel car with a performance look and feel could crack this very competitive market.

For me, there would be a couple of things against it:

- diesels are more expensive to buy, hence as a company-car driver I would need to add more to my income before tax

- the sound of diesel engines still doesn't have any performance note

Apart from that, I don't have any objections in principle.

[Ant]

- the sound of diesel engines still doesn't have any performance note

..You've obviously not been in a BMW 330d or a VAG 2.5TDi? Both sound most un-diesel like, and make a very pleasing noise...

[MonkeyHanger]

..You've obviously not been in a BMW 330d ...

I've given 1 or 2 330D owners a good look at my rear numberplate though

[Neo_VR]

The odour of diesel fuel is not carconegic, however petrol vapour is.

But the smell of petrol is muuch more satisfying!!! :scrambles

[Dutch4x4]

..You've obviously not been in a BMW 330d or a VAG 2.5TDi? Both sound most un-diesel like, and make a very pleasing noise...

I haven't, and considering their price tag, I won't for quite some time to come either...