Article in Daily Mail.

[Berisford]

Lee Boyce (?) has written an article about keyless car theft in yesterday’s Mail. 

 

His story is based around his newly delivered Karoq and what a great motor it is.....However, he goes on to moan about the fact that no one at the dealership warned him about the risks or indeed how to mitigate the risks of keyless systems.

 

Not a single mention in the article or the many comments that follow about the option to disable the Kesey with a simple touch of the handle.

 

Quite a few comments about the Skoda being safe from theft simply because it’s a Skoda.......if only those folk knew what a (generally) excellent vehicle the Karoq is.......

 

 

 

 

[SimonAudi]

I read that it can be disabled by pressing the button after locking... but can it be permanently disabled - so you have to use the remote to open / close from the infotainment system?

 

Anyone?

 

But as with all news stories.. they only tell you what you want to hear... or they are being paid to say...  not necessarily the facts / truth....

 

 

THANKS

 

 

[iwb100]

I bought two blocker pouches and tested they work, which they do. I guess I should periodically check they are still working. I'd say that is the simplest way to mitigate it. The only time my key is out of the pouch is when I'm driving. 

 

 

 

[Berisford]

I was worried before I took delivery but I've since decided that the best policy is to simply disable the Kessy whenever it's parked outside the house but when out and about to just use the convenience of the keyless system.

 

[Sanqhar]

14 minutes ago, Berisford said:

I was worried before I took delivery but I've since decided that the best policy is to simply disable the Kessy whenever it's parked outside the house but when out and about to just use the convenience of the keyless system.

 

 

+1

 

tom

[StEdmund]

Same as Berisford and Sanqhar. After disabling Kessy, I am unable to unlock the door even when the key is in my hand - I have to use the button on the key. The security procedure works.

 

We bought a 4" cube tin box with a Rubik's cube design for keeping the keys in, assuming that the signal would not pass through the metal. This morning, we tried an experiment to see if the signal could escape the box and found that kessy would open the door when the unshielded key was within about 2m distance from the car ......... this appeared to be about 1.5m when the key was held in the box. Enough of the signal was passing through the box for Kessy to operate.

 

I don't know how sensitive the thieves' equipment is at picking up a signal from a key, but it might be a good idea to see how effective your 'shield' is by trying to operate Kessy while the key is in your pouch/tin-box/metal foil whatever. You might be surprised.

[SimonAudi]

How can you operate the key when its in your metal box?

 

With the lid open the signal escapes...

 

 

[StEdmund]

1 minute ago, SimonAudi said:

How can you operate the key when its in your metal box?

 

With the lid open the signal escapes...

 

 

 

You don't need to take the key out of the box - the car can sense the signal escaping from the box and you open the door simply by sliding your hand behind the door-handle.

[Berisford]

I purchased a cheap signal detector, especially designed to check that remote signal devices are working - the Kessy keys transmit a weak signal every 6 seconds and whilst you may have to be in the immediate vicinity of the car for it to open a door the signal detector can see it from 7 mtrs distant. I suspect this is how the scroats 'grab' and relay the signal.

 

The signal given out when I press the 'lock / unlock' buttons is much stronger and can be detected at least 50 mtrs away.

 

What is surprising is how the signal can 'get out' of a tin box with just the slightest of gaps.

Edited 2 April, 2019 by Berisford

[iwb100]

With the pouches I bought so long as key is in it and pouch is closed you can sit with the pouch in the car and car will not start.....

[StEdmund]

29 minutes ago, iwb100 said:

With the pouches I bought so long as key is in it and pouch is closed you can sit with the pouch in the car and car will not start.....

 

That's interesting! I thought I'd take a closer look so put my key in the metal container and approached the car - I could unlock it with the key enclosed in the container and, when I put the closed container on the passenger seat, I could start the car. I went through the procedure again but, this time instead of using the metal container, I wrapped the key in a piece of ordinary kitchen foil. This time, I couldn't open the door until I exposed the key and when I wrapped the key up again and placed it on the passenger seat, I couldn't start the car.

 

I guess the conclusion from this is to test whatever you plan on using as a shield. My wife informs me (now!) that the container wasn't actually sold as a key-shield, she just thought that, as it was metal, it would do the job. I should add that none of this particularly bothers me as I disable the Kessy anyway, when the car is on the drive.

[Rankaclank]

No matter what you do you can only minimise the risk...if a tealeaf wants the car they will take it one way or another.  Years ago it was the remote keyfob signal that was intercepted allowing the car to be unlocked, now it is relaying of the signal...with keyless entry systems, it unlocks the car and the steering lock!  Relay signal theft is not as common as just walking into the house and just taking the keys.

 

Spare keys should also be in an RFID blocking bag and never leave your keys anywhere near your house doors!

[Berisford]

1 hour ago, StEdmund said:

 

 I should add that none of this particularly bothers me as I disable the Kessy anyway, when the car is on the drive.

 

I've been to the hospital today and as usual I had more than enough time to ponder life and the state of the union - anyway, I got to thinking about the locks and disabling Kessy and it stuck me that there's a gap in the system - the tailgate - even with the system 'disabled' you can still open the tailgate without pressing the keyfob?

 

I concede that getting into the cabin might be a squeeze and starting the engine might be impossible but nonetheless, I'd have thought the system would disable the boot too - or is ours faulty?

[StEdmund]

18 minutes ago, Berisford said:

 

I've been to the hospital today and as usual I had more than enough time to ponder life and the state of the union - anyway, I got to thinking about the locks and disabling Kessy and it stuck me that there's a gap in the system - the tailgate - even with the system 'disabled' you can still open the tailgate without pressing the keyfob?

 

I concede that getting into the cabin might be a squeeze and starting the engine might be impossible but nonetheless, I'd have thought the system would disable the boot too - or is ours faulty?

 

Just been out and checked - with Kessy disabled, I couldn't get into the boot with the key in my pocket - I would have had to press the keyfob. I should add that this was tested on the 2L diesel courtesy Scout that I have at the moment while my 1.5 petrol stays at the dealers awaiting 'the fix'.

[Berisford]

5 minutes ago, StEdmund said:

 

Just been out and checked - with Kessy disabled, I couldn't get into the boot with the key in my pocket - I would have had to press the keyfob. I should add that this was tested on the 2L diesel courtesy Scout that I have at the moment while my 1.5 petrol stays at the dealers awaiting 'the fix'.

 

Most curious, I'll double check ours now.

 

Edit: Stand down folks, seems I'm mistaken, the tailgate does stay locked and needs the fob pressed. Sorry.

Edited 2 April, 2019 by Berisford

[Panther_uk]

The Faraday pouches 100% work from my experience, can stand right next to the car and it won't open (wifes Kia, not a karoq), just does not detect the key at all, as soon as you take the key out of the pouch the mirror unfold etc.

[Stevieweevie]

A Daily Mail article that omits a "key" piece of information? Shocking!

 

Relay attacks are becoming increasingly common in line with the growing prevalence of keyless entry systems. It is an expected trend shift.

 

If dealers and sales people don't explain the keyless entry systems to drivers I do think that's an issue. Let's be honest, how many car buyers read the manual (where there will be an abundance of warnings and instructions for best practice)? The only time most people look at the manual is to learn how something works if they haven't figured it out themselves, or if something goes wrong. If that something is that your car has been nicked, then reading about how to safeguard your car against keyless relay attacks is too little, too late.

[vadimo]

Sorry but I just have to say it..... you shouldn't have to worry, the great thing about Skoda and also brown (in my case), this is part of the joy having it, no one really wants it and probably would have to pay someone to steal it

[antonv]

On 05/04/2019 at 15:43, vadimo said:

Sorry but I just have to say it..... you shouldn't have to worry, the great thing about Skoda and also brown (in my case), this is part of the joy having it, no one really wants it and probably would have to pay someone to steal it

Yeah that's my hope for Skoda, my previous 2016 BMW 320d spent 4 month in repairs after having steering wheel and media module stolen. Insurance company paid 20k EUR for repairs thanks to BMW's 700% margins on some components. I was one of the ~50 BMW owners affected within one week in Stockholm.

 

Keyless system retransmission is often a way to open the car and take valuable options, in my case they just smashed the window though.

 

On the other hand, I know similar stories for VW Golf 7, they take steering wheel, digital dials, airbag and headlights here in Sweden. Is there a risk for digital dials of Karoq to get stolen too then? In other threads here people discuss retrofitting some cool options, which is a growing market opportunity for thieves...

[vadimo]

10 minutes ago, antonv said:

Yeah that's my hope for Skoda, my previous 2016 BMW 320d spent 4 month in repairs after having steering wheel and media module stolen. Insurance company paid 20k EUR for repairs thanks to BMW's 700% margins on some components. I was one of the ~50 BMW owners affected within one week in Stockholm.

 

Keyless system retransmission is often a way to open the car and take valuable options, in my case they just smashed the window though.

 

On the other hand, I know similar stories for VW Golf 7, they take steering wheel, digital dials, airbag and headlights here in Sweden. Is there a risk for digital dials of Karoq to get stolen too then? In other threads here people discuss retrofitting some cool options, which is a growing market opportunity for thieves...

 

The theft you are describing is unfortunately widespread here in UK too but it varies in popularity by regions, cars get butchered to pieces, it used to be more with likes of porche, merc, Audi and BMW and mostly get stolen, now it's going down to VW and even Ford level but more of leave the car without infortainment bits, steering, lights, alloys.... but I insist Skoda is least of interest.

 

And on the repairs, sounds like the BMW dealer took the ****, insurances here usually will have network of authorised BMW repair centres that will be more reasonable.

[Ootohere]

http://briskoda.net/forums/topic/384321-new-golf-r-part-2/?page=41

 

[AndyC]

Thread revival.

 

Had my Karoq 10 days now and still getting used to keyless entry. I keep the key in a signal blocking pouch. was out in the rain today and returned to the car and threw everything in the back. Car started OK. All was fine until I stopped at traffic lights, engine switched off. Lights go green press clutch and nothing, Message says no key detected. Panic. Pouch was on back seat so had to root about to find it, causing a bit of a queue. Turned out that the key had slipped back into the pouch, so I know it works. 

 

Moral I suppose, put key where I can see it! Also worth noting that the car will run once started even if it can't detect the key and if it goes stop like this you can't move the car because the handbrake is locked on.

 

Andy

[kenfowler3966]

My understanding is that for my 20 reg car if the key doesn't move for 15 minutes now it goes to sleep so no need to bother about these screening boxes. Saves battery life as well. Anyway I always lock the car with the key button and then touch the door  handle contacts to disable the kessy when I walk away so the signal booster thieves use will not work.