2012 247bhp Focus ST to 2014 181bhp Octy vRS

[oobster]

Chaps,

 

Considering going from my 2012 Focus ST-3 (250ps/247bhp and 360Nm/270lb/ft torque) and approx. kerb weight of 1437Kg to a 2014 Skoda Octavia TDI CI vRS.

 

I used to have a vRS approx. 3 years ago, a 2010 Petrol DSG hatch that had been Shark-mapped to approx. 250bhp, but I am concerned that I will feel a considerable drop in power from my current Focus ST to the diesel vRS.

 

The figures for the Diesel VRS are, I believe, 184ps/181bhp and 380Nm/280lb/ft torque so more torque but less bhp. Kerb weight is 1,395Kg from what i've been able to ascertain, so slightly lighter than the Focus.

 

What do you helpful and knowledgeable people think - will I feel a night-and-day difference in power, or should the small weight drop + increase in torque make up for the drop in bhp?

 

Because the vRS is almost new I won't be mapping it if/when I buy it - don't want any warranty issues.

 

Ta!

 

Andy

[Greg R]

I think you already know the answer. The vrs isn't going to be anywhere near as quick as the focus. The best thing to suggest is to drive one, preferably on extended test

Snet with speeling mistkaes from my phoen

[Telboy5]

Focus ST would be around 171 BHP/tonne & 167flbt/tonne

 

Diesel VRS would be around 130BHP/tonne & 202flbt/tonne,....roughly

 

Real world, not huge although the ST would feel quicker initially, in gear, not so sure though??

 

As Greg has mentioned, extended test drive might be worth it or even try the TSI VRS which is 163BHP/tonne & 191flbt/tonne and still returns 40mpg+ in stock form!

 

I use my TSI for work, do 20k miles + per annum, regularity achieve 40mpg+ on long trips, long term average of 36mpg and mine is mapped to 330bhp/368flbt giving it a 241BHP/tonne & 260flbt/tonne     

[Orville]

Simple answer is that the ST is quicker by a fair margin in terms of performance and handling.

The VRS on the other hand is better built, much more spacious, far less common, and nippy enough for most occasions. Nobody knows better than Ford how to build a fun to drive hot-hatch.

[Greg R]

My wife's previous car was a focus st220, remapped to 280bhp.. It was epic fun and way quicker than a diesel vrs. Her current car is a leon fr tdi remapped to 210 bhp. It's entertaining to drive but it's certainly not as much fun as a more powerful petrol turbo. The only way to know if you can live with it would be to try one out.

Snet with speeling mistkaes from my phoen

[TonyD]

Just spec'd up an ST estate against an Octavia VRS petrol and for same spec; the focus was £4K cheaper! However it doesn't have the diff of the 230. I may be on the turn after 6 years with Skoda

[toni8b]

I use my TSI for work, do 20k miles + per annum, regularity achieve 40mpg+ on long trips, long term average of 36mpg and mine is mapped to 330bhp/368flbt giving it a 241BHP/tonne & 260flbt/tonne     

 

You must be really lucky ten.

 

I as see here, average is 30mpg: http://www.spritmonitor.de/en/overview/45-Skoda/399-Octavia.html?fueltype=2&constyear_s=2013&power_s=220&power_e=220&minkm=&gearing=2&sort=3&powerunit=2 and that are not even a mapped cars.

 

I get 40mpg on my lousy car..

[Telboy5]

You must be really lucky ten.

 

I as see here, average is 30mpg: http://www.spritmonitor.de/en/overview/45-Skoda/399-Octavia.html?fueltype=2&constyear_s=2013&power_s=220&power_e=220&minkm=&gearing=2&sort=3&powerunit=2 and that are not even a mapped cars.

 

I get 40mpg on my lousy car..

No luck involved at all mate.

 

I enjoy my car don't get me wrong, and when I do, the mpg does take a hit, however when I use it for work, I drive it sensibly and within the limits and do long journeys.

 

Either way, still achieving a long term of 36mpg with over 40mpg on the long runs.

 

My point was to the OP, doesn't always have to be a diesel, petrol VRS is plenty quick enough and can still be economical enough for most.

[pipsyp]

Even mapped the vRS probably wont be quite as quick as the ST.

Unless you're considering moving back to a diesel as a money saving exercise I wouldnt bother as it will be a comedown from the performance of the ST. In stock form the vRS TDI is in isolation still quite a quick car but will feel v lethargic compared to a 250ps turbo petrol.

My 2p's worth....if you are considering a vRS at all why not a TSI? You could get the Shark tuning box for it (developed in partnership with DTUK....I think DTUK supplied the hardware and Shark the map for it), wouldnt technically affect your warranty and would give you 300ish HP to play with.

Otherwise have you considered a facelift Focus ST TDCi. Ford diesel engines have always been very good and Id wager the 185ps motor is probably rather punchy and just about deserving of the ST badging. Im not personally a big Ford fan myself but it probably is in isolation a better drivers car than the vRS TDI.

[Telboy5]

Even mapped the vRS probably wont be quite as quick as the ST.

Unless you're considering moving back to a diesel as a money saving exercise I wouldnt bother as it will be a comedown from the performance of the ST. In stock form the vRS TDI is in isolation still quite a quick car but will feel v lethargic compared to a 250ps turbo petrol.

My 2p's worth....if you are considering a vRS at all why not a TSI? You could get the Shark tuning box for it (developed in partnership with DTUK....I think DTUK supplied the hardware and Shark the map for it), wouldnt technically affect your warranty and would give you 300ish HP to play with.

Otherwise have you considered a facelift Focus ST TDCi. Ford diesel engines have always been very good and Id wager the 185ps motor is probably rather punchy and just about deserving of the ST badging. Im not personally a big Ford fan myself but it probably is in isolation a better drivers car than the vRS TDI.

My point exactly,...

 

As I mentioned already to the OP, would be worth considering the TSI which is as quick stock at the ST, however slightly more economical.

[JPH0091]

If this is  aquestion of performances, there is really no question.

 

Duel : Ford Focus III ST vs Skoda Octavia III RS 2.0 TDi

[oobster]

Thing is, i've seen a ex-demo vRS TDI fairly close to me that is for sale, colour and spec is exactly what I was looking for, apart from the TDI bit!

[Telboy5]

If this is  aquestion of performances, there is really no question.

 

Duel : Ford Focus III ST vs Skoda Octavia III RS 2.0 TDi

I'm pretty sure the OP didn't need that to answer his question, bit obvious really when you think about it   

[Telboy5]

Thing is, i've seen a ex-demo vRS TDI fairly close to me that is for sale, colour and spec is exactly what I was looking for, apart from the TDI bit!

I suppose it boils down to the why??

 

Why go TDI and get rid of the ST?

[Greg R]

Id love a petrol turbo again and it would be a toss up between ST, cupra and vrs. However, as it's a company lease car, petrol engine is really out of the equation. They are significantly more expensive to lease (i did ask) and would also cost me more in mpg and tax. Hence, diesel is the only real option for me.

Snet with speeling mistkaes from my phoen

[JPH0091]

I'm pretty sure the OP didn't need that to answer his question, bit obvious really when you think about it   

Obviously.

On the other hand, until it was put on the table, no one really tried to address how someone could ask the initial question?

[Carlosramdango]

After reading this thread I decided to look at the ST3 TDCI on-line to see what price you could potentially get it for.

 

The best price is £19405 from autoebid a saving of over £8000 on the list price, this doesn't seem possible for a car that has only just been released. If I hadn't committed to the two year lease deal for the 

VRS TDI from Simpsons then I would seriously consider the ST3 if indeed I could get it for the price listed.

[BigLee]

Good site that

 

  vRS TSI vs TDi

Duel : Skoda Octavia III RS 2.0 TDi vs Skoda Octavia III Combi RS 2.0 TSi

 

 

vRS TSI vs ST

 

Nothing in it

 

Duel : Ford Focus III ST vs Skoda Octavia III Combi RS 2.0 TSi

[adambrownb]

I've just ordered a VRS estate diesel and I'm coming from a re-mapped ST-2 (running about 260bhp).  I know the power won't be the same when it arrives but I think the overall package is nicer.  I think I will remap the VRs though and the torque should still make it feel quite punchy but still unable to compete with the raw power of the ST.  Although it won't make you smile as much it will be easier on your bank balance....

[oobster]

Cheers folks, mind is made up now, not going to go for the vRS I seen.

 

Is/was a nice one too - yellow manual hatch with black pack, tints, canton, leather, satnav,19" alloys etc. Only option it didn't have, which I would have liked, was KESSY.

 

I'll keep looking, ST is now 2.5yrs old and although there is nothing wrong with it I fancy something new.

[swany]

alright Obste. I'm in the same boat,i previously had 3 vrs cars over the years and was tempted to the dark side of a st3 estate with the mountune upgrade (275bhp) but after a year i'm thinking of coming back to Skoda purely for the performance to economy. octavia is not as punchy as st by a fair bit but at 220bhp for petrol and getting 40mpg and more it makes sense to change back. love the Focus but it doesnt feel as if it has the same build quality either

[neiln]

I don't know how telboy achieves over 40mpg. It must be very very sedate driving, well done.  My long term average is 36mpg but over a whole tank I've never quite managed 40mpg, very very close, but never yet, even with a common weekend being south London to Chester and back on the tank, 360 miles of which is motorway or A51.  OK I tend to cruise at about 80 if the motorway isn't busy, and the A road is a chance to enjoy the car a little... Plus the 15 miles each way through the centre of town pulls the average down. However in town I drive like miss daisy and often manage 30 or more mpg.   

I think the tsi is OK on mpg, but I take my hat off to Telboy!

[Telboy5]

I don't know how telboy achieves over 40mpg. It must be very very sedate driving, well done.  My long term average is 36mpg but over a whole tank I've never quite managed 40mpg, very very close, but never yet, even with a common weekend being south London to Chester and back on the tank, 360 miles of which is motorway or A51.  OK I tend to cruise at about 80 if the motorway isn't busy, and the A road is a chance to enjoy the car a little... Plus the 15 miles each way through the centre of town pulls the average down. However in town I drive like miss daisy and often manage 30 or more mpg.   

I think the tsi is OK on mpg, but I take my hat off to Telboy!

 

I do a lot of miles, motorway too. Before remap the best journey mpg I achieved was actually 50.3mpg from Bournemouth to Manchester!!

 

When I drive for work I do drive sensibly as I can often make money on the journey.

 

It is really hard to not use all the power I have and I often have to reign myself in, a lot of self control needed, however when I do press the go pedal it is really hard not to enjoy that for while     

 

Others have achieved 40mpg with ease, however don't get me wrong, the TSI, like the ST, is a car to enjoy - which I do a fair bit!!

[Diango]

Even mapped the vRS probably wont be quite as quick as the ST.

 

 

No, but mapped you can easily get 500+ newtonmeters of torque from the TDI vRS and that is a nice lump of torque to do some serious motorway miles. I can live with a few horsepower less if that means I can pull like a tugboat .

[D@z]

just to chime in here, having gone from my 2.0 TSI VRS at stage 2 (295hp, 330lbft) to a TDI 150 Elegance, my reason for doing so was a money saving excercise, as I had my fun and wanted to divert funds to other things, so the question is really, do you want to save money or keep driving a performance car?
personally, I dont miss it that much as I had begun to realise I was really only using the car to drive to work and back and chances to enjoy the performance were few and far between.