Lorry Shield on 50 MPH Average Speed Zones

[My_Yeti]

Was driving along the M1 tonight and was surprised about how many people were doing well over 60 mph! No idea how they get away with it.

Anyway, it got me thinking, if I was in the middle lane, next to a fairly large lorry (Waitrose seems to have very tall ones), would I get snapped?

Also if I was in the outside lane (the one separated from the second and third lane, on the other side of the carriage way), do I get snapped?

Edited 7 May, 2012 by My_Yeti

[Mike Wrightson]

Maybe they don't get away with it

if it's a proper average speed zone with specs cameras, there is a cam for each lane, so no matter which one you are in you'll get snapped.

[Babs]

You'd get snapped.

[My_Yeti]

Interesting, there are three cameras, how about if the scenario is that you are on the outside lane (essentially on the other side of the motorway, separate from lane 2 and 3)? I always keep to the limit, as I know there is no point taking a chance, knowing that there are cameras about!

[silver1011]

A work colleague of mine commuted through the 50mph average speed camera roadworks on the A1 near Wetherby most week days for almost two years.

He claims to have gradually increased his speed over a period of time, to a point at one stage whereby he was 'substantially' over the limit for the full length of the restriction and never got a ticket.

Maybe some are used as more of a deterrent rather than actually working?

[Raf_]

A work colleague of mine commuted through the 50mph average speed camera roadworks on the A1 near Wetherby most week days for almost two years.

He claims to have gradually increased his speed over a period of time, to a point at one stage whereby he was 'substantially' over the limit for the full length of the restriction and never got a ticket.

Maybe some are used as more of a deterrent rather than actually working?

Got any proof of that? Brother inlaw got a 3 months ban for speeding on that stretch, 6th person in court that day for the same reason.

[silver1011]

Other than his word no but I know this guy well enough to know he's not the sort to willy wave about speeding...

[XLBaconDoubleCheese]

I dont know if its still possible, but you use to be able to just switch lanes at each set of cameras. I dont know how the camera would see through a lorry to snap you in the scenario put? Care to explain?

[zach1301]

I dont know if its still possible, but you use to be able to just switch lanes at each set of cameras. I dont know how the camera would see through a lorry to snap you in the scenario put? Care to explain?

was just about to say this... was reported on top gear a while ago... but the government strongly advised against it... i have no problem with these 50mph speed rescriction... the 1.6tdi engine loves them... massive MPG results.. ha

[Babs]

I dont know if its still possible, but you use to be able to just switch lanes at each set of cameras. I dont know how the camera would see through a lorry to snap you in the scenario put? Care to explain?

was just about to say this... was reported on top gear a while ago... but the government strongly advised against it... i have no problem with these 50mph speed rescriction... the 1.6tdi engine loves them... massive MPG results.. ha

This would work only assuming that you know which cameras are "paired"...

If you had 6 cameras they could be like:

1 2 3 4 5 6

Or they could be:

1 2 3 4 5 6

You don't know

[ScoobyChris]

I dont know if its still possible, but you use to be able to just switch lanes at each set of cameras.

Ironically, the cameras had no trouble processing traffic that moved lanes (after all the camera just reads a reg plate and sends it to the backing computer which does all the work) but the problem was that they had not been type-approved to do so and as such you couldn't be prosecuted. That loophole was closed fairly quickly.

I dont know how the camera would see through a lorry to snap you in the scenario put? Care to explain?

I think you're right on this - the camera needs a clear line of sight to the number plate and if it doesn't have that, it's not going to be able to read it. Similarly if you're driving 2" from the bumper of the car in front, it will also have issues reading it.

Chris

[Aspman]

There used to be a glitch with the SPECS cameras (yellow vultures) that if you exited the average zone in a different lane to the one you entered it wouldn't read your speed. Long since fixed.

I find them intensly irritating to drive in. I seriously doubt that AVE speed cameras are in any way safe because you spend so much time looking at the speedo not where you are going.

Much easier with the CC on but you still have to deal with other people driving +-1mph of you.

I assume the average that is recorded is pretty generous in favour of the driver else everyone would get nicked.

MPG? Got 42mpg going to Glasgow through their roadworks the other year. highest ever. Boring as hell.

[Phil-E]

Is it really worth the risk!?

I know it wouldn't be for me. Just stick to 50! It is, afterall, 50 mph for a reason!!!!!!

[Beryl's Chief Pilot]

My Osteopath drove through spec cameras at illegal speeds every day on his commute, always changed lanes, never got an NIP ......... untill one day he forgot to change lanes & immediately got prosecuted.

Personally, I don't think it's worth the risk, I just stick the cruise on at 50 & watch the mpg climb high!

[Dan1720v]

When I'm in the car I'll stick to about 55 in them. in the truck, I dont come off the limiter. And one of the trucks we have does a steady 59 and that never gave me any issues. I have studied how theyre set up, and majority of the time, in my experience, they're only focused on the outer 2 lanes.

[rwbaldwin]

Ironically, the cameras had no trouble processing traffic that moved lanes (after all the camera just reads a reg plate and sends it to the backing computer which does all the work) but the problem was that they had not been type-approved to do so and as such you couldn't be prosecuted.  That loophole was closed fairly quickly.

I think you're right on this - the camera needs a clear line of sight to the number plate and if it doesn't have that, it's not going to be able to read it.  Similarly if you're driving 2" from the bumper of the car in front, it will also have issues reading it.

Chris

+1

With higher resolution cameras and better image processing, you would have to be right on the bumper of a tall lorry to avoid getting logged. Some camera nodes have a single video camera pointing the other way. It doesn't take part in speed measurement but can be used to see what is happening to 'VTOLs' (vehicles logged enter a zone but are missing from subsequent logs). I'm not sure if they can be used to prosecute tailgaters, but I don't see why not.

You would also avoid all the subsequent cameras. With accurate time standards (usually GPS) the camera nodes report NP/time pairs to a central control node. If there are five camera nodes, half a mile apart, it can calculate speed between camera nodes 0/1, 1/2, 0/2, 1/4 or any camera node pair

[Padrino]

One other interesting point is that the cameras read your front plate ONLY, so this is one of the reason for Bike guys to not give a $hitt about it

(At least all the one here in Scotland that measure ave speed)

[Moist Von Lipwig]

Is it really worth the risk!?

I know it wouldn't be for me. Just stick to 50! It is, afterall, 50 mph for a reason!!!!!!

I'm not sure that there always is a valid reason. I have seen stretches where they have just applied a blanket limit on the off chance a workman might possibly be working at some time in the future!

One other interesting point is that the cameras read your front plate ONLY, so this is one of the reason for BikIe guys to not give a $hitt about it

(At least all the one here in Scotland that measure ave speed)

I believe that the only rear facing SPECS are in the paeks on Snake's Pass, specifically for the bikers. There was an issue initially with an alternate route between them being shorter but now fixed as I understand it.

I'm sure I have seen somewhere a few years ago about a forward facing camera where bikers used to fly past and some did get tracked down and prosectued!

I hate the average zones as you have to concentrate on the speed so much, rather than has been said concentrating on the road, and getting lorries sitting on their limiter right up your a**e initimidating people!

[Dan1720v]

What frustrates us lorry drivers, is cars come hurtling past you, just as it changes to 50, slam on the brakes and pull in front. Thanks. Now I have to drop 3/4 gears because of that little stunt. Another thing. If Your doing 50, and so is lane 1, get your arse into lane 1. Your not over taking anything so get over. And let the faster traffic through.

[Hannibal]

The biggest problem I have with them is when it come to changing lanes. As so often happens all 3 lanes are doing 50 or as near as makes no odds and either you want the next exit or worse still someones been sitting in your blind spot for the last 5 mins and the lane you're is leaving the motorway.

The fact that they mean there is no longer a significant speed differential between the lanes makes them dangerous IMO.

[taff170]

What frustrates us lorry drivers, is cars come hurtling past you, just as it changes to 50, slam on the brakes and pull in front. Thanks. Now I have to drop 3/4 gears because of that little stunt. Another thing. If Your doing 50, and so is lane 1, get your arse into lane 1. Your not over taking anything so get over. And let the faster traffic through.

Why?

Are you lorry drivers special?

If its a fifty limit do fifty like everyone else!

Also try not to sit 2 inch off my bumper if that's not too much trouble, oh and also at slip roads foooking move to the middle lane if it's clear!!!

If the speed limit was set at 60MPH Then it would stop the idiot lorry drivers doing this and causing accidents as they are "allegedly" set at a 55MPH limit.

Edited 8 May, 2012 by taff170

[My_Yeti]

I agree with lane hogging, lane 2 and 3 should always be for overtaking, if someone is doing 55mph in lane 1, why is there someone doing 50 in lane 2, so annoying!

Something else I don't understand is people would do way above 50 mph on these average speed areas, yet stick to 65 mph when coming off it, what's the logic in that (except for perhaps fuel saving)?

[silver1011]

Keep left if not overtaking.

Just because the limit is 50mph instead of 70mph doesn't give you the excuse to sit in lane 3 doing 50mph.

Nor is it your job to prevent people speeding. If someone wants to do 60mph+ let them get on with it and move over...

[XLBaconDoubleCheese]

If everyone sat in the inside lane and left the outside lanes empty I think it's be very congested lol.

[taff170]

Keep left if not overtaking.

Just because the limit is 50mph instead of 70mph doesn't give you the excuse to sit in lane 3 doing 50mph.

Nor is it your job to prevent people speeding. If someone wants to do 60mph+ let them get on with it and move over...

If your doing fifty in the middle lane and there is a vehicle doing the same in the inside lane how are you supposed to move over?

Speed up and get a fine, slow down and get squashed by the artic that's been 2 inch off your bumper.

No, I'll do neither they can just be patient like everyone else.