Citigo Electric

[Ronn]

Emile, 

You're talking to someone who has put new Sub-Frame on a Mini MK1 in the late '60's on the Drive,

You're talking to someone who change 3 Clutches + a Gearbox on a Escort MK1 in the '70's iat Home.

And your talking to someone who built his own Caterham Super 7 from scratch about 25 years ago on his own!

So, yes, I think I can safely say I know a lot about Cars.

 

[Emil]

True expert then! Wow. 

[Ronn]

No, not an expert but I don't just drive the damn things!

Too many think they know a lot about car because the drive many of them have never picked a spanner up !

[Emil]

It's amazing what people can do with a spanner. Even if they don't know what they are doing. 

[Ronn]

You may have tried various contrivences with a Spanner.

 

The applications of a Spanner apart from its intended use doesn't keep me awake at night.

[domhnall]

22 hours ago, Ronn said:

Who said anything about driving 350 miles without stopping?

But what I don't want to do is, be FORCED TO STOP at the discretion of an Electric Vehicle because the little Electrons have stopped running down the wires after 186 miles.

 

If I stop on a journey it will be when I want to stop & where I want stop!!

 

In 2019, Petrol Powered cars give ME that choice & freedom.

Electric Powered cars don't. 

 

Not Rocket science is it?

 

OK OK, I find that the current range allows me to get beyond where I want to stop. If you are able to drive for more than a couple of hours without a break then that's your call I guess. You can and do pay more for the privilege too. I reckon £25 for over 6000 miles of motoring is pretty good and helps offset th problems caused by pay stagnation and inflation on everything else. 

 

On 500+ mile round trip to Stafford I stopped where I wanted to (the first because I was hungry, the second because I needed the loo). The infrastructure wasn't pathetic (it was more expensive to fuel up on the motorway so just like petrol) and the car was quite clearly up to the job. So I can't agree with your statements that a) we're being conned b) the infrastructure is pathetic and c) the cars aren't up to the job.

 

Edited 27 March, 2019 by domhnall

[Ootohere]

I am looking forward to getting an EV and having over 200 miles range then plenty spare to get things done then to a charger and not paying £30 every 250 miles for petrol or diesel.

Just on 10,000 miles a year that will be £1,200 or so saved on fuel taking into account free charging.

 

[Ronn]

Look, let's get one thing straight.

 

I'm NOT, repeat NOT, advocating driving for excessive miles without a stop!!

So, I stop & use a motorway toilet as nature calls. 

5/10 minutes tops! - that's all.

Can you people not go 3 or 4 hours without feeding your body?

Ridiculous!!

As regarding the cost you mention of travelling in a Petrol car against an Electric car!

You haven't taken in the initial cost of buying an Electric car!

They are well over TWICE the price of the equivalent Petrol car!

Do you maths.

Then you mention how cheap running an Electric car is against running an Electric car!

Do you honestly believe the any Government is going to wave goodbye to all the revenue it gets from the sale of Petrol (about 90% Tax) WITHOUT Taxing the use of Electricity for travelling, in the future?

GET REAL - what Planet do you live on?

So, anybody buying Electric cars in the future, prepare yourselves for a MASSIVE SHOCK (excuse the pun).

Ways & Means will be devised and enforced by Law to prevent you from charging the Batteries in your brand new Electric car using 'cheap' domestic Electricity!

 

Think on Lad!!!

 

[Ootohere]

There are Used EV's the same price as used ICE vehicles, or cheaper, or leases.  Or just the same price if buying a new £26,000 car maybe. Or what ever you spend.

Do your maths, open your eyes.

 

Location location location, and a lot of free charging and parking in Scotland, and 6 year interest free loans from the Scottish Government / Tax payers.

Edited 27 March, 2019 by Skoffski

[Ronn]

Spend £26,000 on a new car whether it be Electric or Petrol.

Are you BONKERS!!

 

Show me the families on the AVERAGE UK wage with 2/3 Kids below 10 years old (wife not working - can't afford the childcare) who spend £26,000 on a family car?

 

In the North of England, in those circumstsances, you'd be lucky if your car's worth 4 or 5 Grand!!!

 

It ain't like the affluent 'Home Counties',

They ain't all got jobs paying £30,000 + p.a. you know!

 

We are still years away from affordable Electric family cars for Mr & Mrs Joe Public & their family!

 

And you mention 2nd hand Electric cars (still expensive v their 2nd hand Petrol counterparts).

And don't forget, Electric car Battery technology is moving at such a pace, the 2nd hand affordable Electric cars are 1st generation which do about 50 miles on full charge. - they are rubbish!!

 

By the way one issue that NEVER highlighted about Electric car is,

In Cold Weather situations, the mileage you get out of a Full Charge can HALF.

So, on a Cold Winters Day, your brand new 180 miles range Electric Car may only deliver 80/100 miles on Full Charge.

That's because Batteries are extremely inefficient in Cold Weather + you reach for the Heater & have you Headlights on more.

 

Have a NICE DAY!!!!!

[Ootohere]

You have a nice days as well,

I think you need to maybe get out more often than you do and see just what car dealerships do sell or lease.

 

There are a lot of Company Cars First Registered in the UK.

More than 50%, then a lot of 'New Cars' are leased, and the biggest group car buyer is Motabily.

That is a lot of New Cars back into auction or trade in 3 years or sooner.

Edited 27 March, 2019 by Skoffski

[Ronn]

So, you haven't got anything to say about the points I make?

 

You have NOTHING to say about how Electro car mileage between charges is drastically reduced in Cold Weather due to Electric Batteries being inefficient?

 

You have NOTHING to say about families in the North of England just living above 'the breadline' not being able to afford to Lease an Electric car costing them £250 out of the weekly budget, or even buy a 2nd hand, 1st generation Electric car costing £12,000 that does 59 miles between charges!

 

It's all they can do to keep their kids in shoes, a shirt on their back & keep their only luxury, a 8/10 year old Petrol car on the road that's worth £2,000 to £3,000  part ex against another 'old banger'!

 

[Ootohere]

They will not be buying then, or having iphones, ipads, smoking, buying scratch cards, going on holiday etc.

 

I know all that about cold weather, stories, circumstances, nonsense about weather, i have looked at it closer than you i think, i have driven and tried EV cars and vans.

As to your North, South, East or West of England the Arctic Conditions you experience really are a bit mild.

 

I have driven petrol hybrids as well to see what they can do. 2nd hand prices are pretty damn low actually.

And if someone just needs a 80 mile range EV for what ever season they are available at £6,000 or that region.

Vans for £4,000.

 

Families in the North of England has nothing to do with it, Hard Working or not or single people or couples without children, 

or senior citizens.

 

As to breadline open your eyes, look at Hotels,Airport Carparks, Car Dealerships, Marinas, Camper / Mobile Home Sales sites, and much else including houses.

 

Austerity only applies to some.  Maybe millions, but not dependent on North, South, East or West.

Look at housing estates, deprived areas and just what cars / vehicles there are about.

Edited 27 March, 2019 by Skoffski

[Jonny118118]

33 minutes ago, Ronn said:

So, you haven't got anything to say about the points I make?

 

You have NOTHING to say about how Electro car mileage between charges is drastically reduced in Cold Weather due to Electric Batteries being inefficient?

 

You have NOTHING to say about families in the North of England just living above 'the breadline' not being able to afford to Lease an Electric car costing them £250 out of the weekly budget, or even buy a 2nd hand, 1st generation Electric car costing £12,000 that does 59 miles between charges!

 

It's all they can do to keep their kids in shoes, a shirt on their back & keep their only luxury, a 8/10 year old Petrol car on the road that's worth £2,000 to £3,000  part ex against another 'old banger'!

 

Cold weather isn’t a problem for electric cars, they have the technology in them which allows the batteries to heat up while still on charge before you head out, meaning zero loss of charge before you set off on your journey. Just like you set the A/C before you head out, so it’s nice and cool on a summers day or nice and warm for cold winters day - all controlled by your smartphone. 

 

Being someone who loves their technology, I seriously am considering an electric car after the current car finance finishes. A Tesla would suit fine 

[domhnall]

2 hours ago, Jonny118118 said:

Cold weather isn’t a problem for electric cars, they have the technology in them which allows the batteries to heat up while still on charge before you head out, meaning zero loss of charge before you set off on your journey. Just like you set the A/C before you head out, so it’s nice and cool on a summers day or nice and warm for cold winters day - all controlled by your smartphone. 

 

Being someone who loves their technology, I seriously am considering an electric car after the current car finance finishes. A Tesla would suit fine 

They don't all have that. I drive a leaf and when we were at minus 9 last month the range was cut by ariun 10 to 15 miles. Extreme heat and extreme cold can marginally effect the range but it's not drastic (based on my real world experience rather than what I've read somewhere). 

 

The zero fuel cost, no ved and the fact that tge car auto defrosts before i get in it are massive plus points. 

 

Add in the much better acceleration and the fun you can having wiping the smile off the face of boy racers and it's a fabulous proposition. 

[Luckypants]

Well now you've all stopped ranting, I still want an Electric Citigo with over 160 mile range. Back on topic 

 

[Ootohere]

I think many others will as well.

Not so sure what VW bosses think about that unless there is one in the Dealers Showrooms as well and customers will want it over the Skoda.

Will they get the greater sales they want if Skoda undercut them?

 

VW Group have been pretty slow getting improved range introduced with the car they have now.

They seem to keep predicting improved batteries without managing to source those.

[exiled2000]

Glad we are back on topic.

 

I bought a new Citigo in October 2018. Let's say I keep it for four years, until 2022.

 

I wonder if there will be an E-Citigo that I could afford then, a new one. 

 

I also wonder if it will do 186 miles. I doubt it. As you say, with the lights and heating and radio on, it will do less than that.

 

Mind you I only drive in and around the city and outside (30 mile journeys). Should be perfect in theory.

 

At least the acceleration should be better than 14.4 seconds! 

 

I will not pass judgement until it is released, end of this year? Perhaps we will be surprised, it might have a larger range. Battery range. That's the key for me.

 

I fear that only when oil and gas are really running out (God knows when - 100 years from now?) then manufacturers will get serious.

 

 

[Emil]

12.4 sec for e-p!. And only one gear so it is very easy and nice to drive. 

[Ronn]

Thankfully, I still enjoy cars that give feedback to the driver & reward with a totally engaging drive.

A 'driver's' car is what I require for my driving pleasure.

I do not require the uninvolving experience that an EV has to offer.

The single pedal remains for me confined to the Fairground Dodgem amusements.

And the electric 'mobility scooter' concept of driving that many desire is far beyond the horizon for me.

[Ootohere]

@Ronn  If you never try an EV you will never know how much enjoyment there can be of keeping the toe down on a great driving road.

Dodgems are just great fun and so can an EV be, the acceleration and smoothness can be addictive.

On dry roads that is, or with tyres that might not be what comes as OEM.

The 'official acceleration times' are not 'Real World' IMO, they are what are 'green kidology figures'.

 

 

 

 

Edited 31 March, 2019 by Skoffski

[Ronn]

The problem for manufactures in producing a viable EV Citigo is - city car dimensions!

 

It should be no surprise to anybody that EVs with any useful range are all SUV size cars.

That's because they cannot cram enough battery capacity into diminutive city car dimensions.

 

I have a solution I can offer Skoda however, - take the Citigo and fill all the rear passenger area with batteries.

It would then only be a 2 seater however and handle like Petrol Tanker, but at least it would possess a half decent range on a full charge!!

 

[Ronn]

I have tried one, I took out the new Mk2 Nissan Leaf on a 20 mile round trip.

I drove very well but still rather disconcerting to observe the range indicator visibly reducing by the minute.

And bear in mind, that's driving probably the most advanced EV family size hatch available on the market.

[Ootohere]

Or probably not the most advanced no matter how Nissan spin things.

But then you would need to try a Hyundai Kona or KIA -Niro to see the difference.

 

VW Group turning out one of the least advanced automated manual 2 pedal petrol City cars or just cars in the UP!MiiCitigo ASG's was just ridiculous.

They need to up the game with a e-Citigo when they do produce them.

Edited 31 March, 2019 by Skoffski

[Ronn]

Now you're wandering into SUV territory!

I did say 'EV family hatch'.