1 hour ago, alltorque said:

Well done, Sir. I hope you'll be as happy with your Toymota as I am with mine...and SWMBO is with hers, 18 months down the road. 

 

RAV 4 is an excellent choice.  Enjoy.

 

Many thanks, of course there are many other good cars out there but the RAV4 seemed to chime with me.

 

Cheers, Bill 

5 minutes ago, FlyingSpanner said:

Go for a hybrid or electric vehicle in the group then. I can see you are trying to justify the jump, don't do it, let things cool down you know you love the product really 

 

I did want to stay with the group - a large part of my life was invested in them. I was an E.R.I.C. winner - a national competition run by VAG for all employees. It stood for - Economy. Reliability, Integrity & Care. Seems old fashioned now - but we had pride in what we did and the knowledge we possessed. 

 

What have they got to offer in the here & now? Thought so - Toyota it is then.

 

The diesel is in the same class as smoking - socially unacceptable. No matter that the Euro 6 diesel is cleaner than petrol, if the politicians and the public line up against it then it's finished. Whilst they do continue look out for punitive legislation  - easy pickings for the government.

 

Cheers, Bill 

17 hours ago, FlyingSpanner said:

Isn't the software/ecu part of the fuel system???

VW trying to get diesel into the California market that caused the grief. The engineers (as I presume you already know) wrote software to make the engine clean when in a test cell, what was emitted from the back was correct. That changed in normal operation when no longer under test conditions. Other manufacturers gave false statements as they were unable to get their engines to run as clean so changed their figures instead. Both ways are wrong and fraudulent, it is engineers trying to push the boundaries to get around the legislation when they know in normal use the engine fuel system technology won't allow, that's why they were forced into AdBlue.

Why do you thing exhaust flaps were introduced in the exhaust? To get around noise legislation when in a certain gear at speed, the flap would close to skirt around the legislation, that too is fraudulent. But who cares FFS.

Look at Formula 1, their engineers will always flirt on the edge of the rules to get the best out of the product to try and get an advantage.

It's not right and they were found out along with a long list of other manufacturers ALL DOING SIMILAR THINGS, Where you get they are gonna get away with it due to owning up early?? VW was found out first and the others will slowly be revealed. They won't get away with anything.

All this boils down to tree huggers forcing cleaner diesels, well they got their way as manufacturers are moving to hybrid and full electric.  Even these EU5 so-called dirty diesels are VERY much cleaner than the old PD  VE engines, much more refined and great fuel economy, someone has it in for diesels as we were encouraged by government to buy them, now someones has been given a bung and they are out of favor. 

It will be the petrol engine next in the firing line, have they forgotten why there was a shift from petrol to diesel???

 

 

 

I think you are slightly confused but never mind. 

On 07/01/2019 at 16:00, xman said:

 

For Estateman to say this must be a real indictment on how bad things must have got for him with Skoda. He is a long standing Briskoda member of many years, I remember how fervently he used to defend Skoda when I made any criticism. I will always respect his opinion, I believe he is an ex tech with engine design experience and so is far more qualified than many to make comments.

 

 

To be fair you're not exactly lacking in knowledge yourself xman. You are a very helpful chap and even when we've disagreed about a point/s, I've always enjoyed your posts. Rock on! lol...

G WAP

Edited 9 January, 20197 yr by FlyingSpanner

19 hours ago, FlyingSpanner said:

Isn't the software/ecu part of the fuel system???

VW trying to get diesel into the California market that caused the grief. The engineers (as I presume you already know) wrote software to make the engine clean when in a test cell, what was emitted from the back was correct. That changed in normal operation when no longer under test conditions. Other manufacturers gave false statements as they were unable to get their engines to run as clean so changed their figures instead. Both ways are wrong and fraudulent, it is engineers trying to push the boundaries to get around the legislation when they know in normal use the engine fuel system technology won't allow, that's why they were forced into AdBlue.

Why do you thing exhaust flaps were introduced in the exhaust? To get around noise legislation when in a certain gear at speed, the flap would close to skirt around the legislation, that too is fraudulent. But who cares FFS.

Look at Formula 1, their engineers will always flirt on the edge of the rules to get the best out of the product to try and get an advantage.

It's not right and they were found out along with a long list of other manufacturers ALL DOING SIMILAR THINGS, Where you get they are gonna get away with it due to owning up early?? VW was found out first and the others will slowly be revealed. They won't get away with anything.

All this boils down to tree huggers forcing cleaner diesels, well they got their way as manufacturers are moving to hybrid and full electric.  Even these EU5 so-called dirty diesels are VERY much cleaner than the old PD  VE engines, much more refined and great fuel economy, someone has it in for diesels as we were encouraged by government to buy them, now someones has been given a bung and they are out of favor. 

It will be the petrol engine next in the firing line, have they forgotten why there was a shift from petrol to diesel???

 

 

 

2 hours ago, FlyingSpanner said:

Ha, if you don’t like the product buy something else it’s a free society your choice but don’t try to change my mind by spouting off and trying to belittle fellow members with your better than thou sniping comments. FP.

 

The EA189 defeat device was a senior management decision: the engineers implemented what management asked them to do. I suggest you take some time to read the Wikipedia article on the matter: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volkswagen_emissions_scandal

 

Speaking as an engineer, while there is great satisfaction in pushing a design to its limit, what the boss says goes. Now there's a separate argument to be had on whether the engineers should have pushed back at something they had to know was breaking the law when they implemented it, but there's a whole morass of legal and moral issues in there.

 

While the scandal started in the US, it exposed the fact that it was being done in Europe too, and that in normal driving European models were not meeting the (less stringent) rules in force here under Euro 5. Other manufacturers have used loopholes and flexible interpretations of the rules to pass the tests, but they didn't use a defeat device as VAG did. VAG fundamentally set out to break the law, while other manufacturers stretched the letter of the law as far as they could without breaking it, even though it was not in the spirit of the law. IMO SCR retrofits should have been mandated by the EU as part of the corrective measures for this as it's a far more effective NOx management strategy than LNT.

 

Tree huggers aren't forcing cleaner diesels, research on air quality is driving the rules. The irony is that because so many manufacturers skirted around the rules for Euro 5, air quality was worse than it should have been which lead to Euro 6 probably being stricter than might have been needed to bring air quality under control. EU legislation is research driven i.e. the EU's research funding programmes are drawn up to address issues that the EU wants to legislate for in future. The noose on internal combustion is only going to grow tighter, because of both criterion pollutants causing air quality problems, and CO2 emissions exacerbating climate change.

I would have thought the idea would have been originally suggested by some engineer then allowed to be developed by those further up the tree.

G

Edited 9 January, 20197 yr by FlyingSpanner

13 minutes ago, FlyingSpanner said:

 Research due to pressure from tree huggers!!!  Anyway the beginning of the end for the internal combustion engine which is cleaner than it's ever been. We gonna have electric planes next??   Then there will be pressure to clean up the power stations providing the electricity to charge the soon to be condemned lithium battery technology, where does it stop? No point having R8 and RS6 as they are "socially unacceptable" What a crock of ****e, That AdBlue is horrible stuff all to get emissions a bit lower. Can't wait to get my car remapped, two fingers to the oppressive tree hugging community forcing others to comply. May as well stop all motorsport and cancel all flights.

Definition of an engineer: somebody who makes precise guesswork based on unreliable data provided by people with questionable knowledge. Never wrong. Likes tables.

 

The marketing people told the engineers to get their engines into California, they made it pass the test and did their job, just might have overlooked a few rules doing it. Stylish in my view.

No, research prompted by observed problems with air quality. If you can't accept that, that's your problem. Being obnoxious here when reality is pointed out to you won't win you friends.

 

 

G

Edited 9 January, 20197 yr by FlyingSpanner

14 minutes ago, FlyingSpanner said:

just here to help some people with  3T technical problems end of

Which 3T problems are you helping with in this thread?

To be fair, industrial revolution 1.0 was at a time when we had (relatively) barely emerged from the dark ages and science/engineering types were no longer being burned at the stake as heretics.

That we in the "developed world" have learned from those mistakes and encourage other emerging economies to not make the same mistakes based on clear evidence that our past antics have made a major change I see as a good thing... 

G

Edited 9 January, 20197 yr by FlyingSpanner

No emissions cheaters in my driveway.

Hope you grow to enjoy this forum.

G

Edited 9 January, 20197 yr by FlyingSpanner

G

Edited 9 January, 20197 yr by FlyingSpanner

Just now, FlyingSpanner said:

All started with someone slagging off the brand I happen to like and a brief diversion from the norm. With the cars you have, you have no room to but in ref emissions. cough

I LOVE our 2 Skoda's but HATE cold weather so will keep buying PETROL cars and trying to warm the EARTH in order to make the British winter warmer for everyone saving OAP's from higher winter fuel bills. Hell bent on doing my bit for Climate Warming.

@FlyingSpanner: Not sure what you're trying to achieve, but it seems irrelevant to this thread.

Edited 8 January, 20197 yr by Wino

Just now, Wino said:

Not sure what you're trying to achieve, but it seems irrelevant to this thread.

We used to run 2 DIRTY CHEATING Skoda diesels.

Sorry shy, as you'll see by my edit, my comment wasn't aimed at you.

 

 

 

Just now, Wino said:

Not sure what you're trying to achieve, but it seems irrelevant to this thread.

 

I think its an attempt to wind up as many people as he can, to "force" the ban stick in his direction... why? I dunno. So that he can say that briskies didnt like his version of events so banned him... arent we all a bunch of whiney ******s...

4 hours ago, FlyingSpanner said:

Ha, if you don’t like the product buy something else it’s a free society your choice but don’t try to change my mind by spouting off and trying to belittle fellow members with your better than thou sniping comments. FP.

 

Firstly, I did, Secondly, I have no wish to change your mind about anything. Thirdly, there's only one sniper here and it's not me! Lol...

G

Edited 9 January, 20197 yr by FlyingSpanner

G

Edited 9 January, 20197 yr by FlyingSpanner

There's slagging off, and there's reasonable discussion. You don't seem to be able to differentiate.