Haldex 5 service interval

[nicknorman]

My Superb 280 has lost its AWD after only 20,000 miles. Annoying - lots of spinny wheels in the damp etc. Of course it’s getting fixed under warranty (awaiting a new pump) but this has made me look more closely at what is actually fitted.

 

It is a Haldex generation 5 system. This has no separate filter, only a gauze on the pump, unlike the Haldex 4 system. Changing the oil /cleaning the gauze seems very easy but how often should one do it? I’m having difficulty finding out. A YouTube video about Haldex 5 on a Volvo says, because there is no filter, 20,000km / 13,500 miles. Which makes mine well overdue and perhaps explains why it’s conked out. But I can’t find any info about service intervals in the manual / Skoda website. I’ve just phoned customer care, they can’t immediately tell me because their computers are down(!) and will phone back, but in the mean time perhaps folk with the new Haldex 5 AWD should start to worry!

 

Does anyone know what the correct oil change interval for a Haldex 5 system is?

[Ootohere]

13,500 miles.?  like every 6 months or sooner for some drivers!

 

What does Skoda Specialist Cars John Clark Groups Master Tech say?,

not the Service Desk person.

 

Skoda & Skoda techs will usually say 40,000 miles and then so will VW and some will say 30,000 miles. Golf R and others.

Some will say there is no filter to change when there is.

There is a thread in the Yeti subject on it.

 

Ask Skoda Customer Services in writing and the Communications Manager can talk to the Technical Department and you can hold Skoda UK to the answer given.

?

Do they never lift a phone to talk to the technical department, or is the computer down a handy excuse for 'not got a scooby'?

Please then post that.

http://skoda.co.uk/about-us/contact-us 

Edited 8 November, 2017 by Headinawayoffski

[nicknorman]

First of all, let’s be clear about the filter thing. The Haldex 4 had a filter - but Škoda etc didn’t know about it and/or pretended it didn’t exist. This of course is old news on this forum!  But Haldex 5 does not have a filter. There is a great YouTube video about it here. 

 

 

and a similar one for Haldex 4, making the clear distinction between filter present or not.

 

Anyway, just viewed the comments from the video and the video maker admits that the 20,000 km is just his opinion.

 

I’ll wait to hear back what Customer Services have to say about it, they promised a call back later this afternoon or tomorrow morning (we’ll see).

 

I’m also waiting for the dealer (John Clark/Specialist cars) to tell me when they can get a pump. Annoying really as we were just going on holiday (without car) when I discovered it had packed up. I phoned the dealer and said what the fault code was, I’d reset it, the fault code had reappeared as soon as I drove it again and clearly a new pump was needed. They said they’d need to verify it for themselves, which I suppose is fair enough. So 2 weeks wasted, took the car in yesterday (first day back) and after an hour of tinkering they said “Oh, it needs a new Haldex clutch pump. We’ll have to order it, could take a few days, or longer if not in stock.”. To which I of course said “that’s exactly what I told you 2 weeks ago!” At which point they wriggled a bit.

 

Anyway, I am one of those people who has zero faith in garages, as soon as the warranty is over I’ll be doing all the maintenance myself. Can’t wait! That’s why I don’t have too much faith in anything they say.

[Baverhanne]

Just as a fun fact - Volvo doesn't even have an interval for the haldex 5 unit.

Doesn't need it they say... The Video and a lot of owners will disagree even though ours still work @60000km

[Ootohere]

Interested to hear the reply Skoda UK Customer Services provide from the Technical Department.

http://kodiaqforums.co.uk/viewtopic.php?t=487 

[FelisBengalensis]

Sealed for life eh?  Hmm.  The missing statement is that the ‘life’ is the manufacturers considered Service life which in many cases is the warranty period and no more.

 

i also dispute the DPF as being one never needing changing.  Most have a service life of 90 - 100,000 miles before they will contain too much ash and stop regenerating.

 

On topic though, I will get the DSG oils changed on time at 40K.  The Haldex may last maybe twice that but I doubt it will go much further.

[nicknorman]

Just when I thought they were never going to phone back, Customer Services chappie has just phoned. Apparently the answer is that the Haldex AWD should be serviced (ie oil changed) every 3 years, with no mileage constraint. Which seems odd, because the oil needs to be changed due to contaminants from the clutch friction surfaces, so you would think it would be mileage dependant. But anyway, 3 years is what they said. They also said the DSG was 40,000 miles but we knew that anyway.

 

Having looked again at the video and my car, it is not identical to the video in terms of where bits are. There is definitely no seperate filter, but it was not immediately obvious where the fill / level hole is, although I think I have identified it. The clutch pump is arriving tomorrow apparently, and the car is booked in to have it fitted on Monday, so hopefully it will be obvious what has been disturbed when I get the car back. I'll have a look and report back.

 

For the price of the oil, I think I might change the oil after a year or so and see what has accumulated on the gauze pump filter / how horrible the oil looks, as once the thing is out of warranty I'd rather change the oil more frequently than risk another pump failing. Depending on how that looks I can decide whether to stick to the 3 years or do it more often.

 

Just as a matter of interest, has anyone tried the VCDS output setting to make the pump run? I tried it but the response was that the function was not supported. Perhaps this is because the pump is faulty, but obviously it is easier to use VCDS to get the pump to run to prime the oil when refilling it, rather than having to jack down, take the car out for a drive and then jack up again to check/top up the oil level again after it has circulated throught the pump.

[nicknorman]

Haldex pump replaced, AWD now working. I’m a happy bunny! But VCDS pump activation not working.

[ChrisCh]

Sorry to revive an old thread, but I thought it better than creating a new one. I've got a 2016 Superb 4x4 and I'd like to change the oil and clean the filter on the Haldex unit. Can anyone point me in the right direction for how to do this?

Given the experiences of others with VAG haldex based cars (e.g. here), I'd like to change the oil on my unit and clean the filter whilst I'm at it as this isn't done by VAG dealers as they consider it a non-service item.

 

Thanks

[Bap33]

@ChrisCh It'as a good thing to revive old thread instead of creating each time a new one!  

 

Take a look at this thread., you may find some information.

 

[nicknorman]

20 minutes ago, Bap33 said:

@ChrisCh It'as a good thing to revive old thread instead of creating each time a new one!  

 

Take a look at this thread., you may find some information.

 

Also see here where I did it myself

 

 

[Bap33]

@nicknorman Did you find all torque values for every screws easily?

I've only found torque values for filler screw (15 Nm) and drain plug (38 Nm) . But I'm still missing the torque values for:

- The 2 M6 screws that hold the pump

- The 2 screws, which hold the filter gauze onto the pump

Please advise.  

Thanks.

 

 

Edited 19 April, 2020 by Bap33

[ChrisCh]

Thank you both, I've now downloaded the Skoda Superb 3 service manual .

Stupid question - where is the Haldex pump? and what tool do you need to take it off the car?

 

Finally, what parts would you recommend?

- new O-rings

- Haldex oil

 

A good guide for the Mk7 Golf here

 

Thanks.

[nicknorman]

7 hours ago, Bap33 said:

@nicknorman Did you find all torque values for every screws easily?

I've only found torque values for filler screw (15 Nm) and drain plug (38 Nm) . But I'm still missing the torque values for:

- The 2 M6 screws that hold the pump

- The 2 screws, which hold the filter gauze onto the pump

Please advise.  

Thanks.

 

 

No I’m afraid I just used common sense, experience and engineering judgement. Which is a polite way of saying I bodged it!

i got a pretty good idea of how tight the pump screws and filter screws were, when undoing. As I reported, I struggled to get the drain plug loose and ended up destroying it, so it would seem a good idea to not do it up quite so tightly! I don’t think the torque settings for any of these parts is critical, unlike say a cylinder head.

[nicknorman]

2 hours ago, ChrisCh said:

Thank you both, I've now downloaded the Skoda Superb 3 service manual .

Stupid question - where is the Haldex pump? and what tool do you need to take it off the car?

 

Finally, what parts would you recommend?

- new O-rings

- Haldex oil

 

A good guide for the Mk7 Golf here

 

Thanks.

The Haldex pump is on the front face of the Haldex unit which is the front part of the rear differential. The pump is tucked in behind the “donut” ie the coupling between the prop shaft and the Haldex/differential unit. Since most of the pump protrudes and is a cylindrical shape, it is immediately obvious when you look at the unit.

 

Obviously you need the oil. I bought the O ring/2 bolts pack from TPS but in the end I didn’t use them this time. You also need means of injecting the new oil into the filler hole, eg a large syringe or other small pump.

Edited 19 April, 2020 by nicknorman

[ChrisCh]

Thanks Nick!

 

I've ordered this kit and I've just bought some car ramps from Halfords (I'll use my jack and axle stands on the other end of the car to make it level).

 

I'll let you know how I get on 😀

[Bap33]

@nicknorman The service manual recommends to replace both filler screw and drain plug upon oil replacement.
Not a big deal then, if one is damaged during removal. 😉
For pump and filter gauze I would also use the same ‘common sense’ if these torque values can’t be found. Thanks. 😉

 
@ChrisCh Yes, new O-rings for the pump, new filler screw and drain plug, new oil of course. A filling tool (service manual, to get the VAG reference, then it can be found either on ebay or Amazon, I guess.) or a simple syringe will be necessary.

[ChrisCh]

Thanks Bap33. Got any links for a new filter screw and drain plug?

 

Think I've found it (cylinder in photo), drain plug is at bottom of photo in the middle

 

Thanks

[nicknorman]

Do you have VCDS? This link says that after significant work (including removing clods of gunge from the pump gauze) one should carry out the pump learning procedure. I did this.

 

https://www.haldexrepairs.co.uk/generation-5-haldex-fault-finding-repair-guide/

[nicknorman]

33 minutes ago, ChrisCh said:

Thanks Bap33. Got any links for a new filter screw and drain plug?

 

Think I've found it (cylinder in photo), drain plug is at bottom of photo in the middle

 

Thanks

Ah yes it’s not really on the front face, sorry! but anyway, that’s it. Just be careful that you get the correct fill and drain holes because the fill and drain holes for the rear differential are close by.

[ChrisCh]

35 minutes ago, nicknorman said:

Do you have VCDS? This link says that after significant work (including removing clods of gunge from the pump gauze) one should carry out the pump learning procedure. I did this.

 

https://www.haldexrepairs.co.uk/generation-5-haldex-fault-finding-repair-guide/

 

Yes I do have VCDS.

 

I haven't checked for faults yet (no sign of any in normal driving), but I'll do it as part of the flush/filter clean. Thanks 👍

[Bap33]

@ChrisCh

 

Here is an extract from an online ETKA, to find the filler screw (#5 or #6? 🤔) and drain plug (#4) references:

 

Can be ordered by your local dealer when you order both pump seals. Oil may be fund at a better price on ebay or somewhere else I guess...  

May be @nicknorman has good tips to share.  

Edited 19 April, 2020 by Bap33

[nicknorman]

12 hours ago, Bap33 said:

@ChrisCh

 

Here is an extract from an online ETKA, to find the filler screw (#5 or #6? 🤔) and drain plug (#4) references:

 

Can be ordered by your local dealer when you order both pump seals. Oil may be fund at a better price on ebay or somewhere else I guess...  

May be @nicknorman has good tips to share.  

#5 is the Haldex filler / level plug. I didn’t replace the drain plug #4 because there didn’t seem any point, and it hasn’t leaked at all. I only replaced #5 because I chewed it up trying to undo it! Tip is probably to use good quality hex key when undoing it, but the material is pretty soft!

#5 was just a very few £, I got it from TPS along with the oil and O ring kit.

[newbie69]

You might want to check this video too to get an idea of the process (This guy has a lot of tutorials for the MK7 which apply basically to all MQB variants). He says not all torque figures are available as it's not intended to be serviced this way... He does provide values though for the pump bolts, drain plug and fill plug.
 

 

Edited 20 April, 2020 by newbie69

[nicknorman]

Good video, but he doesn’t mention running the pump learning procedure. Maybe ODB11 can’t do that?

 

Also I’m not totally confident that turning on the key (ignition) makes the pump run. It did on the older Haldex systems as they were pre-loaded with pressure, but not so sure about gen 5 which doesn’t store pressure. But ok, maybe the system runs the pump on power up just to make sure it is working. Personally I’d want someone to turn on the ignition whilst I listened to see if the pump ran. Or just run it from VCDS.

Edited 20 April, 2020 by nicknorman