Two Dacias in the top ten of cheapest cars to run....

 

Loving the Logan (TCE 0.9T-Laureate) does everything so well, but do like to run the Jag out now and then but nice to pocket all the savings on the Dacia to fund other things.

 

 

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-reviews/62858/cheapest-cars-run

 

Top 10 cheapest cars to run in the UK

Click the tabs (above left) to find out more about these models.

1. 1. Suzuki Celerio 1.0 SZ2 5dr
2. 2. Peugeot 108 Hatchback 1.0 Access
3. 3. Dacia Sandero 1.5 dCi Ambiance 5dr
4. 4. Toyota Aygo 1.0 VVT-I X 3dr
5. 5. Vauxhall Viva 1.0 SE 5dr
6. 6. Citroen C1 1.0 VTi Touch 3dr
7. 7. Nissan Micra 1.2 Visia Limited
8. 8. Ssangyong Tivoli 1.6 D SE 5dr
9. 9. Dacia Logan MCV 1.5 dCi Ambiance 5dr
10. 10. Kia Picanto 1.0 65 1 3dr

Odd,

if it is based on VED, MPG, Servicing costs then were is the Up!MiiCitigo's or Fords Ka or Fiesta?

Does the What Car Car of the year 2015 & What Car Small car of the year 2016, the All New Fabia not get a look in?

Odd,

if it is based on VED, MPG, Servicing costs then were is the Up!MiiCitigo's or Fords Ka or Fiesta?

Does the What Car Car of the year 2015 & What Car Small car of the year 2016, the All New Fabia not get a look in?

 

It is based on total cost of ownership as calculated as to how many pence per miles it costs ie 23, 24,25 ppm I gather.

 

So depreciation, servicing costs and all the are key.  Fiesta is an expensive car unless you get the 30% or so off them that some do ie people who know people who work at the various Ford plants etc.  If you pay anywhere near full price, find out it is worth about a third of that full price three years down the line it works out quite expensive in terms of the depreciation.   Fabia also pretty expensive, not the two thirds of a Polo it use to be more like 90%. In general it seems like you can get much more off the RRP of a SEAT than a Skoda, "Simply expensive" for a car made in Eastern Europe, allbeit very well put together if not a bit fugly as they do not want to many people buying Skodas instead of Audis and VWs, usually.     

Edited 18 May, 201610 yr by lol-lol

As regards the perceived superior reliability of VAG group cars it is Honest John's opinion that it is a myth and that they are no more reliable than the rest.I know that his pontifications are not universally appreciated on this forum but he does have some evidence to back his utterances.

Just my experience, but yes.

 

35 years of car ownership, 7 cars. Current Skoda is the newest, most expensive, most pampered and least reliable car I have ever owned. Funny thing is I bought it (at 3 years 30 000 miles),partly because the fuel bills for my 20 year old Saab 900 turbo were getting to be too much, but in large part because of it's reputation for reliability - particularly the 'bullet proof' 1.9 PD.

 

Safety, price, value, residuals, economy, special deals, performance, spec, aesthetics, equipment, image - without reliability none of these matter as you don't have a car.

 

Skoda and the entire VAG have been resting on their laurels for too long but are now being found out.

Think how far back you have to go to find a VAG group engine without 'issues'

Just my experience, but yes.

 

35 years of car ownership, 7 cars. Current Skoda is the newest, most expensive, most pampered and least reliable car I have ever owned. Funny thing is I bought it (at 3 years 30 000 miles),partly because the fuel bills for my 20 year old Saab 900 turbo were getting to be too much, but in large part because of it's reputation for reliability - particularly the 'bullet proof' 1.9 PD.

 

Safety, price, value, residuals, economy, special deals, performance, spec, aesthetics, equipment, image - without reliability none of these matter as you don't have a car.

 

Skoda and the entire VAG have been resting on their laurels for too long but are now being found out.

Think how far back you have to go to find a VAG group engine without 'issues'

 

Pretty much in to the noughties they were good and then grabbed defeat fromt he jaws of vicotry.  

Yes the 1.9D, it is various forms was fantastic. The various petrol engines right through are good as well I have found.

 

The 2 litre CR diesel, the switch from the excellent PD tech to the Common Rail (CR) technology, the engine counterbalancing the emissions tech (or lack of it) made both the 2 litre diesel and the 1.6D feel like a complete wrong turn had been taken.   The fuel consumption seem to take a dive by 5-10 mpg for an engine that slower when we had both the 130 hp 1.9PD and 140 hp  CR 2 litre.  The 1.6D could do upper 60s mpg if you did not press the throttle down more than a third and if you drive it like you wanted to hustle on  it could turn in less than 50 mpg.   Strangely it did seem to match the 7 speed DSG rather well though as it masked many of the issues.

 

VW have been late to arrive at the 3 cylinder turbo petrol when Ford, GM, Peugeot and Renault have exploited it.  The pricing gap between Skoda and VW/Audi has sometimes been so small that considering residual values have a Skoda of the last 5 years has been very questionable. Also the way Skoda UK has treated its dealer network, concentrating on larger franchises that they can force to take clearance stock has seen them down at the bottom of the dealership feedback. 

 

Hence the change in having moved to Dacia/Renault.  We are awaiting a raft of new features on Dacias ie automatics and the new turbo petrol on the Dacia and in combination with the pricing Skoda is yesterdays leader in the value of automotive sales.  VAG tried so hard to be the world's largest auto firm, used illegal tactics to get there and are now reaping what the sowed and more.  

Edited 22 May, 201610 yr by lol-lol

 

Yes the 1.9D, it is various forms was fantastic.

 

Think this only applies to earlier ones, please be assured that by the time they got to the BXE it was very very far from fantastic.

Bizarrely the issues we have experienced with VW cars in the past (wife's Lupo and Polo) were always electrical. Windows, central locking and sunroofs regularly mucked up. Now my sunroof has packed up on my 3.6.....annoying (otherwise car has been faultless).

Think this only applies to earlier ones, please be assured that by the time they got to the BXE it was very very far from fantastic.

There was nothing wrong with my MK2 Octavia with the BXE in the 7 years and 70K of ownership. Never had any problems at all. Just routine servicing.

Siemens PD injectors were problematic apparently

http://www.vwwatercooled.com.au/forums/f28/103kw-125kw-tdi-pd-piezo-siemens-injector-failure-thread-54215.html

Think this only applies to earlier ones, please be assured that by the time they got to the BXE it was very very far from fantastic.

 

Had the 1.9D in the Fabia VRS Mk1, Superb Mk1, Octavia Mk 1 L&K, Octavia Mk 2, Audi A3 and and A4 and probably did around 300k miles in these cars.   Had one turbo failure in the 1.9D at 65K miles which Audi did replace at their cost despite their poxy 60K warranty policy as the car was less than 2 years old.

 

Dacia only do a 60K warranty but Renault is 100K like most decent manufacturers and I would expect Dacia to maybe go to 100k in a couple of years time.

 

I tended to have bought a supplementary warranty if a car is outside the manufacturers one and buy cars with good histories.  Also avoid cars with turbos one over 6 years old hence I still have the Fabia HTP and Jaaag, not much to go wrong a cheap to fix if does.  With a 7 year old plus car, anything up to £4K value, you have to be prepared to chuck it away or do an engine change from the scappers, better to have a cheap non-turbo which is simple to fix if it catastrophically fails or buy one of the cheap Dacias with a 3 year 60K warranty and have no worries!   

^^^^like the average Cuban car.

The rest are now white goods today

Call me odd if you wish, but I do like the appearance of the Duster, and I believe it's not to be sniffed at off road either in 4WD guise.

Not a Defender obviously, but still very worthy apparently.

I would go petrol 2 wheel drive put they do not do it with Aircon sadly.

 

 

 

Edited 23 May, 201610 yr by lol-lol

There was nothing wrong with my MK2 Octavia with the BXE in the 7 years and 70K of ownership. Never had any problems at all. Just routine servicing.

That's the point, have to admit some of my early cars had a fairly tough time with servicing and maintenance as and when finances/facilities/weather/other commitments allowed - exhausts were repaired with tin cans, scrapyards were my parts store etc. but this has had regular servicing and a comparatively pampered existence.

 

lol-lol has a point about turbos though. Despite the fact that they became mainstream, and were considered to be reliable many years ago, in reality they and all their associated sensors and actuators are still not reliable. Amazing then that VAG in their wisdom came up with the direct injection, turbo charged and supercharged engine - imagine the meeting - 'right how much trouble can we build into one engine', pity the folk trying to keep this marvel of technology going in its autumn years.

That's the point, have to admit some of my early cars had a fairly tough time with servicing and maintenance as and when finances/facilities/weather/other commitments allowed - exhausts were repaired with tin cans, scrapyards were my parts store etc. but this has had regular servicing and a comparatively pampered existence.

 

lol-lol has a point about turbos though. Despite the fact that they became mainstream, and were considered to be reliable many years ago, in reality they and all their associated sensors and actuators are still not reliable. Amazing then that VAG in their wisdom came up with the direct injection, turbo charged and supercharged engine - imagine the meeting - 'right how much trouble can we build into one engine', pity the folk trying to keep this marvel of technology going in its autumn years.

 

Funny thing is that one of the main reasons that turbocharge cars were introduced was that their fuel consumption, when fully warmed up after several miles, is several miles per gallon further.

 

In reality, considering that most of our journeys are less than ten miles, the true MPG is almost always the highest percentage difference on these turbocharged cars, particularly turbo-diesels, as they take such a larger percentage of their journey warming up to operating temperature that their MPG for shortish journeys is often 25% or worse different than the published figures where as the small cc no-turbo is often within 10%.

 

The Dacia/Renault engine 1.2 16v in the Sandero/Logan, is actually 102%, there actually under reporting it according to Honest John I think it was. Also the 0.9 litre 3 cylinder turbo petrol version of the Logan/Sandero get close to published MPG as it warms up quickly but can cruise at indicated 80 mph as it has the tall gearing and torque to do so.  Odd the Ford ecoboost engine does not get so close to published mpg it is reported, seen figures for the new 3 cylinder VAG engine  which was only showing 79% which is dissapointing if not that surprising considering more recent VAG mis-truths.  

After 3 months I have now had time to appraise the relative merits of the wife's Dacia (Sandero Stepway) compared to my Seat (Rapid posing as Toledo). Bear in mind that the Dacia was a pre reg with delivery miles and the top model at £8700 and it is possible to obtain the Toledo Style Advanced top model pre reg at £12000.The Dacia is more fun to drive with a better ride than the Toledo.The steering on the Dacia is not very fluid and the throttle response leaves something to be desired.Amazingly the boot cannot be opened with the central locking and the power window switches are in awkward places.The Dacia,s brakes at low speed are "lethal" just like a switch either off or on The 900cc turbo petrol engine is excellent with plenty of torque/power although, being 3. cylinder, not as smooth as the Toledo.The interior space is limited compared to the Toledo but it is also  a size smaller.The Toledo engine ( 110 ps) is smooth and powerful and,surprisingly,has the edge on mpg at present although the Dacia engine is still relatively tight..The Toledo is generally more refined and more user friendly.All in all considering the difference in size,the difference in generations and the purchase prices I would say it is a score draw.The wife still thinks the Dacia is wonderful and I really enjoy driving it (when allowed) but the Toledo is just more sophisticated as you would expect.

Edited 5 June, 201610 yr by Robbydazzler

After 3 months I have now had time to appraise the relative merits of the wife's Dacia (Sandero Stepway) compared to my Seat (Rapid posing as Toledo). Bear in mind that the Dacia was a pre reg with delivery miles and the top model at £8700 and it is possible to obtain the Toledo Style Advanced top model pre reg at £12000.The Dacia is more fun to drive with a better ride than the Toledo.The steering on the Dacia is not very fluid and the throttle response leaves something to be desired.Amazingly the boot cannot be opened with the central locking and the power window switches are in awkward places.The Dacia,s brakes at low speed are "lethal" just like a switch either off or on The 900cc turbo petrol engine is excellent with plenty of torque/power although, being 3. cylinder, not as smooth as the Toledo.The interior space is limited compared to the Toledo but it is also  a size smaller.The Toledo engine ( 110 ps) is smooth and powerful and,surprisingly,has the edge on mpg at present although the Dacia engine is still relatively tight..The Toledo is generally more refined and more user friendly.All in all considering the difference in size,the difference in generations and the purchase prices I would say it is a score draw.The wife still thinks the Dacia is wonderful and I really enjoy driving it (when allowed) but the Toledo is just more sophisticated as you would expect.

 

Like your review.

I went for the Logan as it has a great boot at 575 litres and roof rails etc.  Body is a bit rolly but that has been helped by my purchase of the 16 inch rims from the Sandero Stepway and with the 205/55-16 inch tyres seems to help reduce the body roll.

 

0.9 TCE engine seems to cope with pretty much everything, even being loaded with 4 adults with luggage, fuel consumption varies for 40 mpg if driving like you stole it to almost 70 mpg if cruising at 56 mph because I am early to be somewhere am I just back it off with the ECO setting on.

 

Fuel tank size is good, nominal 50 litres but if you run it down to a few miles past the last block flashing you can fill up with about 52 litres and it will show 700 mile range though I tend to only get around 600 miles because I will have booted it a few times during that 10 hours or so of driving and spoiled the good fuel consumption figures.

 

Obviously nice to have saved £2-3K relative to the Rapid/Toledo (I had the old Toldeo/Altea XL), shame Dacia are currently not offering the Easy-R auto transmission which is available in mainland Europe.

 

Would like to add a Duster to the fleet and the 125 hp 1.2 TCE engine has just become available to order, sounds great...

http://www.dacia.co.uk/vehicles/duster/media-gallery/brochure/att6274cdce7da04532aa2bb005d0075b93/dacia-duster-brochure.pdf

Edited 6 June, 201610 yr by lol-lol

Dacia deal got even better now with more dealer contribution.

 

Stepway TCE now under 120 gm/km CO2 so cheap road tax.

 

Tempted by a Duster or Stepway to join the fleet.

So poll through Auto-express makes the Dacia Logan the best family car and Dacia-Renault the best dealership network, I cannot say I disagree. 

 

Octy scored well, also agree but rather prefer the Superb but lots of dosh.

 

Skoda dealers 15th out of 31st, yes I think those Skoda dealers left are mid-table from my recent dealings with them.

 

SEAT bottom and and Audi and VW bottom half, yes again.

 

Good read the August Auto-express special.

 

Looking forward to the Clio RS hopefully sometime soon.

Lots of Dacia out and about now in Scotland, and some rather smart looking Dacia Duster's.

They look like lots of car for not silly money.

Usually nicely polished and turned out.

(sadly the seating position in the Duster is just odd as far as i am concerned.)

One tends to find that in areas where people buy cars to do a job they buy a car on its spec and not on its badge so buying a Dacia or Skoda is on the evalution list but the plastic people, thinking of many areas of the English sweet suburbia, badge is all important even if car over priced for the relative spec.

We are awaiting news if the UKwill get the Easy R auto versions.

The 1.2 TCE spec Duster with 125 hp looks even more tempting.

The link to Auto-express article on dealers....

 

http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-news/driver-power/92307/best-car-dealers-2016

Can't understand why SEAT came last. My local SEAT dealer, where I bought my car from have been extremely helpful, replacing items that have failed under warranty with no hassle (it's 8 years old and needed a door lock mechanism and a boot release handle) are very professional both on the phone and in person. I suppose I just lucked out to find a decent dealership.

Can't understand why SEAT came last. My local SEAT dealer, where I bought my car from have been extremely helpful, replacing items that have failed under warranty with no hassle (it's 8 years old and needed a door lock mechanism and a boot release handle) are very professional both on the phone and in person. I suppose I just lucked out to find a decent dealership.

 

SEATs are general good products and have some great offers but I have only found the dealers quite average to poor as a buying/servicing experience.  Locally within a fairly soulless network or paired with "other" lemons like Land Rover and Saab (until their demise).  Skoda has a brilliant network of family businesses very passionate about the brand but the Skoda dealers were then move more to the larger dealership networks so ended up as dispassionate as the Audi, SEAT and VW brands.  

 

Fortunately by local dealership, Savilles of Kidderminster,   jumped ship to Dacia/Renault so moved when Skoda was falling and Dacia/Renault on its way to the top so combining great product and service as was Skoda a decade and two decades ago.  Dacia is massive on the continent and we just need to get some more of their Dacia models ie Autos and Lodgy etc.  

 

Spain continues to be a great place to build cars, they build more than the UK despite half the population, but will we charge 10% car duty on imports from mainland Europe if Euope does on our cars?  If it does the Dacia will look even better than the extraordinary value they already do.    

Edited 1 August, 20169 yr by lol-lol

We have no import duties anymore and I guess that's why we have such a broad choice and relatively cheap pricing.