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Skoda Octavia Hatchback

1.9 TDI PD Elegance (2009) 5d DSG

List price £17,045

Fuel consumption 47 mpg

Price per litre 100.0p

1.8 TSI Elegance 5d

Change:

List price £15,925

Fuel consumption 40 mpg

Price per litre 90.7p

Price £

Extra cost to buy £1,120

Saving per 1000 miles £6.36

Miles to break even 176,180

Time to break even

at 12,000 miles per year 15 years

My point exactly

Blimey. That calculator is quite an eye-opener.

personally, i would only consider a diesel because of the high durability they have...

since i am not keeping my cars more that 2-3 years there is no need to buy a diesel compromising the fun, smoothness, refinement, quiet and resposiveness of a petrol engine...never mind the extra costs of servicing and buying the car in the first place....

however, i understand those who drive more than 25k-30k per year and keep their cars for ever....then it makes sense....

Durability is a bit of a non-issue these days, with regular maintenance and good care most cars from the last 10 years will last to the moon and back.

I've done it all - derv, turbo diesel, high-reving N/A petrols and turbo petrols. The diesels just do not cut it for flexibility, fun and noise.

As I've said before, there's very little in the MPG and emmisions anymore, and as proved above, unless you do mental mileage a year diesels do not work finacially. And if they work in that respect, what's the point?

Yea but if you don't take into account new prices, and you only buy used cars, how does the break even point look then?

traditionaly (80's and earlier) diesel was always cheaper and it also offered much better mpg so most of us think of it as the way forward.

with diesel costing nearly 10% more and mpg figures for petrol cars getting closer to diesel figures especially in the FSI and tfsi engine (dependant on driving style) economics is becoming less of an argument.

One thing I can say, you can tune a modern diesel for very little money and still see good mpg figures with the addition of a good tuning box.

tuning petrol cars is more expensive as there's always the initial outlay for remaps which arent cheap.

Yea but if you don't take into account new prices, and you only buy used cars, how does the break even point look then?

The (traditionally) higher resale of diesel isn't taken into account either.

Personally I like turbos. Petrol or diesel isn't as important, though I do also like doing 5-600 miles on a tank.

it seems petrol catches up with the economies of scale...and wins in the performance part...

lets say petrol wins 5-3 in the penalties....lol

I think I will probably go back to petrol, especially with high torque/high efficiency turbo petrol engines like the 1.8 TSI. They are cheaper than the Diesel versions, faster and make more sense wih the cheaper cost of petrol. I think that the high demand for Diesel has meant that we have reached the apex in terms of their popularity. I must confess that there are some cars where the Diesel, for me makes more sense than the Petrol ie the 320d/330d and the 5 series equivalents, but on the whole I would go back to petrol.

I would challenge the durability theory as well. Modern Diesel injection systems are very complex and, from what I have read, seem far more prone to failure than a petrol injecion system (I have heard of a lot of Derv injection failures but have never come across a petrol injection failure although it stands to reason that it does happen).

The thing that really puts me off though is he Particulate filter These cost a fortune if they get blocked and if your driving is mostly urban, it will probably become blocked sooner or later. If there is too much soot to be burnt off by a cycle trigger drive, you will have to replace it at severa hundred pounds. I love my Fabia VRS and I love Diesel torque but too many cons now.:thumbdwn:

I've been looking for a used car in the 5-6k bracket, 3-5 years old, sensible milage thats fairly quick and economical, so far I haven't found any petrol cars that can match the Skoda Fabia VRS.

50+ mpg combined, 130bhp, loads of torque

If I allow for the price of petrol, then a petrol equivelent would need to do around 45mpg, and be able to match the performance of the VRS.

So what petrol cars in my price range etc can do the above? Serious question as I'm open to suggestions.

I'd go with real figures, not manufacturers book figures.

Any chance you'll try a calculator that includes depreciation next time?

what about insurance costs into the bargain?

You can't really compare used prices at the moment, since the car market is f*cked still, hence why gadgetman has used list prices. Diesel cars generally will get a portion of their extra cost back at re-sale, but not the full amount.

And we may see this going down as they become less desirable and people start to get into the newer turbo-petrol cars which (as we have seen) are very nearly as efficient pure stats wise, but actually will end up costing less to run.

Insurance will change for whomever gets a quote for it, I fully expect that averaging out neither will be more expensive to insure.

If you vote petrol, you winner!

And?

If you get, say, half the premium back on resale, that means you only had to save half the quoted difference in retail, or put another way, the payback period is only half what the petrolheads claim!

Meantime, I'm still waiting for this mythical petrol engine that has 3.0l torque, 2.0l power, and 1.4l economy in real World driving.

And?

Meantime, I'm still waiting for this mythical petrol engine that has 3.0l torque, 2.0l power, and 1.4l economy in real World driving.

Well said.

I've always been into my fast petrols but found the need to change to a diesel 2 years ago due to spiraling housing costs and fuel costs.

Although it cost me approx £1.5k to change from my Octi vRS to my Octi TDi in the 1st year I had saved £600 in insurance and road tax leaving me £600 out of pocket but when you take my fuel costs into account for the 1st year I've saved another £1290 over running my old vRS.

TDi last 12 months I've averaged 51mpg with a cost of £1713 over 20k

vRS 26mpg (what I used to average doing the same journeys) cost £3003 over 20k

I know these figures don't cover depreciation but then the vRS would now only be worth about £3.5k and my TDi is now only worth about £3.5k (dealer prices found on Autotrader) and my TDi has depreciated a little more than the vrs has done in the last 2 years but the tdi still in front for money in my pocket every month, well it would if I didn't spend some of it modifying it but then I would have continued modifying the vrs so I don't count that cost.

Petrol vs Diesel = down to personal preferance and circumstance. I would love another Petrol Turbo again for the thrill of the drive and for the noise they make but my current TDi gives me most of the thrills of the vRS I had at a fraction of the cost and my current situation dictates I need to be a little carefull with money, once the kids have grown up and left home or if I can get a job closer to home or I win the lottery etc etc etc I will buy another Petrol Turbo.

"I would love another Petrol Turbo again for the noise they make "

My old Xantia made a noise not unlike a |, when I got the throttle setting right. IMO that, and the drumbeat of a Cricklewood Bentley, are as exciting as engine notes get!

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Skoda Octavia Hatchback

1.9 TDI PD Elegance (2009) 5d DSG

List price £17,045

Fuel consumption 47 mpg

Price per litre 100.0p

1.8 TSI Elegance 5d

Change:

List price £15,925

Fuel consumption 40 mpg

Price per litre 90.7p

Price £

Extra cost to buy £1,120

Saving per 1000 miles £6.36

Miles to break even 176,180

Time to break even

at 12,000 miles per year 15 years

Try taking the DSG out of the equation and see if it is more expensive?

Bout the same difs as the Mondeo is.

I deliberately selected DSG due to the must have factor when anyone mentions buying

Bout the same difs as the Mondeo is.

I deliberately selected DSG due to the must have factor when anyone mentions buying

And? The point is that, if you fit it to one and not the other you're not comparing like with like, or perhaps I should claim that an A4 SDi disproves the claim that diesel isn't worth having to save money because it costs several grand less than a vRS?

O.k my final view on this is that the Diesel for me is a nicer day to day drive because of its superior torque. I have a Renault Megane 1.6 on 24 hour test at the moment and it has 111 bhp compared to my VRS' 130 so only 19 BHP difference. In comparison however it feels totally gutless as I have to rev the nuts off it to get it to go. Having said that when I want to enjoy myself a Diesel doesn't give ultimate satisfaction because of it's limited rev range and the fact that no Diesel that I have driven had really encouraged you to rev it. Modern Diesels are also very complicated: lovely when they work but cost a fortune when they go wrong, especially with DPFs. The fact that they normally cost more than petrol and that the fuel is more expensive means that you have to think hard.

I like the sound of VWs 1.4 122BHP Turbo. Has anyone driven it?, Does it offer a good compromise?:confused:

And? The point is that, if you fit it to one and not the other you're not comparing like with like, or perhaps I should claim that an A4 SDi disproves the claim that diesel isn't worth having to save money because it costs several grand less than a vRS?

Ok 1.8 DSG v 2.0 TDI DSG - the only trim level listed with DSG in derv and petrol

Skoda Octavia Hatchback

1.8 TSI Laurin + Klement 5d DSG

List price£19,885 Fuel consumption42 mpg Price per litre91.6p

2.0 TDI PD Laurin + Klement (2009) 5d DSG

Change: 1.9 TDI PD S 5d 1.9 TDI PD S 5d Auto 1.9 TDI PD SE 5d 1.9 TDI PD SE 5d DSG 2.0 TDI PD SE 5d 1.9 TDI PD Elegance (2009) 5d 1.9 TDI PD Elegance (2009) 5d DSG 2.0 TDI PD Elegance (2009) 5d 2.0 TDI PD Elegance (2009) 5d DSG 2.0 TDI PD Laurin + Klement (2009) 5d 2.0 TDI PD Laurin + Klement (2009) 5d DSG

List price£21,375 Fuel consumption47 mpg Price per litre100.0p

If you have negotiated a discount from list price, enter the prices here to use them in the calculation.

Price£

Price£

Extra cost to buy£1,490 Saving per 1000 miles£2.42 Miles to break even615,019 Time to break even

at 12,000 miles per year51 years

Lol - diesel fail!

Given the choice I'd take a turbo petrol over a turbo diesel any day...