Driver door controls not working

[hackingjam]

Hi all,

When I bought my vrs, the chap who I bought it off said that the regulator had failed on the drivers door the day shortly before I bought it. However, now none of the controls on the door work (mirrors, windows, the lock buttons), and they are not illuminated when the lights come on either. The lock light still flashes, puddle light illuminates, and little chrome lock nubs go up and down. I pulled off the door card to be greeted with this the other day: an aftermarket alpine sound system that had been spliced in. Had a poke at some fuses and all seemed fine so assumed it was an electrical gremlin due to someones poor wiring job and needed a new door (or loom at least) again. However upon putting the door card back on, the drivers window worked! But nothing else. Was a miserable day so didnt use the window any further, and sure enough the next day it had stopped working again. I'm not really sure what to do next - the window briefly working has given me hope there's an easy fix that i can try work out by probing with a multi meter, but I'm not sure where to even start. Can anyone advise if this is worth my time? 

[TMB]

Have a look inisde the rubber door bellows to see if any wires are broken. It's a common problem.

[hackingjam]

Nothing seems amiss here...

[Daddyfixitsnew1]

look as far down that boot as possible--feel if any wires are broken by wiggling them

[hackingjam]

Finally got round to looking at this as the drivers window had stopped working....

Removed the bellow, all wires were fine apart from one which just had some insulation cut, wire was still intact inside though. The single window started working again after being unplugged and plugged back in, still no backlighting, no mirror controls or lock controls, driver control for passenger window not working but passenger side control still working fine.

 

Done a fair bit of digging here and on the facebook groups (read: bugging Ross ) and I'm wondering if its the classic case of the wrong motor revision swapped into the door? My car is a 54 plate so I assume is using a motor before the Oct 2004 that I've seen @Wino mention in another current thread on window woes. I'll try and get a picture of the motor part number tomorrow and hopefully someone on here can tell me if its the correct one.

Edited 21 March, 2021 by hackingjam

[Breezy_Pete]

Look at (and photograph) the wiring to the motor module while you're looking for the motor part number.

The older set-up has an orange/brown + orange/green twisted pair of CAN wires going to pins 4 and 6 of the 8-way connector. The 10/04 onwards version lacks these wires and uses those pins for other things, according to the circuits.

I'm a little confused by (pirated) ETKA listings that suggest the motors changed part numbers in July 2004 rather than Sept/Oct, from the 6Q... to the 6Y... parts. I would have thought the dates would match up? 

 

Actually, having said all that, I think if you have the wrong era motor module, the connectors may just not fit?

[Titanium_Man]

2 hours ago, Wino said:

Look at (and photograph) the wiring to the motor module while you're looking for the motor part number.

The older set-up has an orange/brown + orange/green twisted pair of CAN wires going to pins 4 and 6 of the 8-way connector. The 10/04 onwards version lacks these wires and uses those pins for other things, according to the circuits.

I'm a little confused by (pirated) ETKA listings that suggest the motors changed part numbers in July 2004 rather than Sept/Oct, from the 6Q... to the 6Y... parts. I would have thought the dates would match up? 

 

Actually, having said all that, I think if you have the wrong era motor module, the connectors may just not fit?

Ive got a door window issue and went to speak a local WV scrappie to see if I could find a window motor.... he told me that the difference between the old and the new IS down to the differing connector block. You will 100% have to make sure you get the correct part numbered window motor. @Winois Bob-on, as usual. 

[hackingjam]

Interesting discovery, my window motor only has 2 plugs? In the video I watched he has 3, with the 3rd one going to the mirror. My mirror controls seem to go straight into the main bunch of cables, and you can see the absolute cowboy job someone has done on the melted connectors... hence why I'm wondering if this loom is beyond saving.

[Breezy_Pete]

Yeah, the older style 6Q... modules seem to have two 12-way connectors and an 8-way, with CAN bus control. Later 6Y... ones like yours (which looks like factory original judging by the 05-01-05 datecode on it)  just have an 8 way and a sparsely populated 6-way.  

 

On a rubbish small screen just now, so can't really see your pics clearly to judge the loom condition.  

Edited 22 March, 2021 by Wino

[hackingjam]

They're badly lit pictures; will get some better ones tomorrow. I'm wondering if the hacked+melted mirror plug is why my mirror controls don't work, I assume since there's no plug on the motor then those controls aren't affected my mirror issues. I'm also wondering if its an issue with the door connectors. Will take the passenger side off tomorrow too and see if it's a 6Q or 6Y, if there's a mismatch then hopefully that's the issue, just got to achieve the impossible task of finding a vrs being broken south of london...

[sepulchrave]

1 hour ago, hackingjam said:

...just got to achieve the impossible task of finding a vrs being broken south of london...

 

A VRS is just a Fabia, they all share common components.

[hackingjam]

16 minutes ago, sepulchrave said:

 

A VRS is just a Fabia, they all share common components.

True but would have to find a model with power windows and heated mirrors to swap to as well as making sure the door functions work. Do the paint codes match between models?

[TMB]

[TMB]

Are you sure those connectors are melted because it looks like someone has slapped some kind of black goo on them? I'd never expect to see those particular connectors melted.

[sepulchrave]

8 hours ago, hackingjam said:

True but would have to find a model with power windows and heated mirrors to swap to as well as making sure the door functions work. Do the paint codes match between models?

 

Both mine had power windows and heated mirrors fitted as standard and neither are VRS, it's just down to trim spec.

VRS colours are not unique, a VRS is just a Fabia with a PD130 and  6 speed box.

[hackingjam]

 

 

Passenger motor is 6Q. I think this could be the issue!

[hackingjam]

Looks like its had a new regulator too, it's still riveted in though, main dealer?

[Breezy_Pete]

I'm struggling to read the date code on the motor, but I think it says 2002?

No, it's March 04, right? 21st or 31st of.  So predates the car.

 

Does the wiring look hacked around?

Edited 23 March, 2021 by Wino

[hackingjam]

I think I may have used up all my alotted bandwidth 

 

https://imgur.com/a/z31Xn4C

 

All looks fine apart from the black tape 

[Breezy_Pete]

Confusing stuff. Maybe that side is the right window motor on a new regulator panel, and it's the driver's side motor that's mismatched and so has the cobbled-together wiring?

Don't suppose you know the exact date the car was built? (Wondering if it's before the date of the driver's side module)

[hackingjam]

I'm assuming it was built with a 6Q motor (with a new reg at some point) and the new drivers door is off a later 6Y model, hence my problems.

I'm not sure the exact build date, I've put my boot sticker in that imgur album, can you tell from that?

Edited 23 March, 2021 by hackingjam

[Breezy_Pete]

10th digit looks like a 4, so a model year 2004 car, which means built before late May 2004, I think.

Edited 23 March, 2021 by Wino

[hackingjam]

Bump...

After some struggling with scrapyards being open, new jobs etc, I found myself a silver door with the correct motor and loom...

And it works! The panel lights up, lock and unlock buttons work, and both windows go down and up. Happy endings all round. The mirror controls don't seem to work but I'm not fussed, I shall use my god given hands to move them 

[Breezy_Pete]

@hackingjam if you've ended up with a 6Yxxxxxxx window motor spare, don't bin it, they fetch decent money if working.